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Rolf Harris found guilty on all 12 counts of indecent assault

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It really is shocking, reading through this thread, just how much people are defending him, claiming it can't be proven because it has been such a long time, he shouldn't be in jail because he probably won't reoffend. Or the big one, "If he really did it, all these alleged victims would have said something sooner", I am fortunate not to have suffered this sort of thing personally, but I can see why a child who has just been sexually abused, would be terrified to come forward and stand against someone, who was clearly hero-worshiped to such an extreme level by so many people. It's as if emotionally, you guys are attached to him (a convicted child-abuser) and want him let off, "because he seemed so nice when I was growing up."


Original post by tengentoppa
So he was getting little kids to blow his didgeridoo.

How awful, is there anyone from that period who wasn't a paedophile?


That's nowhere near as funny as you think it is
(edited 9 years ago)
yo radical one - The point suggesting not giving him a custodial term is a relevant one; it is one of the stated aims in custodial sentencing. It is not, however, the only consideration. He will probably get a custodial sentence due to the impact on the victims, the age of the victims and the seriousness of the offence.
Original post by yo radical one
It really is shocking, reading through this thread, just how much people are defending him, claiming it can't be proven because it has been such a long time, he shouldn't be in jail because he probably won't reoffend. Or the big one, "If he really did it, all these alleged victims would have said something sooner", I am fortunate not to have suffered this sort of thing personally, but I can see why a child who has just been sexually abused, would be terrified to come forward and stand against someone, who was clearly hero-worshiped to such an extreme level by so many people. It's as if emotionally, you guys are attached to him (a convicted child-abuser) and want him let off, "because he seemed so nice when I was growing up."


I'm not defending him or saying it didn't happen (only those involved know what really happened). I just don't understand how such things can go on for so long and to so many people without someone directly or indirectly involved bringing it to attention and how it's proved when so many years have passed and when it comes down to someone saying something against someone else. How do you reach a conclusion? It can't be easy, it must come down to who do you believe more, who sounds more credible.
Original post by filthynines
Why is this relevant?


Because I feel it is. Feel free to keep scrolling and quote someone else if you disagree.
Original post by laalNick
I'm not defending him or saying it didn't happen (only those involved know what really happened). I just don't understand how such things can go on for so long and to so many people without someone directly or indirectly involved bringing it to attention and how it's proved when so many years have passed and when it comes down to someone saying something against someone else. How do you reach a conclusion? It can't be easy, it must come down to who do you believe more, who sounds more credible.


This just sounds like a massive rationalisation of the fact that someone who was well known and loved, turned out to be a pretty terrible human being.

There does seem, clearly in light of this thread, that even now there is a collective mentality that people who have this level of status and acclaim can just be given a free reign to behave in the most horrific way, and I can imagine it being much worse decades ago, I mean Jimmy Savile, used this to his advantage and we now know, loads of people (probably people who are public figures even today) were aware of his actions and said nothing. I wasn't on the jury, but they would have been instructed very clearly to only reach a guilty verdict if his guilt is beyond reasonable doubt, they would have been presented with the evidence (evidence neither you nor I have seen) and the judge would have told them to ignore evidence which is very suspect, so whilst I do agree as a general point innocent people do go to prison, it's highly unlikely that Harris was innocent and this constant making excuses, or simply refusing to accept the facts is exactly the sort of thing, which allows what he did to happen in such a rampant and unchecked way.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by filthynines
yo radical one - The point suggesting not giving him a custodial term is a relevant one; it is one of the stated aims in custodial sentencing. It is not, however, the only consideration. He will probably get a custodial sentence due to the impact on the victims, the age of the victims and the seriousness of the offence.


There should be an element of punishment in the judicial system, punishment isn't innately bad
Original post by yo radical one
This just sounds like a massive rationalisation of the fact that someone who was well known and loved, turning out to be a pretty terrible human being.

There does seem, clearly in light of this thread, that even now there is a collective mentality that people who have this level of status and acclaim can just be given a free reign to behave in the most horrific way, and I can imagine it being much worse decades ago, I mean Jimmy Savile, used this to his advantage and we now know, loads of people (probably people who are public figures even today) were aware of his actions and said nothing. I wasn't on the jury, but they would have been instructed very clearly to only reach a guilty verdict if his guilt is beyond reasonable doubt, they would have been presented with the evidence (evidence neither you nor I have seen) and the judge would have told them to ignore evidence which is very suspect, so whilst I do agree as a general point innocent people do go to prison, it's highly unlikely that Harris was innocent and this constant making excuses, or simply refusing to accept the facts is exactly the sort of thing, which allows what he did to happen in such a rampant and unchecked way.


Don't get me wrong I'm not saying he's innocent or that victims are lying. I'm speaking more generally of abuse cases. How would you prove that for example someone squeezed your bottom or stroked your thigh 30 odd years ago? Because if it were supported by evidence such as film/photograph/forensic reports surely it would be more open & shut case? If there were witnesses then why didn't they do something? Looking on and doing nothing should be a punishable crime IMO too. So is it based on recollections of the events, comparison of alibis & whereabouts of claimants & accused, similarities between claims, psychological history of claimants after the event like history of subsequent mental illness deemed to be caused by the abuse? I'm not saying these things should go unpunished, far from it, I just want to understand how a case is made after so much time has elapsed. How do you get justice for an historic act? I really do despair at the human race, how can these horrific things have been allowed to go on for so long.
I think the wording of my question failed to get the point across. Why are the feelings of the victim relevant to questions of whether there should be the ability to try an alleged criminal for an historic offence; particularly in the scenario put to this thread, which was where the alleged criminal has since died?

When the CPS consider whether to prosecute there must be both a realistic prospect of conviction, and a public interest in prosecuting. The CPS' own website states that they will "show sensitivity and understanding to victims and witnesses and treat all defendants fairly." That doesn't mean that they'll see whether the victim supports the CPS' actions or not. So the question again falls: why are the victim's feelings relevant?
Original post by yo radical one
There should be an element of punishment in the judicial system, punishment isn't innately bad


Punishment is one of the elements. I can't go as far as saying it's a non-exhaustive list, but it's pretty thorough.
Original post by Drewski
Yes. Guilty and all, fine, ok.

Is there really any point putting him jail, though? He's hardly likely to re-offend, he's no longer a threat to the public. Are we getting to the point where being put in jail is thought of as a punishment, rather than a place to keep someone until they're not a threat to others and are rehabilitated?
Surely house arrest is a better - and cheaper - option?


House arrest probably is cheaper, I'm guessing. That said, although he probably isn't a threat anymore, I have zero qualms if he does get sent down. For one thing it would show that people are not able to escape custodial sentences even if decades have passed since the crime took place. One things for sure, he'll be a recluse for the rest of his life.

Original post by Architecture-er
Another great idea, I don't know how you keep coming up with them


I never stop amazing myself.

Original post by NathanW18
What did I just listen to? I feel like I was just violated.


:sexface:

Original post by Jebedee
Witness testimony should be thrown out if they haven't come forward for decades. There should be a statute of limitations on it.

Posted from TSR Mobile


I disagree, there could be all sorts of reasons why a person hasn't come forward for many years. I don't see why a crime should be considered any less of a crime based on the length of time that has passed since it's occurred.
Original post by Architecture-er
Also found guilty on the count where he said he was in Australia at the time of the alleged assault, and I've not read anywhere that that alibi was found to be false.

Until someone writes out an article explicitly showing us the proof that guided the jury, I'm not going to believe it.



Yeah that is right pal...

All your information is media based. Let me think here. A! Jury those people that hear the evidence and decide whether beyond reasonable doubt.

So therefore from what you say, no decision from a Jury you believe. Yet another that thinks by reading a newspaper etc gives them a better position .

Idiot!
Original post by Jebedee
Witness testimony should be thrown out if they haven't come forward for decades. There should be a statute of limitations on it.

Posted from TSR Mobile



O do shut up you ignorant person!

Clueless as to how such offending impacts on the person!
A portrait of Jimmy, by Rolf. I wonder how much it will go for now.

Original post by NightOwl1985
Yeah that is right pal...

All your information is media based. Let me think here. A! Jury those people that hear the evidence and decide whether beyond reasonable doubt.

So therefore from what you say, no decision from a Jury you believe. Yet another that thinks by reading a newspaper etc gives them a better position .

Idiot!


I'm sorry, I can't speak/read retard

Please learn to phrase your sentences and thoughts coherently and try again, thanks :h:
Original post by Architecture-er
I'm sorry, I can't speak/read retard

Please learn to phrase your sentences and thoughts coherently and try again, thanks :h:



Tit. Yet another on here that.....
I would like to issue an apology to KT Tunstall for choosing to see Rolf Harris at a festival ten years or so ago instead of her.
Original post by NightOwl1985
Tit. Yet another on here that.....


That.....

You didn't finish your sentence
anyone remeber the brass eye episode from 2001 pedogeddon..... hillarious. well worth a watch! satire at its best https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcU7FaEEzNU
[QUOTE="Architecture-er;48416244"]That.....

You didn't finish your sentence[/QUOTE
Original post by barnetlad
I would like to issue an apology to KT Tunstall for choosing to see Rolf Harris at a festival ten years or so ago instead of her.


Meh, understandable choice to be honest.

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