Can't Find a Graduate Job
I'm currently a maths postgraduate student at a leading university in the UK, and have a first-class BSc in the same subject from a Russell Group university. I obtained my first degree just before the pandemic, and did some private tutoring straight afterwards, as I struggled to gain an internship during my studies or a graduate job. I thought it might help my prospects if I applied for a master's degree. I got onto one of the most prestigious programs in the country, but I've found that it hasn't helped at all when it comes to getting internships or interviews for graduate jobs. Since November, I've submitted over 500 applications for jobs in anything vaguely maths-based (data analyst, software, actuarial, accountancy...).
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
Original post by A Slice of Pi
Since November, I've submitted over 500 applications for jobs in anything vaguely maths-based (data analyst, software, actuarial, accountancy...).
This would mean you have made 2.4 applications per day (208 days since 1st Nov 2021) which is unrealistic and will almost certainly lead to burnout. Your CV's and cover letters are also unlikely to be tweaked well enough using this approach.
The bigger issue here though is that you are applying to jobs which cover too wide a range of industries. Software development is very different to accountancy, which is very different to data analysis etc. You need to figure out what it is you want to do and focus on applying for jobs in that industry (or related industry). Applying for "maths-based" jobs is not a good criteria when looking for jobs as most graduate jobs will have some element of maths and/or technical requirement.
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on.
Get your CV and cover letter looked at for free, anonymously on TSR. Make sure to remove personal details:
https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=339
Secondly, be wary of applying to jobs via Reed or Indeed or generic agencies such as TipTopJobs. It is fine to look for jobs through these boards, but you should aim to apply directly on the company website after finding something of interest. Otherwise you may be applying to roles which have already gone. Your university careers service should also have a jobs board which has regular jobs posted.
I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work.
It can be difficult finding work. You are very young. It is common for people your age to be unemployed for even several years. Do not worry about it (although it is easier said than done).
I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless.
It is not worthless if you enjoyed doing it. The job hunting process is just a completely different "game" to the "school" type of environment to which you are familiar.
I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do.
Do some volunteering work and get real-world experience if possible, maintaining websites, doing database or admin work etc. It will not only help with your CV but it will provide a useful distraction from job hunting which will benefit your mental health.
If you message people on LinkedIn, make sure it is to recruiters or managers and not just random employees who are unlikely to have any sway in who their employer is hiring.
I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
Depends who looks at it. But remember it is also your cover letter and the relevant skills which are useful for the role. I think the issue with your CV is likely that you are not matching the skills that you have well enough to the requirements of the job. So if the job requires data analysis, can you provide evidence that you analysed complex data, perhaps using industry standard tools or libraries? If the job requires accountancy, can you demonstrate any interest you have had in this area? Once you do that, you should at least start getting a greater number of interviews and from there, you can focus on building your interview technique.
(edited 1 year ago)
Original post by A Slice of Pi
I'm currently a maths postgraduate student at a leading university in the UK, and have a first-class BSc in the same subject from a Russell Group university. I obtained my first degree just before the pandemic, and did some private tutoring straight afterwards, as I struggled to gain an internship during my studies or a graduate job. I thought it might help my prospects if I applied for a master's degree. I got onto one of the most prestigious programs in the country, but I've found that it hasn't helped at all when it comes to getting internships or interviews for graduate jobs. Since November, I've submitted over 500 applications for jobs in anything vaguely maths-based (data analyst, software, actuarial, accountancy...).
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
Drop the whole prestiege and 90% marks thing. Doesn't matter when it comes to recruitment. (Un)fortunately, academic performance has very little to do with it.
Are you failing online tests in addition to CV screening? The careers you've mentioned all require an online test of sorts usually be it Leetcode/Hackerrank for data/engineering or psychometric assessments for accountancy. Lots of practice in these areas will help.
(edited 1 year ago)
Looking at it objectively your CV and cover letters aren't catching employers attention. Have you every had a job before, other than tutoring? Are you adapting each CV and cover letter to each job? Are you highlighting the key skills mentioned on the job advert and giving brief description of how you've developed/demonstrated those skills?
As has been said above, get someone here or from your career service to look at your CV and cover letter in relation to the job description. They can tell you if it matches well in addition to formatting etc.
The good thing to remember, although difficult, is that none of these rejections are a reflection on you as a person, it's just a reflection on the application to each job. Which you can improve. Yay!
As has been said above, get someone here or from your career service to look at your CV and cover letter in relation to the job description. They can tell you if it matches well in addition to formatting etc.
The good thing to remember, although difficult, is that none of these rejections are a reflection on you as a person, it's just a reflection on the application to each job. Which you can improve. Yay!
The reality is finally starting to kick in that your BSc at a prestigious university with +90% average is not getting noticed by the employers. You are correct to say that your degree without any work experience does not hold as much value as you believe it would. The reason for this is because there are plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books, but never worked a day in their life and they feel entitled to a well-paying job when in fact, they haven't developed any good skills that would make them employable. You're not the only person in this situation. I am also in the same boat. My degree is about as useless as a broken stick on the floor without any work experience.
Another thing that I wanted to say is that, it doesn't matter what university you go to. You can go to Cambridge or London Met, but if you haven't earned the required skills to make yourself employable then your degree is going to be almost worthless no matter where you go, because the employers are looking for experienced graduates. Even graduate schemes that state that they are not looking for work experience, would ideally want you to have work experience, because you need to acquire your skills from somewhere. You should go back to square one and re-evaluate your CV and your application. Have you carefully tailored the skills from the CV to the role that you've applied for? Because that's important. Don't just send one CV to 100 places. Your CV needs to be tailored for the job that you've applied for, which means that you may need to create 10 different CVs for 10 different jobs.
Also, don't get discouraged, because the job market is very very competitive. For some places, there could be as many as 200 people applying for a role and it would be nearly impossible to get through. You just need to keep trying and keep going. As long as you do the right thing and you persevere you're going to find something. Good luck!
Another thing that I wanted to say is that, it doesn't matter what university you go to. You can go to Cambridge or London Met, but if you haven't earned the required skills to make yourself employable then your degree is going to be almost worthless no matter where you go, because the employers are looking for experienced graduates. Even graduate schemes that state that they are not looking for work experience, would ideally want you to have work experience, because you need to acquire your skills from somewhere. You should go back to square one and re-evaluate your CV and your application. Have you carefully tailored the skills from the CV to the role that you've applied for? Because that's important. Don't just send one CV to 100 places. Your CV needs to be tailored for the job that you've applied for, which means that you may need to create 10 different CVs for 10 different jobs.
Also, don't get discouraged, because the job market is very very competitive. For some places, there could be as many as 200 people applying for a role and it would be nearly impossible to get through. You just need to keep trying and keep going. As long as you do the right thing and you persevere you're going to find something. Good luck!
(edited 1 year ago)
Original post by A Slice of Pi
I'm currently a maths postgraduate student at a leading university in the UK, and have a first-class BSc in the same subject from a Russell Group university. I obtained my first degree just before the pandemic, and did some private tutoring straight afterwards, as I struggled to gain an internship during my studies or a graduate job. I thought it might help my prospects if I applied for a master's degree. I got onto one of the most prestigious programs in the country, but I've found that it hasn't helped at all when it comes to getting internships or interviews for graduate jobs. Since November, I've submitted over 500 applications for jobs in anything vaguely maths-based (data analyst, software, actuarial, accountancy...).
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
However, I've only had 3 interviews and most of the time my CV is screened out at HR. I've asked for advice from my university careers service and my director of studies, but I'm still no further on. I'm 24 now, and my peers have no trouble finding work. For the first time I have no motivation to continue with my work. I've always tried to be the best at what I do (I got well over 90% in my undergrad), and I've never felt so demoralised. I never expected to find a job quickly, but without many interviews it's hard to demonstrate any kind of ability. I honestly feel like I've wasted years on this subject, when without any internships my qualifications are seen as worthless. I've tried everything: cold-calling, online applications, careers days, messaging on LinkedIn, offering to carry out unpaid internships just get some hands-on experience. Nothing I do seems to work. I'm completely out of ideas and don't know what to do. I thought that my CV must be the issue, but I've asked for feedback on it before and people say that it's fine. I'm completely baffled and would appreciate some friendly advice, perhaps from people in similar situations.
You are a highly valuable person in this market, but just currently don't have a market-ready skill. My experience is very similar to yours, and in my humble opinion I think I can see the main stumbling block. The stumbling block is that you're not really sure what you want to do. I imagine that, like I was, you are focused a lot on money (which you should be), but not focused enough on what are you interested in, or how can you contribute value to society. You need to specialise and develop a valuable, market-ready skill.
If society is going to reject maths graduates, and we know we have a lot to offer, then let's get together and do something about it.
I have sent you a private message. I'd be interested in having a chat with you over the phone.
Original post by username5971572
The reality is finally starting to kick in that your BSc at a prestigious university with +90% average is not getting noticed by the employers. You are correct to say that your degree without any work experience does not hold as much value as you believe it would. The reason for this is because there are plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books, but never worked a day in their life and they feel entitled to a well-paying job when in fact, they haven't developed any good skills that would make them employable. You're not the only person in this situation. I am also in the same boat. My degree is about as useless as a broken stick on the floor without any work experience.
Another thing that I wanted to say is that, it doesn't matter what university you go to. You can go to Cambridge or London Met, but if you haven't earned the required skills to make yourself employable then your degree is going to be almost worthless no matter where you go, because the employers are looking for experienced graduates. Even graduate schemes that state that they are not looking for work experience, would ideally want you to have work experience, because you need to acquire your skills from somewhere. You should go back to square one and re-evaluate your CV and your application. Have you carefully tailored the skills from the CV to the role that you've applied for? Because that's important. Don't just send one CV to 100 places. Your CV needs to be tailored for the job that you've applied for, which means that you may need to create 10 different CVs for 10 different jobs.
Also, don't get discouraged, because the job market is very very competitive. For some places, there could be as many as 200 people applying for a role and it would be nearly impossible to get through. You just need to keep trying and keep going. As long as you do the right thing and you persevere you're going to find something. Good luck!
Another thing that I wanted to say is that, it doesn't matter what university you go to. You can go to Cambridge or London Met, but if you haven't earned the required skills to make yourself employable then your degree is going to be almost worthless no matter where you go, because the employers are looking for experienced graduates. Even graduate schemes that state that they are not looking for work experience, would ideally want you to have work experience, because you need to acquire your skills from somewhere. You should go back to square one and re-evaluate your CV and your application. Have you carefully tailored the skills from the CV to the role that you've applied for? Because that's important. Don't just send one CV to 100 places. Your CV needs to be tailored for the job that you've applied for, which means that you may need to create 10 different CVs for 10 different jobs.
Also, don't get discouraged, because the job market is very very competitive. For some places, there could be as many as 200 people applying for a role and it would be nearly impossible to get through. You just need to keep trying and keep going. As long as you do the right thing and you persevere you're going to find something. Good luck!
You are correct about the CV and job stuff, an area you have experience with, but you are completely incorrect about the areas you don't have experience with (such as obtaining a STEM degree from a prestigious university). This doesn't surprise me, as often we are more knowledgeable in the areas we have experience in.
Firstly, yes, it does matter what university you go to. Each one has different entry requirements, yet they need to each attain similar pass rates for each grade. So what gives? Well obviously the content and the exams at more prestigious universities are more difficult, and require better understanding of the subject. One person I met during an interview had a maths degree, but it was from a very bad university. They couldn't do basic percentage calculations on the test. Go figure.
Second, his degree is valuable, just not in the eyes of employers who want immediate results. Sure, there are "plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books", but there are certainly NOT plenty of graduates that can obtain a first in maths from a Russel Group university. This doesn't just require "reading books". It's very obvious to me that you yourself don't have a maths degree from a prestigious university, or else you'd understand that it takes more than just reading books to obtain such a degree.
This guy's main issue is that he doesn't have market-ready skills, and doesn't know exactly what he wants to do. As soon as he specialises in a skill, I have no doubt he will excel at that skill far better than someone with a maths degree from a university that isn't prestigious, or someone with a non-STEM degree.
Original post by DavidJES
Second, his degree is valuable, just not in the eyes of employers who want immediate results. Sure, there are "plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books", but there are certainly NOT plenty of graduates that can obtain a first in maths from a Russel Group university. This doesn't just require "reading books". It's very obvious to me that you yourself don't have a maths degree from a prestigious university, or else you'd understand that it takes more than just reading books to obtain such a degree.
Second, his degree is valuable, just not in the eyes of employers who want immediate results. Sure, there are "plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books", but there are certainly NOT plenty of graduates that can obtain a first in maths from a Russel Group university. This doesn't just require "reading books". It's very obvious to me that you yourself don't have a maths degree from a prestigious university, or else you'd understand that it takes more than just reading books to obtain such a degree.
This is very true.
It is so frustrating reading your OP as you are clearly academically bright but clueless when it comes to selling yourself to a potential employer. You might be at a top Uni but the careers support service stinks.
Anyhow, here’s some information from the other side of the fence that you may find interesting: -
We add a job to our software, it pushes it out to numerous job boards, Reed, Total Jobs, Monster etc etc. The job can end up on Indeed as it gets scrapped from other sites or ends up in a feed to them.
Next the candidate sees the job and applies, our ATS software parses all the CVs straight into the system along with the cover letter. It de-duplicates and I will see a number next to the candidate telling me the same candidate applied on CV Library, Reed wherever. It also tells me If the same candidate applied for another of our graduate vacancies or positions.
It also tells me all the qualifications held and any work experience. Now I may have added some additional specific filter questions to my job when it was added but if not, my software auto scores all the applications anyhow. All applicant’s get a nice reply telling you we are looking at your application but in reality, I don’t know you from Adam at this stage. Our reply looks authentic, but its computer generated.
At this point I am now looking to filter my list down, honestly one graduate CV looks like the next, I don’t need you to tell me about your university or 90% blah blah, I already know that. My software has flagged you as a First so I’m now comparing your application against others flagged as First or 2.1s sorry but you fall asleep viewing most of them.
I am looking for that differentiator, I want to see something that jumps out to say that candidate really wants to work here, they have a genuine interest in wanting to work for us and enthusiastic about that specific career path. I might then ask you for an aptitude or psychometric test or invite for the next level of filtering as part of the process. If the candidate has some work experience alongside their application in my field, I like that. I’m more likely to notice their application over yours. Now a lot of applicants will be auto filtered out, I could start off with two hundred applications for these roles.
@Username5971572 is absolutely spot on. You send a scatter gun generic CV and cover letter chances are I have given it 10 seconds and dragged it to the reject bin for a nicely worded auto rejection reply that’s if my auto scoring software hadn’t done it already.
So don’t do scatter gun. If you are going to apply for a post, put the effort in or don’t bother you’re wasting both of our time, personalise your application to my company. I want to know we are the company you want to join not my competitor. I want to know its this specific field that you are interested in, not looking for any old graduate vacancy.
If I were you, I would think long and hard about the area of work that interests you, rewrite your CV and cover letter with a bias to that field. You need to sell yourself. Your academia alone wont cut it.
Also, look for specialist recruiters in that sector and see if they will interview you and represent you. Some of our vacancies are open to recruiters. I might get that call “hey, LS, I know you wanted a grad XX, I have this guy in front of me, Pi, top guy has the academia etc really wants to get in on the ground level with you, he’s worth interviewing” that can trump a number of applications.
In all, it’s a tough time, nobody likes a quitter so get motivated and finish your course and focus on what counts. Make your applications going forward targeted and take the time. You will get there.
Good Luck
Anyhow, here’s some information from the other side of the fence that you may find interesting: -
We add a job to our software, it pushes it out to numerous job boards, Reed, Total Jobs, Monster etc etc. The job can end up on Indeed as it gets scrapped from other sites or ends up in a feed to them.
Next the candidate sees the job and applies, our ATS software parses all the CVs straight into the system along with the cover letter. It de-duplicates and I will see a number next to the candidate telling me the same candidate applied on CV Library, Reed wherever. It also tells me If the same candidate applied for another of our graduate vacancies or positions.
It also tells me all the qualifications held and any work experience. Now I may have added some additional specific filter questions to my job when it was added but if not, my software auto scores all the applications anyhow. All applicant’s get a nice reply telling you we are looking at your application but in reality, I don’t know you from Adam at this stage. Our reply looks authentic, but its computer generated.
At this point I am now looking to filter my list down, honestly one graduate CV looks like the next, I don’t need you to tell me about your university or 90% blah blah, I already know that. My software has flagged you as a First so I’m now comparing your application against others flagged as First or 2.1s sorry but you fall asleep viewing most of them.
I am looking for that differentiator, I want to see something that jumps out to say that candidate really wants to work here, they have a genuine interest in wanting to work for us and enthusiastic about that specific career path. I might then ask you for an aptitude or psychometric test or invite for the next level of filtering as part of the process. If the candidate has some work experience alongside their application in my field, I like that. I’m more likely to notice their application over yours. Now a lot of applicants will be auto filtered out, I could start off with two hundred applications for these roles.
@Username5971572 is absolutely spot on. You send a scatter gun generic CV and cover letter chances are I have given it 10 seconds and dragged it to the reject bin for a nicely worded auto rejection reply that’s if my auto scoring software hadn’t done it already.
So don’t do scatter gun. If you are going to apply for a post, put the effort in or don’t bother you’re wasting both of our time, personalise your application to my company. I want to know we are the company you want to join not my competitor. I want to know its this specific field that you are interested in, not looking for any old graduate vacancy.
If I were you, I would think long and hard about the area of work that interests you, rewrite your CV and cover letter with a bias to that field. You need to sell yourself. Your academia alone wont cut it.
Also, look for specialist recruiters in that sector and see if they will interview you and represent you. Some of our vacancies are open to recruiters. I might get that call “hey, LS, I know you wanted a grad XX, I have this guy in front of me, Pi, top guy has the academia etc really wants to get in on the ground level with you, he’s worth interviewing” that can trump a number of applications.
In all, it’s a tough time, nobody likes a quitter so get motivated and finish your course and focus on what counts. Make your applications going forward targeted and take the time. You will get there.
Good Luck
(edited 1 year ago)
Original post by DavidJES
You are correct about the CV and job stuff, an area you have experience with, but you are completely incorrect about the areas you don't have experience with (such as obtaining a STEM degree from a prestigious university). This doesn't surprise me, as often we are more knowledgeable in the areas we have experience in.
Firstly, yes, it does matter what university you go to. Each one has different entry requirements, yet they need to each attain similar pass rates for each grade. So what gives? Well obviously the content and the exams at more prestigious universities are more difficult, and require better understanding of the subject. One person I met during an interview had a maths degree, but it was from a very bad university. They couldn't do basic percentage calculations on the test. Go figure.
Second, his degree is valuable, just not in the eyes of employers who want immediate results. Sure, there are "plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books", but there are certainly NOT plenty of graduates that can obtain a first in maths from a Russel Group university. This doesn't just require "reading books". It's very obvious to me that you yourself don't have a maths degree from a prestigious university, or else you'd understand that it takes more than just reading books to obtain such a degree.
This guy's main issue is that he doesn't have market-ready skills, and doesn't know exactly what he wants to do. As soon as he specialises in a skill, I have no doubt he will excel at that skill far better than someone with a maths degree from a university that isn't prestigious, or someone with a non-STEM degree.
Firstly, yes, it does matter what university you go to. Each one has different entry requirements, yet they need to each attain similar pass rates for each grade. So what gives? Well obviously the content and the exams at more prestigious universities are more difficult, and require better understanding of the subject. One person I met during an interview had a maths degree, but it was from a very bad university. They couldn't do basic percentage calculations on the test. Go figure.
Second, his degree is valuable, just not in the eyes of employers who want immediate results. Sure, there are "plenty of graduates who know how to pass an exam and read books", but there are certainly NOT plenty of graduates that can obtain a first in maths from a Russel Group university. This doesn't just require "reading books". It's very obvious to me that you yourself don't have a maths degree from a prestigious university, or else you'd understand that it takes more than just reading books to obtain such a degree.
This guy's main issue is that he doesn't have market-ready skills, and doesn't know exactly what he wants to do. As soon as he specialises in a skill, I have no doubt he will excel at that skill far better than someone with a maths degree from a university that isn't prestigious, or someone with a non-STEM degree.
Yes I do. Not in maths but engineering, so I do have experience and this is the reality. I got over 70% in an optional maths module and I did nothing but read lecture notes and do some exam practice papers. It is all the same. You memorise some rules and learn how to apply them to the same style of questions. There is nothing difficult about it. It just requires some effort to pick up a textbook or lecture notes or whatever. Engineering is a bit harder though because you have to understand physics as well as maths, but it is still all the same.
I am sorry, but do you really think that employers give a sh*t about your prestige and your university? They don't. When I graduated from uni, I have applied to lots of graduate jobs. Not a single graduate job stated that they wanted a 1st class genius from top 5 university or whatever. Every job, I applied for, had the same requirements. A 2:1 degree and experience, experience and more experience and a long list of skills you need to have. As you have said, someone from a lower ranked uni could have less ability but that doesn't mean that their application can't be just as competitive as someone who went to a better uni according to the league tables. Let's say that you have two graduates. One graduate is from lower ranked uni and they have 3 years of relevant work experience and they have been involved in societies at uni and then you have another graduate who is from Cambridge and has no work experience and they have no skills because they sat in their room for 3 years reading books. Who are you gonna choose? You're gonna choose the person from lower ranked uni of course because they worked hard to make themselves employable rather than just focusing on reading books and passing an exam.
Nobody said that his degree is worthless, but it doesn't have nearly as much importance as he thinks. It is time to become humble and stop obsessing so much about prestige and grades and all of that because really it doesn't have that much importance. Especially since you have thousands of other graduates who are also getting 2:1s and firsts. You need to have a serious set of skills, good attitude and have something that will make you stand out.
(edited 1 year ago)
Unfortunately because every university wants to bring in as many students as possible now that we have turned into customers, it has become increasingly hard for the intelligent to distinguish themselves from the dumb. These universities will even use how many of their students achieve firsts and so on as a selling point as they decrease the difficulty of their courses.
Interviewers are generally clueless as well, as to them the more confident you come across or the more well spoken you are the more qualified you seem. It doesn't even matter if the applicant couldn't write binary search without their brain getting fried, they get hired for a software development position anyway. As for many people in these forums, they celebrate mediocrity so they will never see a fault of the current system as the quality of our services and products drop and we continue down the path of being a has-been nation.
Interviewers are generally clueless as well, as to them the more confident you come across or the more well spoken you are the more qualified you seem. It doesn't even matter if the applicant couldn't write binary search without their brain getting fried, they get hired for a software development position anyway. As for many people in these forums, they celebrate mediocrity so they will never see a fault of the current system as the quality of our services and products drop and we continue down the path of being a has-been nation.
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