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'I don't need feminism because...'
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Original post by DiddyDec
So you are saying that feminism is only for women?
No, it's ABOUT women. A straight person can be part of the equal rights for LBGT people movement for example, even if it's not about them. Hope that makes sense.
yes we do
Original post by tupper_ware
A lot of those reasons are pretty bad...
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
TL;DR most women in non-western countries really do need feminism/womens rights campaigns
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
TL;DR most women in non-western countries really do need feminism/womens rights campaigns
Yes, yes, yes! Couldn't have put it better
I don't need feminism because I don't believe we can create a fairer and more equal society by focusing solely on the issues of half the population.
Original post by tupper_ware
No, it's ABOUT women. A straight person can be part of the equal rights for LBGT people movement for example, even if it's not about them. Hope that makes sense.
What legal rights do men have that women do not in the UK?
Original post by DiddyDec
What legal rights do men have that women do not in the UK?
None; I don't think anyone disputes this? Feminism has achieved a lot in the century or so it's been fighting for women's rights here in the west, especially in the UK. Once again the definition of feminism is political, economic, and social equality.
In the UK I think women do have political equality, we're protected by exactly the same laws as men and legally must be treated the same.
Economically in the UK the wage gap still sometimes exists but it's small and ever improving, I don't see it as something that needs much work now, as we're protected by the same political rights, our economic rights have been ever increasing.
Socially is the only area that really needs improving - there are a lot of small social inequalities women face; like the significantly higher chance of being raped than men, and domestic abuse. As well as smaller things like cat-calling and being shamed for sleeping around more than men.
However outside the west, and even in other western countries women are not so fortunate as we are.
We raise girls to see each other as competitors
Not for jobs or for accomplishments
Which I think can be a good thing
But for the attention of men
We teach girls that they cannot be sexual beings
In the way that boys are
Feminist: the person who believes in the social
Political, and economic equality of the sexes
Not for jobs or for accomplishments
Which I think can be a good thing
But for the attention of men
We teach girls that they cannot be sexual beings
In the way that boys are
Feminist: the person who believes in the social
Political, and economic equality of the sexes
Just double checking.
Oh yeah, and a lot of 'I don't need feminism because...' signs are photoshopped. Feel free to keep posting them but take them with a grain of salt as many will have been edited. :/
Original post by tupper_ware
Imo no feminism doesn't care about men's issues because it isn't about men's issues, it's a movement about women's issues. You can of course believe in feminism and still accept men have issues.
One of the principal flaws of the movement. You call me selfish for not subscribing to the political movement you do, and then openly admit to supporting it despite its categorical exclusion of male issues.
Original post by tupper_ware
A lot of those reasons are pretty bad...
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
It's the height of arrogance to accuse men and women of being 'selfish' for not sharing your view of how best to combat social issues like this. People who actively oppose feminism don't do so because they 'can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere', that's an outrageous thing to say and I don't think you even believe it yourself. They do so because they understand that feminism does not have a monopoly on creating a fairer society or eliminating horrors like FGM and acid attacks, and they believe that feminism is a fundamentally flawed, toxic movement that would ultimately be damaging to these countries as they believe it is already damaging ours.
I personally don't need feminism anymore because I am not oppressed and my denial of oppression is not evidence that I'm 'so oppressed that I can't even see it'. I generally feel that I'm not discriminated against, have the same opportunities as men etc. I could probably think of a couple of examples where sexism occurs in my life that I notice, but this does not make me need feminism. Sure, women get wolf whistled at in the street and men don't. Does this have an effect on my life? Nope not really.
I add the anymore because I did need feminism. When women didn't have the vote, I needed feminism. I do not disregard or brush it aside at all and I understand the first wave movement's importance in my life today; and I am thankful.
I add the anymore because I did need feminism. When women didn't have the vote, I needed feminism. I do not disregard or brush it aside at all and I understand the first wave movement's importance in my life today; and I am thankful.
Congrats to those women in the photos who evidently have no clue what feminism is.
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Original post by tupper_ware
Oh yeah, and a lot of 'I don't need feminism because...' signs are photoshopped. Feel free to keep posting them but take them with a grain of salt as many will have been edited. :/
Wait... The meerkat image is photoshopped???
... What a catch.
In all seriousness, why do you complain that people in the West don't need feminism? All your quarrels are with cultures from around the world, not the West. WE don't need it.
Original post by Birkenhead
One of the principal flaws of the movement. You call me selfish for not subscribing to the political movement you do, and then openly admit to supporting it despite its categorical exclusion of male issues.
It's the height of arrogance to accuse men and women of being 'selfish' for not sharing your view of how best to combat social issues like this. People who actively oppose feminism don't do so because they 'can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere', that's an outrageous thing to say and I don't think you even believe it yourself. They do so because they understand that feminism does not have a monopoly on creating a fairer society or eliminating horrors like FGM and acid attacks, and they believe that feminism is a fundamentally flawed, toxic movement that would ultimately be damaging to these countries as they believe it is already damaging ours.
It's the height of arrogance to accuse men and women of being 'selfish' for not sharing your view of how best to combat social issues like this. People who actively oppose feminism don't do so because they 'can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere', that's an outrageous thing to say and I don't think you even believe it yourself. They do so because they understand that feminism does not have a monopoly on creating a fairer society or eliminating horrors like FGM and acid attacks, and they believe that feminism is a fundamentally flawed, toxic movement that would ultimately be damaging to these countries as they believe it is already damaging ours.
I really don't think this is why. Sure in some cases people may believe this, but most are only thinking of their small world. Statements like 'I don't need feminism because I have all the rights I need!' are common. Not all people are thinking so hard about the fundamentals and consequences of movements.
Original post by tupper_ware
Oh yeah, and a lot of 'I don't need feminism because...' signs are photoshopped. Feel free to keep posting them but take them with a grain of salt as many will have been edited. :/
Your evidence for this? Or does it just unnerve you that many women oppose feminism on sound, rational bases?
Stop trying to sabotage this thread as a space for anti-feminist discussion; feminists have quite enough of their own threads already.
Original post by tupper_ware
None; I don't think anyone disputes this? Feminism has achieved a lot in the century or so it's been fighting for women's rights here in the west, especially in the UK. Once again the definition of feminism is political, economic, and social equality.
In the UK I think women do have political equality, we're protected by exactly the same laws as men and legally must be treated the same.
Economically in the UK the wage gap still sometimes exists but it's small and ever improving, I don't see it as something that needs much work now, as we're protected by the same political rights, our economic rights have been ever increasing.
Socially is the only area that really needs improving - there are a lot of small social inequalities women face; like the significantly higher chance of being raped than men, and domestic abuse. As well as smaller things like cat-calling and being shamed for sleeping around more than men.
However outside the west, and even in other western countries women are not so fortunate as we are.
In the UK I think women do have political equality, we're protected by exactly the same laws as men and legally must be treated the same.
Economically in the UK the wage gap still sometimes exists but it's small and ever improving, I don't see it as something that needs much work now, as we're protected by the same political rights, our economic rights have been ever increasing.
Socially is the only area that really needs improving - there are a lot of small social inequalities women face; like the significantly higher chance of being raped than men, and domestic abuse. As well as smaller things like cat-calling and being shamed for sleeping around more than men.
However outside the west, and even in other western countries women are not so fortunate as we are.
That is the most logical response to that question I have ever heard. Well done.
Although that is a silly statement. Considering that only men can commit rape that gives us a pretty unfair basis on which to start. Then we have to look that most men are straight about 99% in fact. So naturally from that you would see that most rapes happen to women.
Original post by Birkenhead
Your evidence for this? Or does it just unnerve you that many women oppose feminism on sound, rational bases?
Stop trying to sabotage this thread as a space for anti-feminist discussion; feminists have quite enough of their own threads already.
Stop trying to sabotage this thread as a space for anti-feminist discussion; feminists have quite enough of their own threads already.
It's been proven many times by women who've written the signs, angry that their original images have been photoshopped, or others on the internet have found the originals.
There was a massive post a while back with dozens of examples of popular anti-feminist signs that were photoshopped images, if I see it again I'll be sure to post.
Original post by tupper_ware
A lot of those reasons are pretty bad...
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
TL;DR most women in non-western countries really do need feminism/womens rights campaigns
The 'I don't need feminism movement' mostly annoys me because it's all white western women saying THEY don't need feminism. Sure, but what about the women in other countries who are being raped, sold, married off, mutilated and having acid thrown in their faces for not being virgins? All of us have it pretty good in the west, but not being part of a movement because you can't be arsed to think about people elsewhere seems selfish. A movement doesn't have to be about you for you to support it.
TL;DR most women in non-western countries really do need feminism/womens rights campaigns
I think this movement is largely directed towards western feminism, ie the feminists that actually get a media voice these days. I doubt any of these women posting will not want to stand up for women's rights in other countries where they genuinely lack equal rights - though ironically 'western feminists' don't really seem to care about these issues.
Original post by miscounted_time
Congrats to those women in the photos who evidently have no clue what feminism is.
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The movement is what it's followers and supporters make it.
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