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Confused as to how this was simplified.

The question was to find the surface area of a sphere or radius R. I got a bit stuck so I looked at the solution, however I'm confused as to how the simplification in it was attained. The solution is as follows:

y=R2x2 y = \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} in the range RxR -R \leq x \leq R

y=xR2x2 y' = - \frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Therefore,

A=2πRRR2x2[xR2x2]1/2dx A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2} dx

Then it's somehow simplified to get,

A=2πRRR2x2[R2R2x2]1/2 A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2}

Then so on until the final answer is 4πR24 \pi R^2

But I have no idea how xR2x2\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}} became R2R2x2\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Any help please? :smile:
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 1
The question was to find the surface area of a sphere or radius R. I got a bit stuck so I looked at the solution, however I'm confused as to how the simplification in it was attained. The solution is as follows:

y=R2x2 y = \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} in the range RxR -R \leq x \leq R

y=xR2x2 y' = - \frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Therefore,

A=2πRRR2x2[xR2x2]1/2dx A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2} dx

Then it's somehow simplified to get,

A=2πRRR2x2[R2R2x2]1/2 A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2}

Then so on until the final answer is 4πR24 \pi R^2

But I have no idea how xR2x2\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}} became R2R2x2\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Any help please? :smile:
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 2
Original post by BAD AT MATHS
The question was to find the surface area of a sphere or radius R. I got a bit stuck so I looked at the solution, however I'm confused as to how the simplification in it was attained. The solution is as follows:

y=R2x2 y = \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} in the range RxR -R \leq x \leq R

y=xR2x2 y' = - \frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Therefore,

A=2πRRR2x2[xR2x2]1/2dx A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2} dx

Then it's somehow simplified to get,

A=2πRRR2x2[R2R2x2]1/2 A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2}

Then so on until the final answer is 4πR24 \pi R^2

But I have no idea how xR2x2\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}} became R2R2x2\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Any help please? :smile:

Since no one's replied. . .
I don't know all that much about this stuff, but should that not be:
dA=2πxds=2πx1+(dydx)2 dx[br]A=2πRRx1+(dydx)2 dx\displaystyle dA=2 \pi x ds = 2 \pi x \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx[br]\Rightarrow A = 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}x \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx
Then subbing in for dydx\dfrac{dy}{dx}
A=2πRRx1+x2R2x2 dx\Rightarrow A= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R} x \sqrt{1+ \dfrac{x^2}{R^2-x^2}} \ dx
This can then be simplified to the form you were asking about by getting a common denominator in the square root.

The form you've given looks much more like:
dA=2πy1+(dxdy)2 dydA=2 \pi y \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dx}{dy} \right)^2} \ dy except that you've subbed in for y and have dydx\dfrac{dy}{dx} instead. :confused:
Again, I only touched on this very briefly a while back, but those are my thoughts. :colondollar:
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 3
Original post by joostan
Since no one's replied. . .
I don't know all that much about this stuff, but should that not be:
dA=2πxds=2πx1+(dydx)2 dx[br]A=2πRRx1+(dydx)2 dx\displaystyle dA=2 \pi x ds = 2 \pi x \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx[br]\Rightarrow A = 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}x \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx
Then subbing in for dydx\dfrac{dy}{dx}
A=2πRRx1+x2R2x2 dx\Rightarrow A= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R} x \sqrt{1+ \dfrac{x^2}{R^2-x^2}} \ dx
This can then be simplified to the form you were asking about by getting a common denominator in the square root.

The form you've given looks much more like:
dA=2πy1+(dxdy)2 dydA=2 \pi y \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dx}{dy} \right)^2} \ dy except that you've subbed in for y and have dydx\dfrac{dy}{dx} instead. :confused:
Again, I only touched on this very briefly a while back, but those are my thoughts. :colondollar:



I think 2πxdx2 \pi x dx is for when the function y(x) is a constant.
Reply 4
Original post by BAD AT MATHS
I think 2πxdx2 \pi x dx is for when the function y(x) is a constant.


Tbh I don't really know. . . That's the derivation I seem to recall.
Sorry I can't really do more. :frown:
Original post by BAD AT MATHS


Therefore,

A=2πRRR2x2[xR2x2]1/2dx A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2} dx

Then it's somehow simplified to get,

A=2πRRR2x2[R2R2x2]1/2 A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2}

Then so on until the final answer is 4πR24 \pi R^2



That first equation is incorrect.

joostan is almost correct. The formula for the surface area (when rotated about the x-axis) is:


=2πRRy1+(dydx)2 dx= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}y \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx

And subbing in your values gives:

A=2πRRR2x21+x2R2x2 dxA= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}\sqrt{R^2-x^2} \sqrt{1+ \dfrac{x^2}{R^2-x^2}} \ dx

Then put what's under the second square root over a common denominator.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by BAD AT MATHS
The question was to find the surface area of a sphere or radius R. I got a bit stuck so I looked at the solution, however I'm confused as to how the simplification in it was attained. The solution is as follows:

y=R2x2 y = \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} in the range RxR -R \leq x \leq R

y=xR2x2 y' = - \frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Therefore,

A=2πRRR2x2[xR2x2]1/2dx A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2} dx

Then it's somehow simplified to get,

A=2πRRR2x2[R2R2x2]1/2 A = 2\pi \int^R_{-R} \sqrt{R^2 - x^2} \left[\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}\right]^{1/2}

Then so on until the final answer is 4πR24 \pi R^2

But I have no idea how xR2x2\frac{x}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}} became R2R2x2\frac{R^2}{\sqrt{R^2 - x^2}}

Any help please? :smile:

The middle part of the solution is incorrect, the area of a surface of revolution is given by
A=2πy(1+(dydx)2)dxA=2\pi\int y\left(1+\left(\frac{dy}{dx} \right)^2 \right)dx
+
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 7
Original post by ghostwalker
That first equation is incorrect.

joostan is almost correct. The formula for the surface area (when rotated about the x-axis) is:


=2πRRy1+(dydx)2 dx= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}y \sqrt{1+ \left(\dfrac{dy}{dx} \right)^2} \ dx

And subbing in your values gives:

A=2πRRR2x21+x2R2x2 dxA= 2\pi \displaystyle\int^R_{-R}\sqrt{R^2-x^2} \sqrt{1+ \dfrac{x^2}{R^2-x^2}} \ dx

Then put what's under the second square root over a common denominator.


Yeah when the function is rotated around the x axis i.e y isn't constant is what I mean.
Reply 8
Hello,

S=2pi*R*integrale(-R;R)dz

but dtheta=2pi*root(R^2-z^2)*dz/cos(theta)=2pi*root(R^2-z^2)*(R*dz)/root( R^2-z^2)=2*pi*R*dz

so S=2*pi*R^2
Original post by BAD AT MATHS
Yeah when the function is rotated around the x axis i.e y isn't constant is what I mean.


Yes, that formula covers the situation. Not sure if you're asking something there.
ROFL I honestly can't believe I spent all this time trying to work out how to simplify this. When it's something I learned in high school. Can you believe I'm an undergrad!!!

Talk about brain fog. :facepalm:
Original post by geeegeee
Hello,

S=2pi*R*integrale(-R;R)dz

but dtheta=2pi*root(R^2-z^2)*dz/cos(theta)=2pi*root(R^2-z^2)*(R*dz)/root( R^2-z^2)=2*pi*R*dz

so S=2*pi*R^2



Its ok thanks, I'm just an idiot at times.

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