The Student Room Group

Julian Assange is being 'arbritarily detained' by the UK government... Really?

Scroll to see replies

Original post by Aj12
How so? Given the many appeals, court hearings, and extradition hearings, I think it is safe to assume there are concrete grounds for his arrest. Sweden and the UK aren't exactly renown for their corrupt judicial systems.

See: interpretation of 'judicial authority' (re: public prosecutor's grounds to issue an arrest warrant), and the VCLT ('s lack of presence in the hearings yet decisiveness).
The UN is a joke
Original post by Mathemagicien
The UN is a joke

Thank you for that incisive and pertinent analysis.
Original post by walking in sand
Thank you for that incisive and pertinent analysis.


You are welcome
Original post by walking in sand
He's not a US government employee "obliged to withhold classified documents", thus there is no legal precedent for such a prosecution (for espionage).


i think the closest analogy is US v Franklin, which failed (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/02/us/politics/02aipac.html)


It failed because of: “the likelihood that classified information would be revealed at trial and damage to the national security that might result from a disclosure of classified information.”

On that basis the recommendation was to withdraw the prosecution and not because the perpetrators were innocent or no laws prevented them from being prosecuted. In other words it was a damage limitation exercise. Therefore no legal precedent was set because no judge ruled in favour of the defendants.

Assange should still be prosecuted - it's up to the prosecutor to bring charges, for his defence to argue against them and for the jury to decide which side they believe.
(edited 8 years ago)
It's utterly ridiculous people defend him for avoiding questioning on the matter of sexual assault.


If a controversial politician run away to a foreign country so as to avoid questioning on sex offences and claimed that he was being persecuted for his views, nobody would accept such blatant disregard for due legal processes. He is of the same moral standard as Gary Glitter when he fled to the far east to avoid the charges brought against him.
Original post by uberteknik

Assange should still be prosecuted - it's up to the prosecutor to bring charges, for his defence to argue against them and for the jury to decide which side they believe.

The fact remains there is no precedent for such an exercise of extra-territorial jurisdiction, and nor do I think there should be.


But, of course, prosecutors in any country can bring charges against anyone in the world.

Original post by AntiBabylonista
It's utterly ridiculous people defend him for avoiding questioning on the matter of sexual assault.

I'm pretty sure he has accepted Sweden's jurisdiction to try him, but on the condition that he doesn't leave the Embassy to be tried (e.g. by video-link), or that if he does return to Sweden he isn't then extradited to US to face bs charges (at best).
Original post by walking in sand



I'm pretty sure he has accepted Sweden's jurisdiction to try him, but on the condition that he doesn't leave the Embassy to be tried (e.g. by video-link), or that if he does return to Sweden he isn't then extradited to US to face bs charges (at best).


Sweden has an extradition treaty with the US, why should he be exempt from normal legal processes?
Original post by walking in sand
The fact remains there is no precedent for such an exercise of extra-territorial jurisdiction, and nor do I think there should be.

And of course because of that countries may be tempted to take matters into their own hands and deal out extra-territorial murder a.k.a. Polonium Justice or Putinism.

Spoiler

Original post by AntiBabylonista
Sweden has an extradition treaty with the US, why should he be exempt from normal legal processes?

On what grounds does the US seek his extradition?


The "extradition treaty" you speak of is not 'absolute', it only operates for certain (alleged) offences. At the moment, the US haven't stated what offences he might be charged with in the US, so it's unclear whether the treaty is relevant ('but also unlikely as it prohibits extradition on the basis of "a political offence" ' ) .
Original post by walking in sand
On what grounds does the US seek his extradition?


The "extradition treaty" you speak of is not 'absolute', it only operates for certain (alleged) offences. At the moment, the US haven't stated what offences he might be charged with in the US, so it's unclear whether the treaty is relevant ('but also unlikely as it prohibits extradition on the basis of "a political offence" ' ) .


If this is indeed the case, why does he fear going to Sweden to be questioned on the alleged sex offences?


As you rightly say, the treaty with the US does not apply in all cases.
Original post by uberteknik

And of course because of that countries may be tempted to take matters into their own hands and deal out extra-territorial murder a.k.a. Polonium Justice or Putinism.

Spoiler


You can keep repeating some rubbish about what Putin supposedly does, but unless it directly concerns Assange and Sweden/US then it's not relevant and I don't really care.
Original post by AntiBabylonista
If this is indeed the case, why does he fear going to Sweden to be questioned on the alleged sex offences?


As you rightly say, the treaty with the US does not apply in all cases.

That's why I asked you "On what grounds does the US seek his extradition?" - no one knows what grounds the US may claim/create to get around that restriction.
Original post by scrotgrot
No because they are on the land of the state which has an (exercised) arrest warrant out for them.

Assange's situation is that he is in an Ecuadorian enclave surrounded by the UK and due to this he cannot have safe passage: given the small size of the embassy he is effectively detained extrajudicially by the UK.

It's like if South Africa decided not to let any Lesothoans out or if the EU decided not to let any Swiss out.


you are having a laugh.

Assange has chosen to place himself there and could leave at any time , at which point he would Actually be detained at the request of the Swedes

This has all arisen becasue assanges tin foil hat got all absorbed out and he thinks answering for his alleged sexual misdemeanours is some plot to get him to the US to face trial for the wikileaks stuff.
Reply 54
Original post by walking in sand
Can Sweden promise not to extradite him to the U.S. once they clear him of the trumped-up charges against him?


This is the key. If Sweden promise that, Assange should go out since the accusation in Sweden won't stand.

It's not a secret that Sweden obeyed orders when they charged him of rape (for not having put a condom :rolleyes:).
Original post by walking in sand
That's why I asked you "On what grounds does the US seek his extradition?" - no one knows what grounds the US may claim/create to get around that restriction.


You can't argue that legal exceptions should be made for him by the Swedes on the basis that America might seek to extradite him.


What should make people question his character and integrity even more is the possibility that the charges brought against him are subject to statutes of limitations, so he could wait it out in the embassy until sufficient time has passed and then simply walk free.


EDIT: By exceptions I mean travelling to the UK to question him or doing so via some sort of secure internet link
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by walking in sand
You can keep repeating some rubbish about what Putin supposedly does, but unless it directly concerns Assange and Sweden/US then it's not relevant and I don't really care.
I think you are the one being obtuse. Hey ho.
Original post by zippyRN
you are having a laugh.

Assange has chosen to place himself there and could leave at any time , at which point he would Actually be detained at the request of the Swedes

This has all arisen becasue assanges tin foil hat got all absorbed out and he thinks answering for his alleged sexual misdemeanours is some plot to get him to the US to face trial for the wikileaks stuff.


Exactly right.


He's invented some sort of conspiracy where apparently we have to prove doesn't exist before he thinks normal protocols should apply to him. An extreme display of narcissism if ever there was one.
Original post by AntiBabylonista
It's utterly ridiculous people defend him for avoiding questioning on the matter of sexual assault.


If a controversial politician run away to a foreign country so as to avoid questioning on sex offences and claimed that he was being persecuted for his views, nobody would accept such blatant disregard for due legal processes. He is of the same moral standard as Gary Glitter when he fled to the far east to avoid the charges brought against him.


And that comparison is exactly why they set up a sting involving a sexual offence, in Sweden too where if you so much as look at a girl wrong you have raped her.
Original post by scrotgrot
And that comparison is exactly why they set up a sting involving a sexual offence, in Sweden too where if you so much as look at a girl wrong you have raped her.


Take your tinfoil hat off.

Quick Reply

Latest

Trending

Trending