How to progress within the Civil Service?

You have to apply for a new job, you won't be promoted because that's not really a thing in the CS.

I don't have experience myself (yet), but I recommend checking out the reddit sub r/thecivilservice and reading up on some people's experiences there.

I see, that's what I thought. I wonder if there is ever any promotion. Quite strenuous to apply each time!

Thanks, I will definitely check it out

Yeah it causes quite a few issues because with no promotion/pay rises it creates a massive churn where people never really stay in the same area/team and so they lack experts, all because they have to apply for a promotion elsewhere to get a higher wage!

Yeah it causes quite a few issues because with no promotion/pay rises it creates a massive churn where people never really stay in the same area/team and so they lack experts, all because they have to apply for a promotion elsewhere to get a higher wage!

In the Civil Service, make sure you are moving every 2 years. Even if it's not a higher graded post, you should be moving laterally to another department at the same grade. That's how you get anywhere in the Civil Service. The worst possible thing you can do is be in a mid to low level grade working hard and doing your job well. If you do that, you will be in that same post in 20 years time and the people you mentored will be your manager's manager.

For example, say you are an EO HR advisor at the DWP. 18 months into that role, you should be actively looking for either an HEO role in any department, or a EO role somewhere other that where you are that is slightly different. So if there is a Contract Admin HR role at the Treasury at the same grade, then actively look to move there, and then make sure in another 18 months you are actively looking for any HEO role.

Nobody, literally nobody cares about loyalty and there are zero prizes for trying to do a good job. One of the most important things to remember is that for most roles, you are assessed on your ability to evidence your competencies - not your ability to do either the job you have or the job you want.

How quick and difficult is it to progress?

The civil service has pretty low churn/attrition. If there were high churn then it'd be easy for high performers experts to get promotion within their own team.

If you work in a department that has (until now) retained pay progression then you'd get a higher wage for staying in the same job. Personal experience of comparing departments with and without pay progression, I've not noticed much difference in terms of churn.

Could you explain a bit more about the bold part of your response please?
Have new jobs been given a flat rate scale?

When I first applied for an EO campaign, I was certain it was ranged from £28,117 to 30 something, then when I got an offer (while waiting on a reserve list) and accepted it, the paperwork came through saying it was £28,117 - £28,117. I assumed this was a typo.

Most departments removed pay progression (ie pay rises through through the pay band) from pay deals in the years following 2010.

Some, such as the Scottish and Welsh Governments retained pay progression. Perhaps others have, I've no catalogue of who did or didn't.

I've no idea about your example, but without pay progression as part of a pay deal then it's academic. Perhaps it was referring to national and London, but I'd have expected them to have been been stated separately. So perhaps it's a typo and worth clarifying. As I say though, potentially academic, unless you can convince a case to start on above the minimum of the band.

It's based in Scotland and I have seen other EO posts also within DWP that had the ranged salary. I will double check when I start the role.

Thanks for the reply.

Searching CS Jobs I was right.

There is a spot rate for EO, all the out of London roles advertise £28k, the only one mentioning £32k is the one also advertising for London.

https://www.civilservicejobs.service.gov.uk/csr/index.cgi?SID=cGFnZWFjdGlvbj1zZWFyY2hjb250ZXh0Jm93bmVydHlwZT1mYWlyJm93bmVyPTUwNzAwMDAmY29udGV4dGlkPTQyODk3MDk0JnBhZ2VjbGFzcz1TZWFyY2g=

So I wouldn't progress up the scale that blows, unless they made it a flat rate for all current and new employees, otherwise I'd always be paid less than current employees

It'll be a flat rate for everyone. (almost certain of that)

You've kinda identified why, when DWP got rid of progression through the band in 2010 (I was there) after a few years you ended up with someone with 3-4 years service being paid less than someone with 6-7 years in that grade, but they weren't necessarily any better at their job.

That does make sense in regards to fairness and equality, but if it was capped, say 3 levels in that band, starting level for year 1, then move up for year 2, then top of band for year 3 onwards, that way you have progression, reward for gaining more experience in the role, but capped to stop any massive differences.

It's not a deal breaker but just in my had it was a start at £28k but end up with the role being £32k just takes a bit of the appeal away.

I guess my goal now will be progression via higher grades, SEO or HEO in time

I suspect you wouldn't advocate your suggestion if the flat rate was the top of the three levels you suggest :-)

Doing a bit of googling, in 2016 DWP implemented an 'employee deal' which particularly affected lower graded staff. T&Cs were worsened (eg contratual Sturday and evening working) but in return salaries went up. Existing staff could opt out of the deal.

The effects on pay scales are below as of 2020:
https://www.parallelparliament.co.uk/question/53278/department-for-work-and-pensions-pay

Thank you all.. that is all very informative. I have been offered 2 positions as EO, and hope to progress along.
Should having an MA help me along in anyway, or will it end up being rather irrelevant in the end? It is interesting, I've noticed education doesn't seem to play that big a part?