M1 Question
Here is the question:
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
P.s the picture below is a similar situation to what imagine is happening in this question. I used it for the first 2 questions and got them right.
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
P.s the picture below is a similar situation to what imagine is happening in this question. I used it for the first 2 questions and got them right.
(edited 9 years ago)
Scroll to see replies
Original post by AsLevelStudent
Here is the question:
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
Unfortunately we can't see the picture
Original post by kkboyk
Unfortunately we can't see the picture
On my homework there was no picture. I think is a situation similar to this, but obviously with my numbers in the situation,
Original post by AsLevelStudent
On my homework there was no picture. I think is a situation similar to this, but obviously with my numbers in the situation,
Try coming up with two separate equations for T for each separate particles, and include the frictional for for particle A equation and then cancel out the T.
Original post by AsLevelStudent
Here is the question:
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
4) Two particles A and B, of mass 6 kg and 1 kg respectively, are connected by a light inextensible string. Particle A is placed on a horizontal table. The string passes over a small smooth light pulley P fixed at the edge of the table and B hangs freely. The horizontal section of the string AP is perpendicular to the edge of the table and is of length 3 m. The particles are released from rest with both sections of the string taut and the section PB vertical.
a) If the table is smooth, find the tension, in N, in the string
b) The time, in seconds to 1 decimal place, taken by A to reach the pulley.
If instead, the table is rough & the coefficient of friction between A and the table is
c) Find the acceleration, in m s−2, of each particle
d) Find the tension, in N, in the string.
I have done part a and b and got them right but I don't know how to answer part c and d of this question. Can anyone help?
What was that coefficient of friction for parts c and d?
Original post by M4ttyM4tt
What was that coefficient of friction for parts c and d?
1/8 is the coeffiant in c and d.
Original post by kkboyk
Try coming up with two separate equations for T for each separate particles, and include the frictional for for particle A equation and then cancel out the T.
I did that for the first 2 (a and b) but I don't know where to put friction in.
Original post by AsLevelStudent
I did that for the first 2 (a and b) but I don't know where to put friction in.
Friction should be the force working against Tension for A's equation of T
Original post by Bobjim12
Friction should be the force working against Tension for A's equation of T
So T-F(uR) = Ma ?
Original post by AsLevelStudent
So T-F(uR) = Ma ?
Yes.
Is this for part c/d? Friction wouldnt apply in a/b
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Bobjim12
Yes.
Is this for part c/d? Friction wouldnt apply in a/b
Is this for part c/d? Friction wouldnt apply in a/b
Thank you. Yeah I have done part a and b; and have gotten the right answer it is just I always get confused which way around Tension, Friction go.
Original post by AsLevelStudent
Thank you. Yeah I have done part a and b; and have gotten the right answer it is just I always get confused which way around Tension, Friction go.
If you draw the Frictional force on the diagram that should help.
For part C the answer is 0.35 ms^−2 I did T-F=Ma
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
Original post by AsLevelStudent
Thank you. Yeah I have done part a and b; and have gotten the right answer it is just I always get confused which way around Tension, Friction go.
If the object is travelling along a rough surface, friction acts in the direction opposite to motion. Ie, if the object is moving to the right, draw the friction going out to the left. Tension always acts 'away from the object' - imagine a string pulling an object and which direction it goes taut in.
For an AS pulley question, friction will only act on the object that is on the table (if the table surface is rough) and tension acts towards the pulley for both objects.
Thanks guys M1 is the one I am finding the most difficult at the minute so I appreciate the help.
I have an idea of how to get the answer it is just I don't know how to put it into marks worth form. For question c) friction is now involved and I have just realised Tension will change. The length is 3 and sitting here playing about with the numbers in my head mass is 6kg Friction = 7.35 length is 3m 1.05 divided by 3 equals 0.35 which is the answer for part C. It is just getting it written in the correct mathmatical form/working out.
Original post by Magnesium
Is the mass of A not 5kg? Your diagram above says weight is 5g so R=5g
That is just a rough diagram as the questions on a homework sheet and it doesn't have a diagram but by imagining the situation is like that I got A and B right so I thought I use a diagram to show the situation.
Original post by AsLevelStudent
For part C the answer is 0.35 ms^−2 I did T-F=Ma
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
You have used the wrong mass, should be 5
Original post by AsLevelStudent
For part C the answer is 0.35 ms^−2 I did T-F=Ma
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
T= 8.4
U= 1/8
At A mass is 6kg so M=6 and R=6g (6 x 9.8)
So you get 8.4-7.35=6a
1.05=6a
a=0.175, which is half of the answer.
So where have I gone wrong?
Use suvat by using u=0 t= the time you found earlier s=3 a=?
s=ut+0.5at^2
Original post by Bobjim12
You have used the wrong mass, should be 5
Yeah I thought that too but I realised his picture had no connection to the actual question in terms of its values. he probably needs to use suvat since d asks him to find tension which is after the question he's trying to answer
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