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Why is it OK to be Sexist against Men?
Right before i go into this, i just thought i'd say; I'm not a raging feminist, or a raging misogynist
I'm a mtf transgender teen, i'm 16, and have seen both sides of the coin and experienced in some ways both sides of sexism really, so i just wanted to ask, why is it ok to be sexist against Men? sexism is wrong full stop..
For instance:
Adverts on TV openly bashing men, there was one on a few years ago about cooking which said; so easy even a man could do it.. how is that allowed, imagine if there was one saying; so easy a woman could do it.. it simply wouldnt be permitted
The way women anchors act towards men; why is it ok for women such as Coleen Nolan to openly grope male guests on shows etc, she did it on this morning once during a segment, openly groping much younger males chests..
Loose women also fawn over their male guests, and try to get a feel of his arms etc
Can you imagine middle aged men groping over younger females on TV no?
Take a break magazine advert that was on a few weeks ago; alluded to the women slicing their partners genitals, or men who had scorned them
Can you imagine men laughing joking about female genital mutilation no
Why are the laws not as strict on a woman raping a man, because she cant "penetrate him" its disgusting, it should be the same
Why is there always much more focus on male pedophiles, and they always seem to get much more hatred; they are both disgusting
Same with female teachers having sex with young males; its never seem to be viewed upon as bad than if a male teacher is to get with a young female
Idk, it just annoys me..
Fighting sexism against women, by promoting sexism against Men is not the way to go! yet many seem to think it is!
Equality for all
If there are some mistakes in this thread please correct me, its quite rushed and i'm certainly not an expert! just saying from what ive seen
I'm a mtf transgender teen, i'm 16, and have seen both sides of the coin and experienced in some ways both sides of sexism really, so i just wanted to ask, why is it ok to be sexist against Men? sexism is wrong full stop..
For instance:
Adverts on TV openly bashing men, there was one on a few years ago about cooking which said; so easy even a man could do it.. how is that allowed, imagine if there was one saying; so easy a woman could do it.. it simply wouldnt be permitted
The way women anchors act towards men; why is it ok for women such as Coleen Nolan to openly grope male guests on shows etc, she did it on this morning once during a segment, openly groping much younger males chests..
Loose women also fawn over their male guests, and try to get a feel of his arms etc
Can you imagine middle aged men groping over younger females on TV no?
Take a break magazine advert that was on a few weeks ago; alluded to the women slicing their partners genitals, or men who had scorned them
Can you imagine men laughing joking about female genital mutilation no
Why are the laws not as strict on a woman raping a man, because she cant "penetrate him" its disgusting, it should be the same
Why is there always much more focus on male pedophiles, and they always seem to get much more hatred; they are both disgusting
Same with female teachers having sex with young males; its never seem to be viewed upon as bad than if a male teacher is to get with a young female
Idk, it just annoys me..
Fighting sexism against women, by promoting sexism against Men is not the way to go! yet many seem to think it is!
Equality for all
If there are some mistakes in this thread please correct me, its quite rushed and i'm certainly not an expert! just saying from what ive seen
Scroll to see replies
Because men and women are not equal in society yet. Simple.
Original post by Amethysst
Right before i go into this, i just thought i'd say; I'm not a raging feminist, or a raging misogynist
I'm a mtf transgender teen, i'm 16, and have seen both sides of the coin and experienced in some ways both sides of sexism really, so i just wanted to ask, why is it ok to be sexist against Men? sexism is wrong full stop..
For instance:
Adverts on TV openly bashing men, there was one on a few years ago about cooking which said; so easy even a man could do it.. how is that allowed, imagine if there was one saying; so easy a woman could do it.. it simply wouldnt be permitted
The way women anchors act towards men; why is it ok for women such as Coleen Nolan to openly grope male guests on shows etc, she did it on this morning once during a segment, openly groping much younger males chests..
Loose women also fawn over their male guests, and try to get a feel of his arms etc
Can you imagine middle aged men groping over younger females on TV no?
Take a break magazine advert that was on a few weeks ago; alluded to the women slicing their partners genitals, or men who had scorned them
Can you imagine men laughing joking about female genital mutilation no
Why are the laws not as strict on a woman raping a man, because she cant "penetrate him" its disgusting, it should be the same
Why is there always much more focus on male pedophiles, and they always seem to get much more hatred; they are both disgusting
Same with female teachers having sex with young males; its never seem to be viewed upon as bad than if a male teacher is to get with a young female
Idk, it just annoys me..
Fighting sexism against women, by promoting sexism against Men is not the way to go! yet many seem to think it is!
Equality for all
If there are some mistakes in this thread please correct me, its quite rushed and i'm certainly not an expert! just saying from what ive seen
I'm a mtf transgender teen, i'm 16, and have seen both sides of the coin and experienced in some ways both sides of sexism really, so i just wanted to ask, why is it ok to be sexist against Men? sexism is wrong full stop..
For instance:
Adverts on TV openly bashing men, there was one on a few years ago about cooking which said; so easy even a man could do it.. how is that allowed, imagine if there was one saying; so easy a woman could do it.. it simply wouldnt be permitted
The way women anchors act towards men; why is it ok for women such as Coleen Nolan to openly grope male guests on shows etc, she did it on this morning once during a segment, openly groping much younger males chests..
Loose women also fawn over their male guests, and try to get a feel of his arms etc
Can you imagine middle aged men groping over younger females on TV no?
Take a break magazine advert that was on a few weeks ago; alluded to the women slicing their partners genitals, or men who had scorned them
Can you imagine men laughing joking about female genital mutilation no
Why are the laws not as strict on a woman raping a man, because she cant "penetrate him" its disgusting, it should be the same
Why is there always much more focus on male pedophiles, and they always seem to get much more hatred; they are both disgusting
Same with female teachers having sex with young males; its never seem to be viewed upon as bad than if a male teacher is to get with a young female
Idk, it just annoys me..
Fighting sexism against women, by promoting sexism against Men is not the way to go! yet many seem to think it is!
Equality for all
If there are some mistakes in this thread please correct me, its quite rushed and i'm certainly not an expert! just saying from what ive seen
Well, you have to ask where is the sexism coming from? You act like women create these stereotypes to be malicious, when in fact most of them arise from patriarchy.
1) The sexist idea that women belong in the kitchen (cue all 'get back in the kitchen jokes I know are coming) is so prevalent that you're using an example that is beginning to turn back on men. An advert might mock a man for being unable to cook, why? Because adverts almost entirely show it as a woman's domain, due to a mix of marketing and cultural stereotypes, change this by addressing gender roles in advertising.
2) Agreed, it's not appropriate to be groping men on TV.
3) Again, not really okay.
4) Are the laws weaker? The lack of justice for male rape victims is mostly down to cultural perception, i.e 'Why is he upset? He had sex,' 'Is he weak? Why couldn't he just get her off?' 'How can a woman rape a man' which all leads to hurting victims. I've never heard of feminists campaigning for lower sentences for female rapists, only ones encouraging male victims to come forward to get true estimates of how prevalent the problem is, and so that they can see help. - This also plays into perceptions about females pedophile teachers vs males ones.
None of these examples scream promoting feminist thinking, just because a woman does something sexist towards a man doesn't mean is she is a feminist, they're just further sexist incidents happening in an already sexist context.
You say you want equality, but you're not really looking to highlight the reasons and causes for this sexism, just the surface problem.
Original post by KJane
Well, you have to ask where is the sexism coming from? You act like women create these stereotypes to be malicious, when in fact most of them arise from patriarchy.
1) The sexist idea that women belong in the kitchen (cue all 'get in back in the kitchen jokes I know are coming) is so prevalent that you're using an example that is beginning to turn back on men. An advert might mock a man for being unable to cook, why? Because adverts almost entirely show it as a woman's domain, due to a mix of marketing and cultural stereotypes, change this by addressing gender roles in advertising.
2) Agreed, it's not appropriate to be groping men on TV.
3) Again, not really okay.
4) Are the laws weaker? The lack of justice for male rape victims is mostly down to cultural perception, i.e 'Why is he upset? He had sex,' 'Is he weak? Why couldn't he just get her off?' 'How can a woman rape a man' which all leads to hurting victims. I've never heard of feminists campaigning for lower sentences for female rapists, only ones encouraging male victims to come forward to get true estimates of how prevalent the problem is, and so that they can see help. - This also plays into perceptions about females pedophile teachers vs males ones.
None of these examples scream promoting feminist thinking, just because a woman does something sexist towards a man doesn't mean is she is a feminist, they're just further sexist incidents happening in an already sexist context.
You say you want equality, but you're not really looking to highlight the reasons and causes for this sexism, just the surface problem.
1) The sexist idea that women belong in the kitchen (cue all 'get in back in the kitchen jokes I know are coming) is so prevalent that you're using an example that is beginning to turn back on men. An advert might mock a man for being unable to cook, why? Because adverts almost entirely show it as a woman's domain, due to a mix of marketing and cultural stereotypes, change this by addressing gender roles in advertising.
2) Agreed, it's not appropriate to be groping men on TV.
3) Again, not really okay.
4) Are the laws weaker? The lack of justice for male rape victims is mostly down to cultural perception, i.e 'Why is he upset? He had sex,' 'Is he weak? Why couldn't he just get her off?' 'How can a woman rape a man' which all leads to hurting victims. I've never heard of feminists campaigning for lower sentences for female rapists, only ones encouraging male victims to come forward to get true estimates of how prevalent the problem is, and so that they can see help. - This also plays into perceptions about females pedophile teachers vs males ones.
None of these examples scream promoting feminist thinking, just because a woman does something sexist towards a man doesn't mean is she is a feminist, they're just further sexist incidents happening in an already sexist context.
You say you want equality, but you're not really looking to highlight the reasons and causes for this sexism, just the surface problem.
Can't really disagree with what you've said tbh! I didn't mean that the women are deliberately malicious against men just that it seems socially acceptable for jokes about men to be used
I don't think it is OK nor should it be.
Original post by KJane
Well, you have to ask where is the sexism coming from? You act like women create these stereotypes to be malicious, when in fact most of them arise from patriarchy.
1) The sexist idea that women belong in the kitchen (cue all 'get in back in the kitchen jokes I know are coming) is so prevalent that you're using an example that is beginning to turn back on men. An advert might mock a man for being unable to cook, why? Because adverts almost entirely show it as a woman's domain, due to a mix of marketing and cultural stereotypes, change this by addressing gender roles in advertising.
1) The sexist idea that women belong in the kitchen (cue all 'get in back in the kitchen jokes I know are coming) is so prevalent that you're using an example that is beginning to turn back on men. An advert might mock a man for being unable to cook, why? Because adverts almost entirely show it as a woman's domain, due to a mix of marketing and cultural stereotypes, change this by addressing gender roles in advertising.
Men are generally shown as incompetent idiots in any modern commercial that makes a comical gender comparison; not just in cookery/cleaning product advertisements. Even in television shows, the woman is usually shown in a more flattering light. The irony that the OP is pointing out is that, if the opposite is shown, there would be substantial controversy (particularly via the many feminists who will typically remain comfortably quiet as long as it's the male gender being lampooned).
Original post by Dandaman1
Men are generally shown as incompetent idiots in any modern commercial that makes a comical gender comparison; not just in cookery/cleaning product advertisements. Even in television shows, the woman is usually shown in a more flattering light. The irony that the OP is pointing out is that, if the opposite is shown, there would be substantial controversy (particularly via the many feminists who will typically remain comfortably quiet as long as it's the male gender being lampooned).
What shows are you watching where all male characters are shown as being dumb compared to the woman? Where a woman is being shown in a favourable light because she's one of the few actually on the show and is probably a love interest? It's typical that some sitcoms/shows might have one male character that is shown as being comical/dumb, but then all the other males will be much more complex.
It doesn't take more than a quick google search to see how under-represented women are in TV, that men get far more complex writing and portrayals than women do, and are more at risk of being killed off for man-pain, i.e Supernatural, Dexter, The Dark Knight, X-Men and plenty of others.
Men are not ultimately harmed by a comical man in a film, because in some instances he'll even be the underdog that gets the girl, i.e Joey in Friends, Zoolander, Waterboy. If you show a woman in a dumb context? She's usually a dumb blonde, Penny in Big Bang Theory, every blonde to get killed in horror films. When these tropes are turned around they're really not surprising, which is why Feminists fight for better written women in TV, and hold up strong female characters as role models.
Please don't simplify and ignore the larger gender politics going on in media to simply going:
'If men did this to a woman, ALL HELL WOULD BREAK LOOSE.' Because it wouldn't, as women are used to it.
Because we're men and we don't give a **** what women think of us because they need us no matter what.
My fellow males love to complain about sexism to males as if women haven't been discriminated against since the beginning of time.
You all look a little pathetic.
Posted from TSR Mobile
My fellow males love to complain about sexism to males as if women haven't been discriminated against since the beginning of time.
You all look a little pathetic.
Posted from TSR Mobile
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by KJane
What shows are you watching where all male characters are shown as being dumb compared to the woman?
simpsons, family guy, everybody loves raymond, king of queens...... basically any sitcom about a family will have a retarded irresponsible husband (plus his equally retarded friends, brothers etc) while the wife is always wise, all knowing and he couldn't even find his own **** without her.
bill maher said it best:
"The wife is always brilliant and ethereal and right about everything ... and the husband is always a dumb ****, lucky to have found her. The only smart men on television are Frasier and his brother, both of whom are gayer than Little Richard's underpants."
Original post by KJane
What shows are you watching where all male characters are shown as being dumb compared to the woman? Where a woman is being shown in a favourable light because she's one of the few actually on the show and is probably a love interest? It's typical that some sitcoms/shows might have one male character that is shown as being comical/dumb, but then all the other males will be much more complex.
It doesn't take more than a quick google search to see how under-represented women are in TV, that men get far more complex writing and portrayals than women do, and are more at risk of being killed off for man-pain, i.e Supernatural, Dexter, The Dark Knight, X-Men and plenty of others.
Men are not ultimately harmed by a comical man in a film, because in some instances he'll even be the underdog that gets the girl, i.e Joey in Friends, Zoolander, Waterboy. If you show a woman in a dumb context? She's usually a dumb blonde, Penny in Big Bang Theory, every blonde to get killed in horror films. When these tropes are turned around they're really not surprising, which is why Feminists fight for better written women in TV, and hold up strong female characters as role models.
Please don't simplify and ignore the larger gender politics going on in media to simply going:
'If men did this to a woman, ALL HELL WOULD BREAK LOOSE.' Because it wouldn't, as women are used to it.
It doesn't take more than a quick google search to see how under-represented women are in TV, that men get far more complex writing and portrayals than women do, and are more at risk of being killed off for man-pain, i.e Supernatural, Dexter, The Dark Knight, X-Men and plenty of others.
Men are not ultimately harmed by a comical man in a film, because in some instances he'll even be the underdog that gets the girl, i.e Joey in Friends, Zoolander, Waterboy. If you show a woman in a dumb context? She's usually a dumb blonde, Penny in Big Bang Theory, every blonde to get killed in horror films. When these tropes are turned around they're really not surprising, which is why Feminists fight for better written women in TV, and hold up strong female characters as role models.
Please don't simplify and ignore the larger gender politics going on in media to simply going:
'If men did this to a woman, ALL HELL WOULD BREAK LOOSE.' Because it wouldn't, as women are used to it.
Would all hell break loose? No. I never implied that. What I did mean, however, is that a lot more feminists (who are allegedly for the fair treatment of both genders) would typically cry "sexism!" in one instance and passively ignore - or even encourage - the other.
What do all those movies have in common? The genre. I could pick out any romance or drama and find plenty of well-written female characters (who may often dominate here). Males usually prefer to watch action and sci-fi and males identify better with male characters - this sells, and the movies are a business at the end of the day. If there is a movie or show marketed towards male consumers, there will be more male characters, and vice versa for females. As for complex, leading female characters in television shows: Friends, New Girl, Veronica Mars, Two Broke Girls, Sex and the City, Gilmore Girls, Joan of Arcadia, Everwood, Weeds, Eight Simple Rules, The Walking Dead, and most soap operas. I could list dozens more. Now, are many of these women love interests? Sure, but so are the men. Depending on the target audience, the romantic narrative will come from a different perspective. And are all these female characters good role models? No, but are the males?
To summarise, my main point is that although tropes exist (for both genders, positive and negative), feminists tend only to perceive or care to take offence to those that affect the female gender and will often hypocritically ignore or even encourage the opposite paradigm. When you cite Penny from the Big Bang Theory, you do so as if she's a negative trope, but what she lacks in brains she makes up for in her social dominance over the other characters, whom she plays like fiddles, exploiting their awkward sexuality (see, I can turn this around quite easily). And are the socially awkward, romantically hopeless and copiously un-cool male characters not 'negative' stereotypes? Come to think of it, are the violent, bloodthirsty alpha males portrayed in action movies and crime series not also negative depictions of males? I am not arguing that these are wrongful, but that you should consider other perspectives and interpretations before thinking only about the potentially negative portrayals of women in entertainment media.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by Amethysst
I'm a mtf transgender teen, i'm 16, and have seen both sides of the coin and experienced in some ways both sides of sexism really, so i just wanted to ask, why is it ok to be sexist against Men?
I am glad we have someone who can confirm the situation having experienced it from both ends.
It is not OK.
Men and women (including transgenders) in the men's movement are doing what they can to fight the sexism. Some say that the laws that discriminate against men (there are none that discriminate against women) are the result of sexism against men but I think they help to drive the sexism against men: they make it acceptable to consider men as second-class citizens because that is what men are legally.
Original post by thecrediblehulk
simpsons, family guy, everybody loves raymond, king of queens...... basically any sitcom about a family will have a retarded irresponsible husband (plus his equally retarded friends, brothers etc) while the wife is always wise, all knowing and he couldn't even find his own **** without her.
Those shows are all written/produced predominantly by men for men.
In American Dad, the wife is the silly one, and nobody complains there.
Besides, isn't it more offensive to women? That she should settle for an indolent, immature, half-witted freak who almost kills her and the children with his nonsense? If you'll notice, I don't think any of the women you listed actually work, they just pick up after their husband's mess as if he is a clueless brat needing a mother; ironically, the exact sexist stereotype women have been fighting for years. Come to think of it...don't Lisa and Marge often come into conflict over Homer's treatment of her?
I think this is just reflecting on a very common social observation: grown men are still very much more immature than women, less responsible than women and tend to fail miserably at getting by on their own.I've lost count of the number of fat, lazy middle-aged men and their healthier, frustrated wives I've met. Honestly, the idea that many men just want another mother is not a rare one, and despite the protests, a lot of men generally prove it. In fact it's an attitude you'll encounter on a daily basis. I've lost track of the number of times I've seen guys post a twitter pic of a miicrowave with the caption "Don't know the buttons, need a woman in my life".
Maybe girls are expected to grow up more; they're taught to look after themselves (and, of course, their future Homer Simpsons
) so they learn to iron, cook, wash the dishes, wash clothes, clean the house, look after kids and so on. Even if you look at the toys children get, there's still an extreme focus on housekeeping and motherhood for girls. Guys get action heroes, giant spiders, monsters, cars, science stuff, orcs, superheroes, mutants and weapons. Girls get pink kitchen utensils and prams. Girls are generally held more accountable for what they do, tend to be held more responsible for things, more cautious about things. Men, on the other hand, are given the 'boys will be boys' excuse for most things - even as extreme as bullying, sexual harassment and loutish behaviour (I definitely heard my bullies getting away with abusing me with the, "boys will be boys, they'll sort is out" mantra). I've seen men at 23, university educated, get let off by their parents with, "I guess boys will be boys." No, they are men, treat them like it. It's no wonder guys struggle so much when they've spent their lives relying on other people to sort stuff out. Women also tackle their problems more head-on, men tend to bury their heads in the sand and hope it'll go away.
As a guy, I find this offensive. I don't need or want a second mother, I don't need a woman to pick up my stuff or iron my shirts for me. And yet, constantly, it's men telling me I need a "woman to do my stuff" and "sort me out" so I can go out and play. I like being an adult. I like being independent. Maybe I'm just reacting to a very mollycoddling mother, but the idea of a wife/girlfriend always doing everything for me drives me up the wall. I have no idea how anyone could find that dynamic attractive.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by Padwas
because men are seen to be wild sex crazy animals 
Wow you are a sexist bitch.
two weeks ago a woman said "ladies first" on the train after i boarded first...i was first in the single file line and she tried to cut in at the front but decided not to walk in front of me...after she said im a sexist prick so i told her its unnecessary to disrespect me...she approached me and tried grabbed me by my jaw so i just pushed her and she dislocated her shoulder as she hit the bar on the train...i ran and exited the station and just called a taxi due to the police lol
its not ok to be sexist it spreads inequality among the sexes...
its not ok to be sexist it spreads inequality among the sexes...
(edited 9 years ago)
Because people reactive aggressively to oppression, and society kinda gives the oppressed a pass because it's the least we can do.
1. That commercial would imply that cooking is for women, like a stereotypical servant or housewife, so....
If you wanna discuss sexists commercials discuss snickers, when a man turns into a melodramatic diva that is a woman, and as soon as he "gets his nuts" back, he is sane and cool again...
Or low calorie snack commercials aimed at women, that make eating look shameful, and make eating sexual (with all the moans) which puts out an additional message that women should be ashamed of their sexuality
2. Women are shunned for expressing their sexuality all the time. Thus when they do it, even in over exaggerated ways, for example groping men, sexual harassment, it's like "you go girl".
3. Slicing off someones balls is a figure of speech, in the same way "growing some balls" is. The only thing that inherently elevates man over a women in society is his genitalia, so cutting them off is effectively stripping someones power to oppress.
4. All gender inequalities, including the inequalities in rape laws are Man's fault. They wrote the the roles. But it's not like a women can't be punished for having forcible sex. There are laws against it, it's just not called rape.
1. That commercial would imply that cooking is for women, like a stereotypical servant or housewife, so....
If you wanna discuss sexists commercials discuss snickers, when a man turns into a melodramatic diva that is a woman, and as soon as he "gets his nuts" back, he is sane and cool again...
Or low calorie snack commercials aimed at women, that make eating look shameful, and make eating sexual (with all the moans) which puts out an additional message that women should be ashamed of their sexuality
2. Women are shunned for expressing their sexuality all the time. Thus when they do it, even in over exaggerated ways, for example groping men, sexual harassment, it's like "you go girl".
3. Slicing off someones balls is a figure of speech, in the same way "growing some balls" is. The only thing that inherently elevates man over a women in society is his genitalia, so cutting them off is effectively stripping someones power to oppress.
4. All gender inequalities, including the inequalities in rape laws are Man's fault. They wrote the the roles. But it's not like a women can't be punished for having forcible sex. There are laws against it, it's just not called rape.
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