The Student Room Group

Singaporean dictator Lee Kuan Yew died

Scroll to see replies

Reply 40
LKY interviewed on "Top 10 Hot Button" issues:

Remarkably frank...and more so, impressive ... its long but worth the time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihiE4oGyYlQ
Reply 41
Original post by clh_hilary
Whilst being the most backward first-world country is better not being a first-world country at all, he and the government have not made steps to make the society progress anywhere beyond the most basic level of living needs.

Economic development is important, but having nothing but only economic development is bad, especially when it's not mutually exclusive to have economic development and freedom (USA), or cultural development (UK), or creativity (Japan), or a functional legal system (most first-world countries), and many other things.

To compare Singapore with its closest rival, Hong Kong, it is not that impressive of a success story. Economically both cities are developed more or less the same, but HK dominated East Asia culturally, has an independent juridical system, a lot more liberal legally, has actual freedom, and has a more functional democracy despite its system being more restrictive than SG's - all these despite not being an English-speaking country and under Chinese rule.



And stopped there. You can argue that you need to be tough in the beginning before you could let it grow itself, just like military rule right after a chaos, but not for forever.



Because he didn't need to. The court always ruled in favour of him.



His time in office is irrelevant but until now it's still in his son's hand. What is this? A monarchy?

You can run an opposing party, but nobody, including the opposing party, has the freedom to actually say anything against anyone.



And you cannot. In Singapore, no-one is allowed to say anything bad about anyone.

Also, it's still illegal to be gay.


Majority of your points are based on stupid lists seen on buzzfeed or like websites. Please do not call Singapore a backward first world country if you haven't experienced it. Amenities are better than almost anywhere else. Healthcare is extensive, not like NHS, but miles ahead of america. Crime is incredibly low. Cleanliness is one of the highest. Education levels are way ahead of every country in southeast Asia and leading the world in mathematics at least on some lists. One of the most incredible facts about Singapore is it's ability to accept and maintain multi culturalism.

True enough, in some ways freedom may be lacking. But sometimes tradeoffs are necessary for an effective system. Gay laws are still present but if you didnt know in your pea brain, they arent active in its use. The current generation of Singaporeans are getting more vocal about mistreatment of their rights to freedom because of invasive immigration policies. Whereby many feel their lives are completely changing due to influx of foreigners and that they are taking up jobs. This leads on to all the other arguments about cost of living and so on.

BTW, who said we cannot say anything bad?

Please do not talk trash, you just look like a third world person.
Original post by seeXYZ
Well there's has only been 3 Singapore PMs (a very small sample), however;

You have missed the point. I am not saying that Singapore's current and historical PMs are sub-average or malicious; I am saying that Singapore's institutions are poorly equipped to remove such a person in the future. Since the PM position also seems to be becoming hereditary, they are perhaps also poorly equipped to prevent such a person taking up the position.

A country with a compliant population governed by LKY is probably better governed than the same country governed by the run of British or French heads of government in the same period. However, Britain and France are much less likely to be stuck with a monster who can't be removed.

Bad government is not something that only happens when institutions fail. It is inevitable everywhere. How much a system limits the damage bad government can do is perhaps more important than how much it enables good government to do.

Ideas shouldn't become dogma, regardless of where its from.

The view that LKY's rule will be perpetuated forever is itself a dogma. Democracy may be foundationally dogmatic but it is not functionally dogmatic. It is very easy for a democratic society to change - that is the whole point.

As I argued previously, the restrictions on political activity in Singapore could imo be strongly justified when the opposition was an openly communist movement. Today, free competition is likely to result in two parties that look very much like the PAP and would compete on competence and honesty rather than basic values. It would not radically change the ideological trajectory of the country but would make that trajectory much less dependent on the decisions and virtues of a handful of individuals.
(edited 9 years ago)
India declares national mourning for LKY

The government of India has declared a day of national mourning on Sunday (Mar 29) as a mark of respect for Singapore's founding Prime Minister Lee Kuan Yew. According to a statement on India's Ministry of Home Affairs website, the national flag of India will be flown at half-mast throughout the country, and there will be no official entertainment.



The state funeral of Mr Lee will be held in Singapore on Sunday, and Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi will be among the many world leader, past and present, in attendance. India's Prime Minister Narendra Modi's admiration for Mr Lee was apparent in his condolence message in which he described Singapore's founding Prime Minister as "a far-sighted statesman and a lion among leaders". Some small villages in Tamil Nadu have also put up banners, mourning his passing.

"The Prime Minister choosing to go there and be a part of the funeral is not only a confirmation and reaffirmation of the good ties between the two countries, but it's also a mark of respect for the departed soul," said Bharatiya Janata Party spokesman Nalin Kohli.

Mr Lee had visited India several times over four decades. Some of his ideas on how India could drive its economy are reflected in Mr Modi's economic agenda. From the past accounts of Indian journalists, Mr Lee had suggested that if India wanted to prosper, it had to first reduce red tape in its public sector, support the private sector, build infrastructure, attract foreign capital investment and boost the country's manufacturing services.

If India is able to replicate reforms inspired by Mr Lee, the country will owe its transformation to the late statesman, who in an emotional address in Delhi in 2005 quoted India's very own first Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru. "The time has come for India's next tryst with destiny," Mr Lee said that time.

http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singapore/more-singapore-stories/story/india-declares-day-national-mourning-sunday-mr-lee-20150

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asiapacific/india-s-modi-to-attend/1741380.html

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics-and-nation/lees-demise-india-declares-national-mourning-on-mar-29/articleshow/46714682.cms
Reply 44
Original post by Observatory
You have missed the point. I am not saying that Singapore's current and historical PMs are sub-average or malicious; I am saying that Singapore's institutions are poorly equipped to remove such a person in the future. Since the PM position also seems to be becoming hereditary, they are perhaps also poorly equipped to prevent such a person taking up the position.

A country with a compliant population governed by LKY is probably better governed than the same country governed by the run of British or French heads of government in the same period. However, Britain and France are much less likely to be stuck with a monster who can't be removed.

Bad government is not something that only happens when institutions fail. It is inevitable everywhere. How much a system limits the damage bad government can do is perhaps more important than how much it enables good government to do.


The view that LKY's rule will be perpetuated forever is itself a dogma. Democracy may be foundationally dogmatic but it is not functionally dogmatic. It is very easy for a democratic society to change - that is the whole point.

As I argued previously, the restrictions on political activity in Singapore could imo be strongly justified when the opposition was an openly communist movement. Today, free competition is likely to result in two parties that look very much like the PAP and would compete on competence and honesty rather than basic values. It would not radically change the ideological trajectory of the country but would make that trajectory much less dependent on the decisions and virtues of a handful of individuals.



From the interviews I seen of him (very franked), he doesn't mind oppositions, in fact he welcome it, as long as they're not "duds" he called them, i.e. all talk and no delivery (like most politicians).

I think Singapore's government competency and honesty is self-evident, its pretty hard to beat in any part of the world, let along an equally good Singapore's alternative.

LKY is very pragmatic, he doesn't view PAP has the God given right to rule, he does expect them to be beaten in a future election. What he fear, among other things, are politicians "playing to their natural constituents", i.e. a party that woo the Chinese only, the Indian only, the Malay only, like in Malaysia etc - divisive. LKY/PAP is very much into social engineering (given their experience with Malaysia), e.g. they make sure that a mix of ethnicity in any housing estate reflect the population as a whole, so no "ethnic ghetto" is build. And even with recent immigration, they tried to maintain the same ethnic proportion. The goal is stability.

I don't think its right to characterised Singapore as a single party state. They do have opposition parties, they do sit in Parliament and those MPs do enjoy Parliamentary Privileges. Whether the oppositions is any good is another question. Remember he took some of them to court (one of the cleanest in the world) for libel and won, 20 out of 20. PAP do have the right "crush" the oppositions (legally), just like the oppositions want to crush PAP (legally).

Sing's govt still depends on one-man-one-vote, the electorate process to gain and maintain power. That is the only way (in any democracies, Western or otherwise) to get rid of the incumbent government. The Rule of Law still applied to the Sing's govt, their PM and anyone else. Can their system leads to "dictatorial PM"? Well, can the UK's? The answer is yes to both, if they have a big enough majority (e.g. Margaret Thatcher) and "yes men" for a cabinet. BTW "yes men" cabinet would be the antithetical to what LKY believed.
(edited 9 years ago)

Quick Reply

Latest

Trending

Trending