Why is being a feminist considered to be so bad?
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Original post by DiddyDec
Go read again what I said. It is women's rights movement not an equal rights movement.
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It's a women's rights movement to gain equality.
We are literally just going in circles now...
Original post by cookiemonster15
It's a women's rights movement to gain equality.
We are literally just going in circles now...
We are literally just going in circles now...
It is to gain equality, for women. That means raising the standards where women are missing out. Not raising the standards where men are missing out
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Original post by DiddyDec
It is to gain equality, for women. That means raising the standards where women are missing out. Not raising the standards where men are missing out
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The whole point of setting up the movement was because womens right were not equal to those of men.
People recognise that a lot of the feminists talking points are bull.
It gets more attention than it deserves.
It it in opposition to true gender parity because it's based on the false assumption that females are disadvantaged. As a result, it does nothing for men's issues as they're assumed to be privileged.
That's the same as saying that people who don't want to do good upon to others have to be Christian. Your laughing emoticon is very condcending
. I hope you know that.
I still don't know whether your posts are satirical or whether you don't realise the irony of what you say.
It gets more attention than it deserves.
It it in opposition to true gender parity because it's based on the false assumption that females are disadvantaged. As a result, it does nothing for men's issues as they're assumed to be privileged.
Original post by thermometer
I have trouble understanding this seemingly popular notion where people are "against feminism" and yet "believe men and women should have equal rights" like ?????? that is self-contradictory?????
like I like apples but I do not like apples???
like I like apples but I do not like apples???
That's the same as saying that people who don't want to do good upon to others have to be Christian. Your laughing emoticon is very condcending
. I hope you know that. Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Because there are a lot of crybabies that feminism upsets so much and they need their safe space.
I still don't know whether your posts are satirical or whether you don't realise the irony of what you say.
Original post by cookiemonster15
The whole point of setting up the movement was because womens right were not equal to those of men.
Then don't say that the definition is gaining equality for both sexes when as you have just said is not the case.
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3rd wave feminists outright refuse to believe that men and women are different and have different strengths and hinderances. Theyre obsessed with power and to them power and self gratification are all that matters (ironically whilst also refusing to deal with the responsibilities that come with these and then deferring back to the old submissive ways where a man sweeps up all their baggage, but only after a heavy round of self victimization of course).
Men and women are different and always will be, thats life. There is no inferior and superior, there are two different sexes that have biologically developed to mutually co exist and cover eachothers strengths and weaknesses. Recognising this instead of fighting it is key to success as a healthy happy society, but certain billionaire subverts want to destroy family, turn the populace on eachother and further subdue people, replacing love for one another with love for brands, television, social status and full acceptance of nihilism.
Previous waves of feminism dealt with easing the rigidity of social constructs and freeing individuals from expected duty, feminism in developed countries nowdays would be better called gender marxism.
Men and women are different and always will be, thats life. There is no inferior and superior, there are two different sexes that have biologically developed to mutually co exist and cover eachothers strengths and weaknesses. Recognising this instead of fighting it is key to success as a healthy happy society, but certain billionaire subverts want to destroy family, turn the populace on eachother and further subdue people, replacing love for one another with love for brands, television, social status and full acceptance of nihilism.
Previous waves of feminism dealt with easing the rigidity of social constructs and freeing individuals from expected duty, feminism in developed countries nowdays would be better called gender marxism.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Kvothe the arcane
I still don't know whether your posts are satirical or whether you don't realise the irony of what you say.
I still don't know whether your posts are satirical or whether you don't realise the irony of what you say.
Something can only be ironic if the person who says the thing had no intention of conveying that meaning. I know damn well what I was conveying. If I did realise the irony it would cease to be ironic. So your nonsensical sentence shows you don't understand irony, which is ironic in this case
This is what I was deliberately trying to convey...
These people who get so upset by these feminist "throw like a girl" posters are acting like the so called tumbler feminist they spend all their time winging about. Or take rape accusations, the oppressed men getting falsely accused of rape triggering them into this professional victim hood MRA response. I am not unintentionally using the word "safe space" to ridicule the anti-fems when in fact it is the feminists that use terminology like safe space and get "triggered". That's the whole, point. These morons are exactly what they say feminists are. A bunch of easily triggered cry babies on the internet. The only difference is the things that trigger them off.
These posters either...
a) Help women in that they encourage them to do traditionally male things like say rock climb. You don;t have to "clime like a girl" You can just "climb" so go and do it.
b)They achieve nothing but don't really harm anyone. It;s just a bunch of student union feminists trying to feel important. Who cares?
c) It's part of some big cultural Marxist revolution that undermines traditional unequal society with defined but neccerecy inequality between class, gender, race etc which will end in a Marxist dystopia where the none gendered, feminists socialists rule us all like the pigs in Animal Farm. Or it';s part of making women the superior sex and all men into cucks if you are red pill type. In this case these feminist posters are ****ing effective.
I'm gonna go with either a or b. Neither are cause for any concern.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Something can only be ironic if the person who says the thing had no intention of conveying that meaning. I know damn well what I was conveying. If I did realise the irony it would cease to be ironic. So your nonsensical sentence shows you don't understand irony, which is ironic in this case
Something can only be ironic if the person who says the thing had no intention of conveying that meaning. I know damn well what I was conveying. If I did realise the irony it would cease to be ironic. So your nonsensical sentence shows you don't understand irony, which is ironic in this case
No. That is not a condition of irony. Perhaps I ought to have phrased my sentence better. Perhaps something along the lines of "I'm not sure whether your use of irony was deliberate or not". What I wrote was not nonsensical and you have failed at your pedantry.
This is what I was deliberately trying to convey...
These people who get so upset by these feminist "throw like a girl" posters are acting like the so called tumbler feminist they spend all their time winging about. Or take rape accusations, the oppressed men getting falsely accused of rape triggering them into this professional victim hood MRA response. I am not unintentionally using the word "safe space" to ridicule the anti-fems when in fact it is the feminists that use terminology like safe space and get "triggered". That's the whole, point. These morons are exactly what they say feminists are. A bunch of easily triggered cry babies on the internet. The only difference is the things that trigger them off.
These people who get so upset by these feminist "throw like a girl" posters are acting like the so called tumbler feminist they spend all their time winging about. Or take rape accusations, the oppressed men getting falsely accused of rape triggering them into this professional victim hood MRA response. I am not unintentionally using the word "safe space" to ridicule the anti-fems when in fact it is the feminists that use terminology like safe space and get "triggered". That's the whole, point. These morons are exactly what they say feminists are. A bunch of easily triggered cry babies on the internet. The only difference is the things that trigger them off.
But you misunderstand. There are few people who get upset at the campaigns like "throw like a girl". Annoyed, sure, but the campaigns are simply highlighted as they demonstrate the lack of merit of the movement.
Am I to understand that you think someone reacting to being falsely accused of rape is similar to the whining of someone saying that air-conditioning is sexist or that a billboard showing an attractive fit woman should be removed? Some concerns are valid.
You say it doesn't matter but it does. Because feminists are the sole voice in the sphere of gender politics and they influence funding and policy.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by cookiemonster15
How am I breaking my own argument, as in the original post I have clearly stated that I would class myself under the dictionary definition of feminism?
My whole argument was about why most feminists are seen to be such horrible people...
My whole argument was about why most feminists are seen to be such horrible people...
You have literally explained why people don't like feminism, FEMALE RIGHTS not EQUAL RIGHTS
because here's a mirror:
Original post by thermometer
here are some very telling BBC articles from today that blatantly highlight the prevalance of rape culture.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-35658025
and
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35658398
a quote from the first article:
"The report found 21 females, the youngest aged 10, were assaulted by Hall at the BBC between 1967 and 1991.
BUT,
Young female visitors to BBC Manchester were jokingly referred to as "Hall's nieces" who had come for "elocution lessons"
it then says that "no one complained to management" about the abuse. why? because any victim, whether male or female, that comes forward seems to be immediately dismissed, shamed or just not believed.
rape culture isn't just victim blaming, but also where being a victim is so stigmatised and misunderstood that there is a culture of fear. from which, incidences like the above thrive on.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-35658025
and
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35658398
a quote from the first article:
"The report found 21 females, the youngest aged 10, were assaulted by Hall at the BBC between 1967 and 1991.
BUT,
Young female visitors to BBC Manchester were jokingly referred to as "Hall's nieces" who had come for "elocution lessons"
it then says that "no one complained to management" about the abuse. why? because any victim, whether male or female, that comes forward seems to be immediately dismissed, shamed or just not believed.
rape culture isn't just victim blaming, but also where being a victim is so stigmatised and misunderstood that there is a culture of fear. from which, incidences like the above thrive on.
Do we reward rapists? No
Do we celebrate rape? No
Even rape jokes can get you fired.
A culture is the way of life, especially the general customs and beliefs, of a particular group of people at a particular time.
Rape is not that, in our culture.
You are being intellectually dishonest saying oh we live in a rape culture look at what has happened at the bbc, was there problems at the bbc? yes, was there a rape culture at the bbc? Possibly but to then say that is how society feels is rediculous, as has been said some feminists (from what I have saw the majority) are not for equality does this mean we live in missandrist culture?
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by thermometer
here are some very telling BBC articles from today that blatantly highlight the prevalance of rape culture.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-35658025
and
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35658398
a quote from the first article:
"The report found 21 females, the youngest aged 10, were assaulted by Hall at the BBC between 1967 and 1991.
BUT,
Young female visitors to BBC Manchester were jokingly referred to as "Hall's nieces" who had come for "elocution lessons"
it then says that "no one complained to management" about the abuse. why? because any victim, whether male or female, that comes forward seems to be immediately dismissed, shamed or just not believed.
rape culture isn't just victim blaming, but also where being a victim is so stigmatised and misunderstood that there is a culture of fear. from which, incidences like the above thrive on.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-35658025
and
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35658398
a quote from the first article:
"The report found 21 females, the youngest aged 10, were assaulted by Hall at the BBC between 1967 and 1991.
BUT,
Young female visitors to BBC Manchester were jokingly referred to as "Hall's nieces" who had come for "elocution lessons"
it then says that "no one complained to management" about the abuse. why? because any victim, whether male or female, that comes forward seems to be immediately dismissed, shamed or just not believed.
rape culture isn't just victim blaming, but also where being a victim is so stigmatised and misunderstood that there is a culture of fear. from which, incidences like the above thrive on.
Historic evidence is proof of a present day rape culture?
Define rape culture.
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Original post by thermometer
neither I nor anyone else has said that rape culture = a culture in which rape is celebrated. now that would be worrying.
rape culture is a way of, not accepting per se, but normalising/attempting to mitigate/explain sexual violence. why do schoolgirls really need to be told that their skirts need to be below the knees, because it distracts boys? surely boys can control themselves. I know school uniform sounds like a petty issue to mention but it absolutely highlights a lot of flaws in our way of thinking. if you want to talk about third world problems, that mindset applies there too.
rape culture is a way of, not accepting per se, but normalising/attempting to mitigate/explain sexual violence. why do schoolgirls really need to be told that their skirts need to be below the knees, because it distracts boys? surely boys can control themselves. I know school uniform sounds like a petty issue to mention but it absolutely highlights a lot of flaws in our way of thinking. if you want to talk about third world problems, that mindset applies there too.
Nonsense. Schools set their uniform standards not "society" as you'd like to believe, skirt length is chosen by the school and is below the knee as it looks more formal not because all boys see is something they can have sex with and therefore all girls must somehow be victims.
Original post by DiddyDec
Historic evidence is proof of a present day rape culture?
Define rape culture.
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Define rape culture.
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20-40 years ago is hardly historic but if you want more recent examples,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35648397
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35585284
there was also another piece on him on the same site (possibly headline has been changed) but was something like Adam Johnson's "world turned upside down".. why is the media sympathising with a statutory rapist? if his world is turned upside down, he did it to himself. I don't understand this idea that the rapist's crimes need to be smoothed over and understated and he needs to be given sympathy for something he consciously knew was wrong. meanwhile they find ways to find faults in the victim and make her accountable instead.
you love to claim that feminists are just harnessing a "victim complex"; I'd love to know why you don't believe rape culture exists and you also don't think victims are victims. feminists aren't necessarily claiming to be victims, we're just speaking out in support of people who are victims. I'm not a victim of anything, but I believe that people who are should be respected and supported, instead of marginalised.
google is also your friend.
Original post by shreddingfish92
Nonsense. Schools set their uniform standards not "society" as you'd like to believe, skirt length is chosen by the school and is below the knee as it looks more formal not because all boys see is something they can have sex with and therefore all girls must somehow be victims.
You're right, it's chosen by the school because traditionally it looks more formal, because traditionally women have had to cover up, because traditionally exposing skin is seen as some sort of "asking for attention"/"asking to be assaulted".
As a girl who has been told, and has witnessed other girls being told, that their skirts are too short because they will cause a distraction (said explicitly by the head teacher), this isn't a matter of what I'd "like to believe". it's what I've seen and experienced for years.
and you're jumping to exaggerated conclusions there. who said "all girls are victims"?
Original post by thermometer
neither I nor anyone else has said that rape culture = a culture in which rape is celebrated. now that would be worrying.
rape culture is a way of, not accepting per se, but normalising/attempting to mitigate/explain sexual violence. why do schoolgirls really need to be told that their skirts need to be below the knees, because it distracts boys? surely boys can control themselves. I know school uniform sounds like a petty issue to mention but it absolutely highlights a lot of flaws in our way of thinking. if you want to talk about third world problems, that mindset applies there too.
rape culture is a way of, not accepting per se, but normalising/attempting to mitigate/explain sexual violence. why do schoolgirls really need to be told that their skirts need to be below the knees, because it distracts boys? surely boys can control themselves. I know school uniform sounds like a petty issue to mention but it absolutely highlights a lot of flaws in our way of thinking. if you want to talk about third world problems, that mindset applies there too.
So saying rape culture is misleading as there is no rape culture based on what a rape culture would be which is what I stated.
So trying to explain something creates a culture? It is human nature to search for explanations to things they do not understand.
School uniforms haven't really changed much the only difference is that some rules which were implied in years gone by have had to be written and enforces instead.
Original post by thermometer
20-40 years ago is hardly historic but if you want more recent examples,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35648397
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35585284
there was also another piece on him on the same site (possibly headline has been changed) but was something like Adam Johnson's "world turned upside down".. why is the media sympathising with a statutory rapist? if his world is turned upside down, he did it to himself. I don't understand this idea that the rapist's crimes need to be smoothed over and understated and he needs to be given sympathy for something he consciously knew was wrong. meanwhile they find ways to find faults in the victim and make her accountable instead.
you love to claim that feminists are just harnessing a "victim complex"; I'd love to know why you don't believe rape culture exists and you also don't think victims are victims. feminists aren't necessarily claiming to be victims, we're just speaking out in support of people who are victims. I'm not a victim of anything, but I believe that people who are should be respected and supported, instead of marginalised.
google is also your friend.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35648397
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35585284
there was also another piece on him on the same site (possibly headline has been changed) but was something like Adam Johnson's "world turned upside down".. why is the media sympathising with a statutory rapist? if his world is turned upside down, he did it to himself. I don't understand this idea that the rapist's crimes need to be smoothed over and understated and he needs to be given sympathy for something he consciously knew was wrong. meanwhile they find ways to find faults in the victim and make her accountable instead.
you love to claim that feminists are just harnessing a "victim complex"; I'd love to know why you don't believe rape culture exists and you also don't think victims are victims. feminists aren't necessarily claiming to be victims, we're just speaking out in support of people who are victims. I'm not a victim of anything, but I believe that people who are should be respected and supported, instead of marginalised.
google is also your friend.
If rape has been "normalised" Why is Mr Johnson in court?
I never even mentioned feminism.
I want your definition. That is why I asked for it.
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Original post by thermometer
do you not get what "equal rights" means?
"female rights" does not mean "rights, only for females".
it means that in order to achieve your "equal rights", female rights need to be worked on and improved so that they are brought up to the same standard as mens rights.
again, that is not to say that women don't have any rights over men. we do have benefits that men don't. but men have more benefits over women. being male has always been, and still is, some sort of symbol of power and importance.
and for the millionth time, feminism campaigns for improved men's rights too. hence, feminism = equal rights.
if "egalitarians" were actually activists that wanted men and women to have the same rights, that would be totally cool.
but they're not.
the majority of "egalitarians" are literally just using that word as a defiant response to feminism, because they don't think feminism helps men, and yet none of you egalitarians are doing anything for men OR women. so... any chance egalitarianism is actually ever going to achieve something?
for any gender?
"female rights" does not mean "rights, only for females".
it means that in order to achieve your "equal rights", female rights need to be worked on and improved so that they are brought up to the same standard as mens rights.
again, that is not to say that women don't have any rights over men. we do have benefits that men don't. but men have more benefits over women. being male has always been, and still is, some sort of symbol of power and importance.
and for the millionth time, feminism campaigns for improved men's rights too. hence, feminism = equal rights.
if "egalitarians" were actually activists that wanted men and women to have the same rights, that would be totally cool.
but they're not.
the majority of "egalitarians" are literally just using that word as a defiant response to feminism, because they don't think feminism helps men, and yet none of you egalitarians are doing anything for men OR women. so... any chance egalitarianism is actually ever going to achieve something?
for any gender?
Do you literally not understand basic English or does it simply fit your malformed argument better if you don't pretend to understand?
The DICTIONARY states it is the advocacy of WOMENS rights, not mens rights!
If it was a male rights move then why is there a 'rape culture'? That is stereotyping all men into a single catergory.
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