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Can a man be raped

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Original post by Algorithm69
Well, seeing as how many countries are redefining rape to be gender neutral, or getting rid of it all together and replacing it with different categories of sexual assault (1st degree, 2nd degree etc.), I guess you're just going to have to put up with it. Childish or no.

im sure they are putting it in a legal language to by pass tgese problems, such as the way you just mentioned
thats fine for them but im defending the original position (although i gree more with the american definition here, Any penetration should be defined as rape)
By law, men cannot be raped by women. As a post above explained 'rape' - according to law - needs penetration by the penis. Otherwise - according to law - is is not rape, but an involuntary sexual act.

The criticism of this law is that an involuntary sexual act could be as terrible as rape, but the charge does not carry the same stigma. But sentencing is the same.
Reply 22
Original post by Harrie Lyons
-


I propose this definition:

A commits an offence if -
A intentionally performs (or causes B to perform) anal, oral or vaginal sex including, but not limited to, penetration and envelopment.
B does not consent.
A does not reasonably believe that B consents.
Reply 23
Original post by Mr...
Rape should be "sex forced upon someone" not "a penis forces into a vagina"
It bothers me a lot that the law thinks men can't be raped. What about homosexuals?

No the law doesn't say that men can't be raped, it says that women can't rape
well... yeah?

I mean sex without consent is rape so if a man doesnt consent to sex then he was raped...?


also

1+1 = 2

and

water is wet
Original post by Algorithm69
I don't care what law states. Law does not define what is moral and immoral, or what is good and bad, only what is legal and illegal. Laws change as our morality becomes more sophisticated.

You still have not proven that male victims of rape cannot be traumatised to the same extent as women. Whereas all you need to do is use Google to find out that of course they can be. Your entire argument seems to rest on an incredibly outdated concept of gender and gender roles.

You're simply advocating injustice. It's as simple as that.

and you are letting youre blinded absolutist notions of gender equality run in the face of reality. THAT is injust. 'because men and women are equal they must be abke to commit the same crimes'. no that is not the case.
someone can be mentally traumatised by anything if they themselves are mentally unhealthy. the law must ignore that otherwise anything can turn into a serious crime. the law is concerned with what an average healthy individual would find traumatic and the average mentally healthy man would not find being to drunk to consent and having sex with a woman traumatic, you are the one claiming they would and therefore you must provide the evidence that they would.
Original post by Harrie Lyons
on the contary, the level of hurt and trauma is the only thing that makes rape a crime: the law doesnt care about some mystical concept called 'consent' and its violition.
it cares about minimising hurt amongst the populace and punishing those who do. as far as consent to sex is necessary to prevent trauma, the law is concerened with consent.
if raping caused no psychological trauma and only had the danger of stds it would be no more a serious crime than forcing someone to drink from your glass for instance (yes thats techincally a crime, but no where near the level of rape).
inventing an arbitrary definition of the word rape and then blanketing everything under this definition as equally serious is in all honesty childish.


No, rape has always been a crime (even before the rule of law, when it was avenged) because it removes women's agency to choose who breeds with them, which is their prerogative in the sexual marketplace, given the opportunity cost of raising a baby. Rape was an issue not only for the woman but for the rest of her family, who would have to support her single motherhood and a baby whose genes were not their choice.

So non-consent, not trauma, has always been at the heart of the concept of rape. Though gender roles have changed from the model above due to contraception and individualism, rape remains about non-consent first and foremost.

And the present law is couched in terms of non-consent, not trauma. Otherwise, any traumatic sex is rape, and then we have regret rape accusations.
Original post by Harrie Lyons
and you are letting youre blinded absolutist notions of gender equality run in the face of reality. THAT is injust. 'because men and women are equal they must be abke to commit the same crimes'. no that is not the case.
someone can be mentally traumatised by anything if they themselves are mentally unhealthy. the law must ignore that otherwise anything can turn into a serious crime. the law is concerned with what an average healthy individual would find traumatic and the average mentally healthy man would not find being to drunk to consent and having sex with a woman traumatic, you are the one claiming they would and therefore you must provide the evidence that they would.


http://www.datalounge.com/cgi-bin/iowa/ajax.html?t=9506931#page:showThread,9506931
Original post by Comus
I recommend that you watch this monologue by Andrew Bailey.
(Mods and other concerned people: I would like to point out that the title is very misleading)
[video="youtube_share;Ikd0ZYQoDko"]http://youtu.be/Ikd0ZYQoDko[/video]


That's why there are sentencing guidlines.

the only sympathy i would feel with him is if he hadnt gone through puberty yet.
but no (and this my personal opinion) that video doesnt brake my heart like if the 'rapist' was a man.
if he had gone through puberty its actually kind of vile for him to be copying the trauma felt by real rape victims, so yeah that video is hilarious if it wasnt trivialising a very serious subject
Original post by Mr...
Rape should be "sex forced upon someone" not "a penis forces into a vagina"
It bothers me a lot that the law thinks men can't be raped. What about homosexuals?


Homosexuals can, as men can rape other men. The law is still stupid though
Original post by scrotgrot
No, rape has always been a crime (even before the rule of law, when it was avenged) because it removes women's agency to choose who breeds with them, which is their prerogative in the sexual marketplace, given the opportunity cost of raising a baby. Rape was an issue not only for the woman but for the rest of her family, who would have to support her single motherhood and a baby whose genes were not their choice.

So non-consent, not trauma, has always been at the heart of the concept of rape. Though gender roles have changed from the model above due to contraception and individualism, rape remains about non-consent first and foremost.

And the present law is couched in terms of non-consent, not trauma. Otherwise, any traumatic sex is rape, and then we have regret rape accusations.

the original reason is irrelevant. all modern law works on the principle of causing as little harm, physical and psychological, as possible.
you, like everyone else here, are deifying and universalizing the concept of consent
Original post by TroyAndAbed
The US definition is if anyone penetrates anyone with anything against their will it's rape which I think is a more appropriate definition although it's obviously not perfect.


Why only penetration though? That essentially means a man fingering a woman becomes rape, but the woman giving him a handjob remains sexual assault. Rape = sex without consent and the law should reelect that
Reply 32
Original post by Harrie Lyons
the only sympathy i would feel with him is if he hadnt gone through puberty yet.
but no (and this my personal opinion) that video doesnt brake my heart like if the 'rapist' was a man.
if he had gone through puberty its actually kind of vile for him to be copying the trauma felt by real rape victims, so yeah that video is hilarious if it wasnt trivialising a very serious subject


How is it trivialising abuse? It does the opposite, it exposes societal double standards- in particular how men in these situations are often dismissed or expected to conform to a particular role. Suffering is not a zero sum game.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Harrie Lyons
thats my point he was laughing his ass off about the story and telling it in the 'arent i such a stud , i cant keep them off me' voice.
a doubt woman would be so public and boastful in telling such a story.
thats my point, its much more traumatic to do that to woman on avearge and thus more of a crime.

True, it's probably more painful for a women; but surely that fact that women are less boastful and open about their experiences cannot dictate how heinous a crime this is?
No
Original post by Harrie Lyons
the original reason is irrelevant. all modern law works on the principle of causing as little harm, physical and psychological, as possible.
you, like everyone else here, are deifying and universalizing the concept of consent

Sentencing may, as that is up to the whims of the judge, who will reflect changing social attitudes. But you will have to point out exactly when our 1000 year old legal system was overhauled in its entirety to reflect nothing but harm done, no matter what the original roots of each offence. Such an event would be more historically significant than an armed revolution. If it were so, for example, there would be no distinction between murder and manslaughter, and alcohol would be illegal but cannabis OK.
Original post by Harrie Lyons
you, like everyone else here, are deifying and universalizing the concept of consent


Original post by Harrie Lyons
on the contary, the level of hurt and trauma is the only thing that makes rape a crime: the law doesnt care about some mystical concept called 'consent' and its violition.


The legal definition of rape in the UK clearly does have consent at its core, so can you expand your point? I don't quite get it.
Original post by Ronnie G
Apparently by law a man can't be raped I don't think this is true do you?

No, we can only be "sexually assaulted" I believe. A man CAN be raped, but it's called sexual assault instead of rape.
Original post by 2710
A woman cannot rape because by definition you need to 'penetrate'. A woman cannot force a mans penis to get erect and even then it will be the man penetrating her. So the most a woman can be charged for is sexual assault

Posted from TSR Mobile


yes it can, an erection is an involuntary response to external or internal stimulus as every man whose had to hide an awkward boner can contest.to.

Original post by Harrie Lyons
i dont think a man can be raped by a woman, if a womean druged a man and had sex most would find it funny as hell (i have a friend who claims this happened to him)
the expereince in general would be no where near as traumatic.
no it shouldnt be as serious a crime.


i really really hate this preconception that a man would enjoy being sexually assaulted based on nothing more than the defacto precursor that he is male.

It speaks of idiocy and a total and woeful lack of understanding of just how terrible it is to be sexually assualted whether you are male or female.

Sexual assault is NOT funny.
Original post by Algorithm69
Absolutely asinine statement unworthy of comment. I'm having a hard time discerning whether you're a Poe or not. You encapsulate the very worst of feminist thinking, and what you said is almost a direct quote from a feminist advocating closing down every women's prison in the country.

Your red gems are well deserved.



Actually you're the one who first stated men cannot be as traumatized by non consensual sex as women. You haven't provided any evidence showing this to be the case except for personal incredulity, bias, ignorance, and outdated notions of masculinity and femininity. The burden of proof is and always has been on you.

"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".


You started with ad hominems, I was replying in like kind.
The current state law indicates that a woman raping a man is not as great a crime, implying there is less trauma involved for the assaulted. You and mens' rights activists are disputing this and claiming a great a trauma is present. Therefore you are a claim. You are claiming the existence of something that is not accepted by the law at this moment, not me. That positive assertion is that psychological harm inflicted by a female 'rapist' is comparable to that of a male rapists. I deny that, where is your proof?
You're seem emotional about this subject which isn't helping the debate

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