Radical Feminism, Society and other problems.
Hello,
I have made this thread to point out a few things that annoy me in today's society and things I would like to discuss/debate about.
Before I start, I would like to point out, I myself am a feminist as I think most people are, if you want equality for all people no matter their gender, race etc, then you are a feminist. However, what I don't agree with are things like radical feminism. This thread has a few different points of discussion that I want to discuss. Please try to refrain from being obnoxious towards other people if their opinion isn't the same as yours.
One of the points is feminism vs radical feminism. A lot of people seem to confuse the difference. Feminism is if you want equality for people. However, in simple terms, radical feminism is basically trying to establish a power change between the genders to better benefit themselves. There was a recent invention which forced men to sit in a closed-legged position and forced women to sit in a "womenspreading" position. As you can see from the picture down below, it clearly shows that although the inventor wanted to stop men from manspreading, instead they have now reversed those roles, clearly going against equality. I get it, I find people who take up more space than they need annoying too but that doesn't mean we have to make specific inventions to force people to do certain things.
Another thing is how people feel the need to make such a huge deal out of nothing. For example, the new Lion King film. Some people feel the need to make a huge scene by claiming that "Scar" should have been more "gay" like in the original. Along with that, people think it should've been called "The Lion Queen" as in real-life, the females are the pride of the group.
It's a cartoon, it's a film, it's entertainment for gods sake.
Furthermore is how we as a society now think it's acceptable to accuse people as "guilty until proven innocent" rather than how it should be, "innocent until proven guilty". It is stupidly insane how we instantly boycott anyone or anything before getting all our facts right. For example, the whole James Charles thing. Along with this, I'm on about all these "sexual harassment" claims from women and men that instantly ruins peoples careers without people fact-checking or waiting for evidence or for them to be proven guilty. I'm not saying #Don'tBelieveWomen, I'm saying #InnocentUntilProvenGuilty. It's how the Law works. A women recently accused a man off raping her for it to later be found that she was in fact lying. Another example is with Aziz Ansari. This guy was accused of some sort of sexual abuse for it to later be found that it was just a bad sex experience and nothing short of it. I just think we are jumping our guns too quick and ruining people's careers over it. I won't even get into the whole Comedians getting fired and people getting fired over jokes made 10 years ago (James Gunn) etc.
Now, this next thing might be quite controversial but I want to voice my opinion.
Please try to understand my point before going all keyboard-warrior on me.
There are only two genders biologically. I believe you cannot argue against that point, biologically, you are either a female or a male, it's within the whole animal kingdom. You either have one or the other genitalia.
However, by modern society, we can all agree that people feel and have different genders than the two biological ones but that does not mean that we as a society have to change everything in order to accommodate to all this.
What I mean is, for example, a while ago there was a debate about how we should be forced to use specific pronouns for genders, I completely disagree with that. Imagine being forced to say a certain word or pronoun for people, it's the opposite of free-speech. I think if you are a person of the LGBT+ community, it's up to the people who they are with to determine if they are nice enough to use a specific pronoun for them. For example, asking your teacher to refer to you as something else.
That's all fine but when we as a society are forced to use certain pronouns or otherwise we could get in trouble is just stupid. By now, there's way too many genders for us to keep a tab on all the different pronouns and I just don't think changing the English language to be able to accommodate to other pronouns would make any sense.
Another controversial thing is societies use of the "N Word". Hear me out on this. I find it stupid how we as a society hold one word so much higher in terms of "getting offended" compared to other words. What I mean by this is that there are a lot more words that have so much history as well and can also be considered very offensive/racist but society doesn't treat those kind of words with such hesitation or punishment of sorts.
Finally,
if you have read this thread, I thank you for taking the time out to do it. I know I wrote a lot more than what I intended to and was going to keep going as I had a lot more stuff to say. However, I think this is enough for now. I'm also sorry if some of my points didn't come across very clearly, I just wrote without thinking on parts.
Feel free to change my mind on any of these things or we can have a little discussion/debate.
I have made this thread to point out a few things that annoy me in today's society and things I would like to discuss/debate about.
Before I start, I would like to point out, I myself am a feminist as I think most people are, if you want equality for all people no matter their gender, race etc, then you are a feminist. However, what I don't agree with are things like radical feminism. This thread has a few different points of discussion that I want to discuss. Please try to refrain from being obnoxious towards other people if their opinion isn't the same as yours.
One of the points is feminism vs radical feminism. A lot of people seem to confuse the difference. Feminism is if you want equality for people. However, in simple terms, radical feminism is basically trying to establish a power change between the genders to better benefit themselves. There was a recent invention which forced men to sit in a closed-legged position and forced women to sit in a "womenspreading" position. As you can see from the picture down below, it clearly shows that although the inventor wanted to stop men from manspreading, instead they have now reversed those roles, clearly going against equality. I get it, I find people who take up more space than they need annoying too but that doesn't mean we have to make specific inventions to force people to do certain things.
Another thing is how people feel the need to make such a huge deal out of nothing. For example, the new Lion King film. Some people feel the need to make a huge scene by claiming that "Scar" should have been more "gay" like in the original. Along with that, people think it should've been called "The Lion Queen" as in real-life, the females are the pride of the group.
It's a cartoon, it's a film, it's entertainment for gods sake.
Furthermore is how we as a society now think it's acceptable to accuse people as "guilty until proven innocent" rather than how it should be, "innocent until proven guilty". It is stupidly insane how we instantly boycott anyone or anything before getting all our facts right. For example, the whole James Charles thing. Along with this, I'm on about all these "sexual harassment" claims from women and men that instantly ruins peoples careers without people fact-checking or waiting for evidence or for them to be proven guilty. I'm not saying #Don'tBelieveWomen, I'm saying #InnocentUntilProvenGuilty. It's how the Law works. A women recently accused a man off raping her for it to later be found that she was in fact lying. Another example is with Aziz Ansari. This guy was accused of some sort of sexual abuse for it to later be found that it was just a bad sex experience and nothing short of it. I just think we are jumping our guns too quick and ruining people's careers over it. I won't even get into the whole Comedians getting fired and people getting fired over jokes made 10 years ago (James Gunn) etc.
Now, this next thing might be quite controversial but I want to voice my opinion.
Please try to understand my point before going all keyboard-warrior on me.
There are only two genders biologically. I believe you cannot argue against that point, biologically, you are either a female or a male, it's within the whole animal kingdom. You either have one or the other genitalia.
However, by modern society, we can all agree that people feel and have different genders than the two biological ones but that does not mean that we as a society have to change everything in order to accommodate to all this.
What I mean is, for example, a while ago there was a debate about how we should be forced to use specific pronouns for genders, I completely disagree with that. Imagine being forced to say a certain word or pronoun for people, it's the opposite of free-speech. I think if you are a person of the LGBT+ community, it's up to the people who they are with to determine if they are nice enough to use a specific pronoun for them. For example, asking your teacher to refer to you as something else.
That's all fine but when we as a society are forced to use certain pronouns or otherwise we could get in trouble is just stupid. By now, there's way too many genders for us to keep a tab on all the different pronouns and I just don't think changing the English language to be able to accommodate to other pronouns would make any sense.
Another controversial thing is societies use of the "N Word". Hear me out on this. I find it stupid how we as a society hold one word so much higher in terms of "getting offended" compared to other words. What I mean by this is that there are a lot more words that have so much history as well and can also be considered very offensive/racist but society doesn't treat those kind of words with such hesitation or punishment of sorts.
Finally,
if you have read this thread, I thank you for taking the time out to do it. I know I wrote a lot more than what I intended to and was going to keep going as I had a lot more stuff to say. However, I think this is enough for now. I'm also sorry if some of my points didn't come across very clearly, I just wrote without thinking on parts.
Feel free to change my mind on any of these things or we can have a little discussion/debate.
(edited 4 years ago)
Do you feel better for your rant?
Original post by ByEeek
Do you feel better for your rant?
Very much so.
I don't think that's what radical feminism is
Original post by Obolinda
I don't think that's what radical feminism is
Oh yeah, I guess I must've just forgot to mention anything about that part, that's my mistake, got carried away with everything else.
I think a lot of the issues that you describe are connected with identity politics dogmas, fringe ideologues who will not tolerate the existence of other viewpoints and millennial snowflakes who melt into a pool of vocal fury when they realise that their ideas are not yet on par with national law.
I'm female, have no interest in any form of identity politics and believe in justice for everyone- with strictly no playing 'favourites'.
Feminism is identity politics that focuses upon championing women and often issues perceived as important 'women's issues'- not equality for everyone.
Board level employment opportunities, increasing female representation/recognition in some sectors or professions, prioritising women's rights in child custody/criminal cases.
Many mainstream feminists (male and female) are adopting some radical feminist attitudes and ideas; which in turn often originated from the old women's liberation movement.
Employment/senior role/course quotas to benefit women, hostility to men (presence/speaking/pronouns), lobbying to avoid sending women offenders to prison (even for high value financial offences or serious violence involving a weapon) and often seeking to redefine rape as "sexual coercion"/ sexual exploitation in relation to choices that are regretted within hours or motivated by anger at being tricked into a ons/dumped.
I volunteer to support rape survivors and have also known a few liars who made false claims in relation to sexual assault or rape.
As regards Aziz Ansari, his behaviour was consensual and not criminal- but it went way beyond a bad date.
The guy seems unable to differentiate between a first date and using an escort service- to the point that he treated his date like a sex worker, apparently without any money exchanging hands. He is a celebrity that was just begging to be exposed by the media and he deserved to be.
The idiotic comments allegedly made later by the date's friends were very unhelpful, as was the hysteria and mildly dishonest slant of many media reports seeking to portray a storyline of 'sexual exploitation (or worse) of a naive young woman by a celebrity'.
I very much doubt Aziz Ansari's date behaved in a naive manner that week; star struck, flattered, silly, angry, sulky, defensive and vengeful- yes.
But not naive.
The n word is one of the foulest terms of abuse in existence- with a horrifying history connected to violence, race hate and triumphalism.
Anyone who says or writes it risks acquiring a very negative reputation for themselves.
Not to mention starting the type of chaos that can result in being injured, arrested, made unemployed and a social pariah in polite society.
I'm female, have no interest in any form of identity politics and believe in justice for everyone- with strictly no playing 'favourites'.
Feminism is identity politics that focuses upon championing women and often issues perceived as important 'women's issues'- not equality for everyone.
Board level employment opportunities, increasing female representation/recognition in some sectors or professions, prioritising women's rights in child custody/criminal cases.
Many mainstream feminists (male and female) are adopting some radical feminist attitudes and ideas; which in turn often originated from the old women's liberation movement.
Employment/senior role/course quotas to benefit women, hostility to men (presence/speaking/pronouns), lobbying to avoid sending women offenders to prison (even for high value financial offences or serious violence involving a weapon) and often seeking to redefine rape as "sexual coercion"/ sexual exploitation in relation to choices that are regretted within hours or motivated by anger at being tricked into a ons/dumped.
I volunteer to support rape survivors and have also known a few liars who made false claims in relation to sexual assault or rape.
As regards Aziz Ansari, his behaviour was consensual and not criminal- but it went way beyond a bad date.
The guy seems unable to differentiate between a first date and using an escort service- to the point that he treated his date like a sex worker, apparently without any money exchanging hands. He is a celebrity that was just begging to be exposed by the media and he deserved to be.
The idiotic comments allegedly made later by the date's friends were very unhelpful, as was the hysteria and mildly dishonest slant of many media reports seeking to portray a storyline of 'sexual exploitation (or worse) of a naive young woman by a celebrity'.
I very much doubt Aziz Ansari's date behaved in a naive manner that week; star struck, flattered, silly, angry, sulky, defensive and vengeful- yes.
But not naive.
The n word is one of the foulest terms of abuse in existence- with a horrifying history connected to violence, race hate and triumphalism.
Anyone who says or writes it risks acquiring a very negative reputation for themselves.
Not to mention starting the type of chaos that can result in being injured, arrested, made unemployed and a social pariah in polite society.
I agree with most of what you said.
However, there was an extra part with the N Word section along with a video which explained some things but I guess that got took out when it was getting reviewed. My main point was, how come other racist/offensive terms are used within society which have a very cruel history as well but we don't regard it as offensive as the N Word. Now, by no means am I saying a lot of the terms are equivalent to that word.
Anyway, thank you for your response.
However, there was an extra part with the N Word section along with a video which explained some things but I guess that got took out when it was getting reviewed. My main point was, how come other racist/offensive terms are used within society which have a very cruel history as well but we don't regard it as offensive as the N Word. Now, by no means am I saying a lot of the terms are equivalent to that word.
Anyway, thank you for your response.
At my work it was trying to get men to apply and do degrees in mental health nursing/social work etc. the reason behind that was that it was viewed that males could understand boys/men mental health problems between than females and women could understand girl/women problem better than males.
Original post by Obolinda
I don't think that's what radical feminism is
No, it's not. Radical in cases of leftist philosophies is based off radix, meaning root, not extreme. Radical feminism effectively argues that society as we know it, and the gender dynamics, are inherently rooted in patriarchy, the enforcement of power by men over women, and as such political organising and legal changes is really little more than giving a new coat of paint to a house with broken foundations and calling it fixed. Radical praxis is, if you want a snappy soundbite, revolution not reformation.
(edited 4 years ago)
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