I need to make a decision like right now and I need somebody to make me confident in

Hey!

I need your help literally very soon, I have to make my decision in the next few days.
So my goal is to become a doctor, though I won't be able to study medicine directly in the UK or Germany (the country I come from). I already have some offers:

1) USA, Southern Utah University. Total Cost of Attendance would be about 16,000$/yr with the scholarship I received. Very flexible as I'd have two years to declare my final major and still have the pre-medical requirements making it possible to enter graduate medicine with almost any course. On the one side I always wanted to study in the US and I'd be very happy with that choice though and I would feel much more comfortable and confident if I chose this rather than anything else. On the other side I don't know whether or not I'd still receive enough loans after the undergrad degree so it seems like a foolish idea, too. So I need somebody to make me condident about that regardless of the decision.

2) Scotland, Abertay University. Tuition is free and I'd receive state grants and loans for living cost too. Course is biomedical science and I'd have to go to the UK or Ireland for graduate medicine after 4 years, too. I think I'd be okay with that choice, but I'd love to do 1) much more.

3) Poland-didn't apply yet. They have 6 year (+1 year internship) medical programs in English language which are (at least formally) recognized in almost any country. Total CoA would be about 18,000$/year after grants. I am not sure about that option and I wouls clearly prefer to be in the UK or US, but clearly it would be the smartest in terms of length and cost.Also, by August I'm gonna have 700+ hours of community service in a hospital.

Thanks for reading, your comments are very appreciated.

Hey!

I need your help literally very soon, I have to make my decision in the next few days.
So my goal is to become a doctor, though I won't be able to study medicine directly in the UK or Germany (the country I come from). I already have some offers:

1) USA, Southern Utah University. Total Cost of Attendance would be about 16,000$/yr with the scholarship I received. Very flexible as I'd have two years to declare my final major and still have the pre-medical requirements making it possible to enter graduate medicine with almost any course. On the one side I always wanted to study in the US and I'd be very happy with that choice though and I would feel much more comfortable and confident if I chose this rather than anything else. On the other side I don't know whether or not I'd still receive enough loans after the undergrad degree so it seems like a foolish idea, too. So I need somebody to make me condident about that regardless of the decision.

2) Scotland, Abertay University. Tuition is free and I'd receive state grants and loans for living cost too. Course is biomedical science and I'd have to go to the UK or Ireland for graduate medicine after 4 years, too. I think I'd be okay with that choice, but I'd love to do 1) much more.

3) Poland-didn't apply yet. They have 6 year (+1 year internship) medical programs in English language which are (at least formally) recognized in almost any country. Total CoA would be about 18,000$/year after grants. I am not sure about that option and I wouls clearly prefer to be in the UK or US, but clearly it would be the smartest in terms of length and cost.Also, by August I'm gonna have 700+ hours of community service in a hospital.

Thanks for reading, your comments are very appreciated.

It seems it would be reasonable to go with choice 1? I don't understand what's stopping you. Feel free to elaborate

There is a lot of competition for Graduate medicine in the UK so personally I wouldn't recommend you go down that path.

1) seems to me like a great oppurtunity, but if you're really worried about the cost then I recommend you calling the university ( more specifically the loans/finance sector if they have one) and checking to see whether you will be either fully covered or partially. Also ask if they have any bursaries specifically for medicine courses that you can apply for that will support your course.

Hey!

I need your help literally very soon, I have to make my decision in the next few days.
So my goal is to become a doctor, though I won't be able to study medicine directly in the UK or Germany (the country I come from). I already have some offers:

1) USA, Southern Utah University. Total Cost of Attendance would be about 16,000$/yr with the scholarship I received. Very flexible as I'd have two years to declare my final major and still have the pre-medical requirements making it possible to enter graduate medicine with almost any course. On the one side I always wanted to study in the US and I'd be very happy with that choice though and I would feel much more comfortable and confident if I chose this rather than anything else. On the other side I don't know whether or not I'd still receive enough loans after the undergrad degree so it seems like a foolish idea, too. So I need somebody to make me condident about that regardless of the decision.

2) Scotland, Abertay University. Tuition is free and I'd receive state grants and loans for living cost too. Course is biomedical science and I'd have to go to the UK or Ireland for graduate medicine after 4 years, too. I think I'd be okay with that choice, but I'd love to do 1) much more.

3) Poland-didn't apply yet. They have 6 year (+1 year internship) medical programs in English language which are (at least formally) recognized in almost any country. Total CoA would be about 18,000$/year after grants. I am not sure about that option and I wouls clearly prefer to be in the UK or US, but clearly it would be the smartest in terms of length and cost.Also, by August I'm gonna have 700+ hours of community service in a hospital.

Thanks for reading, your comments are very appreciated.

All three of the options you have mentioned here are risky...

1) Going to the USA would mean completing a 4 year pre-med course, with no guarantee of being accepted onto the incredibly competitive med 4 year courses after that. Not to mention fees for medical schools in the US are ridiculous, the MCAT is incredibly hard and requires a lot of studying to achieve a decent score for entry, and you will have to undergo lots of work experience, voluntary work and have a really clean academic record in the pre-med course to be competitive. I know a lot of US med hopefuls often consider the UK as there courses are so competitive. But I have to admit out of the three options it seems the most logical.

2) The idea behind most graduate entry medicine programmes is that if people change their mind after completing a degree and want to become doctors then this is a faster route for them. It is so so much more competative than undergrad medicine in the UK and would require a lot of hard work on your part, not to mention it is very very expensive.

4) This is never a good idea, the Polish medical schools have high kick out rates (not sure what the official term for that is) and often the degree is not recognised in other countries. You will also have to go through the pain of learning polish and paying very high tuition fees once again.

Can I ask why you are not going to try to gain access to medicine undergrad courses in the UK and Germany?

3) Poland-didn't apply yet. They have 6 year (+1 year internship) medical programs in English language which are (at least formally) recognized in almost any country. Total CoA would be about 18,000$/year after grants. I am not sure about that option and I wouls clearly prefer to be in the UK or US, but clearly it would be the smartest in terms of length and cost.Also, by August I'm gonna have 700+ hours of community service in a hospital.

All three of the options you have mentioned here are risky...

1) Going to the USA would mean completing a 4 year pre-med course, with no guarantee of being accepted onto the incredibly competitive med 4 year courses after that. Not to mention fees for medical schools in the US are ridiculous, the MCAT is incredibly hard and requires a lot of studying to achieve a decent score for entry, and you will have to undergo lots of work experience, voluntary work and have a really clean academic record in the pre-med course to be competitive. I know a lot of US med hopefuls often consider the UK as there courses are so competitive. But I have to admit out of the three options it seems the most logical.

2) The idea behind most graduate entry medicine programmes is that if people change their mind after completing a degree and want to become doctors then this is a faster route for them. It is so so much more competative than undergrad medicine in the UK and would require a lot of hard work on your part, not to mention it is very very expensive.

4) This is never a good idea, the Polish medical schools have high kick out rates (not sure what the official term for that is) and often the degree is not recognised in other countries. You will also have to go through the pain of learning polish and paying very high tuition fees once again.

Can I ask why you are not going to try to gain access to medicine undergrad courses in the UK and Germany?

Which country do you want to work in? If US. Don't go to uni anywhere else other than US. You'll have to do the USMLEs, smash them and you'll still be an IMG/FMG In your application depending on whether you're a citizen there. If you study there, you get put in the American students pools for the job application and you've got a solid shot at getting a decent speciality!

If you go to uni there's it's far easier! UK is your next best bet. Teaching is likely to be better than the European alternative you stated and unless you speak fluent polish, you'll struggle in years 3/4/5 on clinical attachment as all the teaching. HCPs and patients will be polish.

As a Pole I feel obliged to comment on this one. I was raised and pretty much lived me entire life in Warsaw (now studying in London) and have tons of friends doing medicine in Warsaw.

1. Yes, this option is by far cheaper that any other you listed. Flat on Warsaw will cost you at most 250 euro a month, probably even less. Other prices:

eating out: from 3 euro (a kebab/street food) to 10 euro (a restaurant), I usually around 4 if you know where to go

alcohol: bottled beer is around 1 euro, excellent craft beer costs around 3-4 euro in pubs, 0.5l of liquor - 7 euro

cinema: 5.5 for a ticket

public transport: with a 50% student discount its 13 euro for a monthly ticket, single fare is 50 cents, a cab is 5 - 10 euro.

Oh, and if you are German then I don't think you'll pay any tuition fees.

2. Workload: I believe you'll be working far more than on any UK university, at least comparing year 1 experiences. This is both bad and good. Yes, you do learn a lot, but much work is cause by lecturers not specifying what they expect you to know. You should be more confident with studying by yourself than expecting any help. You don't see Polish medics partying too much during the academic year (as opposed to those in the UK...).

3. Language: practically all young people, especially at uni are fluent in English, in general I don't think language will be a problem at least in Warsaw (or other major cities). Not sure how good university staff language skills are, I would advise you to talk to a student from the university you are applying to to make sure they manage. Polish language is tricky, but only the grammar. You'll learn to understand it quickly, but possible never to speak 100% grammatically correct.

4. Student life: now this is a bit tricky. As opposed to the US or UK, Polish unis have a different idea of student participation. There are unions, but their prime goal is to represent the student voice, they don't organise clubs and societies. There are clubs, but mainly to allow you to expand academically (e.g. learn programming artificial intelligence if you are doing computer science or engineering). PE is part of the curriculum, its rather elastic, so you can either participate in sth that the uni offers or be part of a professional club somewhere else. Frankly, at least from my perspective, it more like "uni is to study, you can organise leisure by yourself". Is that bad? Must sound horrible to any Brits reading this, its pretty obvious to us, though I haven't experienced it, so I don't know. I can add that Polish people (students especially) are really friendly, as a foreigner you'll be flooded with questions on every party

In general, I would say your experience could be very good or very bad and I can't really tell which one is more likely. I moved to London cause my course is awfully taught at Polish unis and I got into a really prestigious one in the UK, but that doesn't mean education in Poland is bad. I would say there are a few courses where you'll get decent education and I do believe medicine is one of them. Its gonna be tough, but you will be very knowledgable by the end of your diploma (oh, and this will be much sooner than in the US). I did consider medicine for some time and, unless I got into Oxbridge, I would likely stay in Warsaw. After uni you would probably prefer to move abroad, cause the healthcare system is such that you'd be underpaid for a while (sad but true, just being honest here). However, I guess you plan to do it anyway, so its not an issue.

Feel free to ask more questions or PM me

My grades are too low to be considered for undergraduate courses in medicine . The US would be the most expensive, but also the best choice. However it's nearly impossible for foreigners to go to a US med school after 4 years, they only admit 1% of international students.



However US med schools admit only 1% of foreigners so I would probably end up in the UK, Ireland or so. Poland has 4 years med schools, too. So as worst case scenario...


I know Poland is a cool country, but there will hardly be any time for much partying and stuff in Poland. I know it'harder there, especially during first year.

Okay, so you live in Germany, and want to study overseas (preferably the US), but where do you see yourself actually ending up after you qualify?

If you want to practice medicine in the US, then your best bet is to do your undergrad in the US, do med school in the US, and do your training in the US. You will take on a phenomenal amount of debt, hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars, and you are basically making a bet with yourself that you will make it past each incredibly competitive hurdle of MCAT, Step 1, match, etc. If your bet pays off, congratulations, but if you lose the bet (can't get enough student finance to complete your course, fail your exams, score poorly on the USMLE, have a physical illness or a mental health crisis) then you could very easily find yourself $200,000 in debt with no job and no hope of becoming a doctor.

Studying in Scotland would be another option, but you need to look at things with an eye to the future. We don't know if the four-year graduate medicine courses will be available in the future, let alone if you would be eligible for them (the 4-year courses are not open to international students). EU students are not eligible for any grants or loans to help with living costs. And you are probably risking having to pay international student fees of €25,000 a year for your second degree if you choose to study in the UK, as the UK will have left the EU by then. Grad medicine in Ireland is already €15,000 a year for Irish/EU students, and you would not have any access to loans to pay this. It's also worth pointing out that Abertay is not a very highly regarded university, particularly for biomedical science.

I can't really speak to studying medicine in Poland (another commentator has provided lots of information above), but although cost of living would be more affordable the fees are still very expensive ($100,000 for a six-year course).

You say that you didn't score well enough in your exams to apply for medicine in Germany or the UK. How do you think you will cope with the much more demanding academic requirements of a medicine degree? Being a doctor is a great goal, but it's definitely not worth ruining your life with debt for.

Couldn't you just do a BSc in something medicine related in the uk for £9000 a year then do grad medicine in the uk afterwards??


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I'd vote for Scotland... save your money and/or loan potential for medical school. If you plan carefully, you could graduate with a Scottish BSc and then apply to medical schools in the UK, US, and elsewhere in Europe. That would give you lots of opportunities to get into medical school and possibly to train as a doctor in the US after all.*