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ACA not with a 'BIG 4' firm
I am 100% sure that I will do an ACA although not with one of the big 4 firms.
Few questions I needed to ask:
What are the disadvantages of not working in a big four company?
If I do relevant work expereince in an unknown firm over the summer, say for 8 weeks, could that be considered as an internship? Or does an internship differ?
I want to specialize in corporate finance during my career is there any other way other than through the ACA course? Although an ACA qualification is very attractive.
Thank you for your time.
Few questions I needed to ask:
What are the disadvantages of not working in a big four company?
If I do relevant work expereince in an unknown firm over the summer, say for 8 weeks, could that be considered as an internship? Or does an internship differ?
I want to specialize in corporate finance during my career is there any other way other than through the ACA course? Although an ACA qualification is very attractive.
Thank you for your time.
Outside the Big 4 or a complete unknown?
Disadvantages: exposure, the work you do is different by the nature of your client base (ie. less prep work done for you) and pay is less. At the very minimum that is the case. That said, outside the Big 4, I know Baker Tilly for example got a 100% pass mark on their graduate scheme for ACA.
And an internship is structured, with rotations etc. more like a long interview, whereas 8 weeks working is just that.
Disadvantages: exposure, the work you do is different by the nature of your client base (ie. less prep work done for you) and pay is less. At the very minimum that is the case. That said, outside the Big 4, I know Baker Tilly for example got a 100% pass mark on their graduate scheme for ACA.
And an internship is structured, with rotations etc. more like a long interview, whereas 8 weeks working is just that.
Key disadvantage of 'outside the Big4' beancounters? Some follow-on proffessions pretty much state it as a prerequisit!
common ways into CF - go to an IB straight off the at.
- get in via law.
- get in as an accountant.
Big-4 ACAs do end up in banks doing CF - and doing CF within the big4 CF branches too.
However, if you want to do CF, you need to go to a Big4 (maybe with the next 2 or 3 down as well). The GT/TB/HY/BDOs also do CF, but not really at the same level, in either size, presteige or quantity. To do CF, i would really not recommend going below the Big4. Though I'm sure plenty have and done well...i wouldn't choose to.
Personally, if I was starting again (hell, i only started 2 months ago!!!), I'd join on a Transactions Services ACA prog with the Big4. That way you get an ACA (a lot to be said for that), get into TS (really growing and fat bonuses)...which is just a short and convenient hop into CF.
You don't need an internship for the Big4. Don't waste one of your very last long summers.
common ways into CF - go to an IB straight off the at.
- get in via law.
- get in as an accountant.
Big-4 ACAs do end up in banks doing CF - and doing CF within the big4 CF branches too.
However, if you want to do CF, you need to go to a Big4 (maybe with the next 2 or 3 down as well). The GT/TB/HY/BDOs also do CF, but not really at the same level, in either size, presteige or quantity. To do CF, i would really not recommend going below the Big4. Though I'm sure plenty have and done well...i wouldn't choose to.
Personally, if I was starting again (hell, i only started 2 months ago!!!), I'd join on a Transactions Services ACA prog with the Big4. That way you get an ACA (a lot to be said for that), get into TS (really growing and fat bonuses)...which is just a short and convenient hop into CF.
You don't need an internship for the Big4. Don't waste one of your very last long summers.
brabzzz
GT/TB/HY/BDOs
HY? TB?
Beancounters? Like it
The problem is I cant get into the big 4 because I don't either meet 300 ucas points (I have 290) or have a B grade in GCSE maths.
So more or less I am limited with options, below is a shortlist of firms I meet the requirements.
Tenon
Vantis
Mazers
Hains Watts
Bentley Jennison
menzies
macintyrehudson
cooperparry
armstrongwatson
So I have no choice but to apply to the firms mentioned above. Do an ACA with them and then go into cf.
So more or less I am limited with options, below is a shortlist of firms I meet the requirements.
Tenon
Vantis
Mazers
Hains Watts
Bentley Jennison
menzies
macintyrehudson
cooperparry
armstrongwatson
So I have no choice but to apply to the firms mentioned above. Do an ACA with them and then go into cf.
brabzzz
Key disadvantage of 'outside the Big4' beancounters? Some follow-on proffessions pretty much state it as a prerequisit!
common ways into CF - go to an IB straight off the at.
- get in via law.
- get in as an accountant.
Big-4 ACAs do end up in banks doing CF - and doing CF within the big4 CF branches too.
However, if you want to do CF, you need to go to a Big4 (maybe with the next 2 or 3 down as well). The GT/TB/HY/BDOs also do CF, but not really at the same level, in either size, presteige or quantity. To do CF, i would really not recommend going below the Big4. Though I'm sure plenty have and done well...i wouldn't choose to.
Personally, if I was starting again (hell, i only started 2 months ago!!!), I'd join on a Transactions Services ACA prog with the Big4. That way you get an ACA (a lot to be said for that), get into TS (really growing and fat bonuses)...which is just a short and convenient hop into CF.
You don't need an internship for the Big4. Don't waste one of your very last long summers.
common ways into CF - go to an IB straight off the at.
- get in via law.
- get in as an accountant.
Big-4 ACAs do end up in banks doing CF - and doing CF within the big4 CF branches too.
However, if you want to do CF, you need to go to a Big4 (maybe with the next 2 or 3 down as well). The GT/TB/HY/BDOs also do CF, but not really at the same level, in either size, presteige or quantity. To do CF, i would really not recommend going below the Big4. Though I'm sure plenty have and done well...i wouldn't choose to.
Personally, if I was starting again (hell, i only started 2 months ago!!!), I'd join on a Transactions Services ACA prog with the Big4. That way you get an ACA (a lot to be said for that), get into TS (really growing and fat bonuses)...which is just a short and convenient hop into CF.
You don't need an internship for the Big4. Don't waste one of your very last long summers.
Though I suspect initial applications are filtered automatically, ring them and beg/plead etc. They're almost always short of people for audit (and tax)...and they're planning on recruiting hundreds of people more than last year.
It's hardly a disaster though. An ACA is an ACA. After that you'll have a lot of opportunities (including CF, though maybe CF will no longer lok attractive then - a lot of things can change in 3 years!).
It's hardly a disaster though. An ACA is an ACA. After that you'll have a lot of opportunities (including CF, though maybe CF will no longer lok attractive then - a lot of things can change in 3 years!).
brabzzz
ring them and beg/plead etc.
There are better ways to get shortlisted past the application form stage... notably, the backdoor ass kissing and networking route.
I'd much much rather pick one of the 'big 4-10' than kiss up the big4 for a grad audit place!
I'm also not entirely convinced the kissing up approach would work with such a massive firm for such a generic graduate scheme. Getting into charities divisions of banks is networkable (lol, with the right name) as they normally don't recruit at all. As are some hardcore jobs as they've a very individual and hands on recruitment process. Getting into a big machine like a big4 through a back door is harder - simply because everyhting is homogenised, computerised, automated and a massive segregation of duties. HR do HR, all apps go through them - senior ppl only get involved in the final stages..not the initial ones. More to the point, I think they insist on a web-app to initialte the process, and I'd be surprised if they were not auto-filtered on the basic criteria. Could be wrong though.
I've yet to meet/hear of anyone that asskissed their way to a grad job. Unless daddy was a banker there (okay, i've heard of one then - but thats 'family' as opposed to proper networking/asskissing). I think that kind of thing becomes important/crucial further into ones career, not at the start.
I'm also not entirely convinced the kissing up approach would work with such a massive firm for such a generic graduate scheme. Getting into charities divisions of banks is networkable (lol, with the right name) as they normally don't recruit at all. As are some hardcore jobs as they've a very individual and hands on recruitment process. Getting into a big machine like a big4 through a back door is harder - simply because everyhting is homogenised, computerised, automated and a massive segregation of duties. HR do HR, all apps go through them - senior ppl only get involved in the final stages..not the initial ones. More to the point, I think they insist on a web-app to initialte the process, and I'd be surprised if they were not auto-filtered on the basic criteria. Could be wrong though.
I've yet to meet/hear of anyone that asskissed their way to a grad job. Unless daddy was a banker there (okay, i've heard of one then - but thats 'family' as opposed to proper networking/asskissing). I think that kind of thing becomes important/crucial further into ones career, not at the start.
brabzzz
I'd much much rather pick one of the 'big 4-10' than kiss up the big4 for a grad audit place!
I'm also not entirely convinced the kissing up approach would work with such a massive firm for such a generic graduate scheme. Getting into charities divisions of banks is networkable (lol, with the right name) as they normally don't recruit at all. As are some hardcore jobs as they've a very individual and hands on recruitment process. Getting into a big machine like a big4 through a back door is harder - simply because everyhting is homogenised, computerised, automated and a massive segregation of duties. HR do HR, all apps go through them - senior ppl only get involved in the final stages..not the initial ones. More to the point, I think they insist on a web-app to initialte the process, and I'd be surprised if they were not auto-filtered on the basic criteria. Could be wrong though.
I've yet to meet/hear of anyone that asskissed their way to a grad job. Unless daddy was a banker there (okay, i've heard of one then - but thats 'family' as opposed to proper networking/asskissing). I think that kind of thing becomes important/crucial further into ones career, not at the start.
I'm also not entirely convinced the kissing up approach would work with such a massive firm for such a generic graduate scheme. Getting into charities divisions of banks is networkable (lol, with the right name) as they normally don't recruit at all. As are some hardcore jobs as they've a very individual and hands on recruitment process. Getting into a big machine like a big4 through a back door is harder - simply because everyhting is homogenised, computerised, automated and a massive segregation of duties. HR do HR, all apps go through them - senior ppl only get involved in the final stages..not the initial ones. More to the point, I think they insist on a web-app to initialte the process, and I'd be surprised if they were not auto-filtered on the basic criteria. Could be wrong though.
I've yet to meet/hear of anyone that asskissed their way to a grad job. Unless daddy was a banker there (okay, i've heard of one then - but thats 'family' as opposed to proper networking/asskissing). I think that kind of thing becomes important/crucial further into ones career, not at the start.
I know a few people who are definite for interview by virtue of brown nosing... they may filter on basic criteria but they can also pull people into the next round for other reasons with another filter.
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