**The "North Korea Watch 2013" Update Thread**
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Original post by welshmun
There are alot of reasons why the US wouldn't order a nuclear strike on Pyongyang or any other place in NK. Geographically it is too close to places like Dandong and Dalian which could be threatened by nuclear material etc.
Well I highly doubt they'll nuke border areas (they might seize control but certainly won't nuke them, that's where victims of the North's status system are - as well as labour camps), if they're going to deploy nukes it'll most probably be within Pyongyang, where many kim-supporting government loyalists reside, as well as the fatso himself.
Nuclear radiation in Pyongyang shouldn't go as far as Chinese border towns up north, or the DMZ down south.
Original post by CelticSymphony67
The US thought that they had quality over quantity in the Vietnam War. Look how that turned out. People are thinking that the North Korean Army will be easy to succumb. I personally think that this is wrong. I think that the majority of them will be pumped up and psychotic, with a hatred of all things Western and Imperialist. They have had it drummed into them since 1953. This is not going to be another Iraq, a war with North Korea will be brutal, and deadly. I'm not War Hungry Individual, but if it does kick off, then Obama needs to get his Nukes onto Standby. It really is the for China to come in and sort this out ASAP.
Vietnam war was different - the war between the north and south was essentially a war with the former Soviet Union and China (two huge powers at the time) against the US and its allies.
Now however, Russia and China are unlikely to support North Korea because there's no incentive in store - both countries maintain economic relations with the US and support for NK would greatly damage that. The only other countries willing to support North Korea are Iran and Syria, and even they couldn't match up to the US, put together.
And might I also add that NK is stuck in a time warp - they're improvising on obsolete technology they had since the Vietnam war, while the US has developed its arsenal much further since then.
(edited 11 years ago)
America should not invade. They should sod of so NK can say "haha, the Americans sodded off look" and then set about defusing the long term situation in a slightly more constructive way than ww3. Look at Cuba. Not all that bad a place in comparison to NK and a lot of other places. Are the Americans willing to let them be? What message does that send to NK? "Give us an inch so we can take a mile"
What would happen if NK weren't so oppressive? America would start supporting dissident groups as it does in all the countries it doesn't like that aren't so oppressive. America has no right to dictate how north Korea should be run. To demand that it has a free media in the name of human rights that they can then control that media and impose their values and a government of which they approve.
A North Korea that relaxes because its going to be left alone or a nuclear war?
Lets look at the objectivity of values. Is their one thing everyone can agree on? Communists, Capitalists, Zionists, Darwinists, Christians, Muslims, Mormons, Pagans, Ainceent Greeks etc etc etc?
You'd think that the one thing that has sufficient objective backing to be bad to every school of thought imaginable would be the extinction of the human race. Thats where all out nuclear war could lead. Everybody who can agree with that one thing should realise that unwillingness to live and let live, not bombs themselves that is the real threat. Therefore live and let live should be the only value that is projected into NK. To accept differences and work together for mutual benefit and respecting the right of others to think differently to us.
What would happen if NK weren't so oppressive? America would start supporting dissident groups as it does in all the countries it doesn't like that aren't so oppressive. America has no right to dictate how north Korea should be run. To demand that it has a free media in the name of human rights that they can then control that media and impose their values and a government of which they approve.
A North Korea that relaxes because its going to be left alone or a nuclear war?
Lets look at the objectivity of values. Is their one thing everyone can agree on? Communists, Capitalists, Zionists, Darwinists, Christians, Muslims, Mormons, Pagans, Ainceent Greeks etc etc etc?
You'd think that the one thing that has sufficient objective backing to be bad to every school of thought imaginable would be the extinction of the human race. Thats where all out nuclear war could lead. Everybody who can agree with that one thing should realise that unwillingness to live and let live, not bombs themselves that is the real threat. Therefore live and let live should be the only value that is projected into NK. To accept differences and work together for mutual benefit and respecting the right of others to think differently to us.
Lol at anyone who suggets nuking North Korea is a viable solution.
The radioactive fallout would hurt South Korea as well.
The most viable solution, if the North Koreans are to attack South Korea, Japan or Guam, would be a direct attack on Kim Jong Un, using conventional missiles.
The radioactive fallout would hurt South Korea as well.
The most viable solution, if the North Koreans are to attack South Korea, Japan or Guam, would be a direct attack on Kim Jong Un, using conventional missiles.
Yeah, I don't know why anyone here is proposing some crazy attack on North Korea as a whole. It is only the regime we don't like. We won't use nuclear weapons on an innocent civilian population. Our problem isn't with them at all.
Original post by TheMagicRat
It just seems like your desperate for conflict. Thank God you don't have your finger on the button.
No. I'm more concerned with North Korea getting out of control - hence I wish either for China to invade and take control or for the United States to invade and take control.
Think about it - a country is constantly threatening you with nuclear strikes and then it's getting closer and closer to being able to carry out such strikes. Surely you'd want the situation to be reined in swiftly, no?
Yes, I am desperate for something - I'm desperate for China or the United States to finally sort out this mess before NK goes crazy and puts millions of lives in danger. Do you really think that a nuclear strike on South Kore for example, will not gravely affect the entire planet in various ways?
Something needs to be done now - the United States has pussy-footed for too long. It doesn't even matter if this time around NK is just using more rhetoric - they need to be sorted out, as they're a constant problem which is becoming a very serious problem.
I am not like the naturoplaris guy who seems to love war - I am merely saying that the regime in NK needs to be ousted and the country brought up to date.
Original post by green.tea
America should not invade. They should sod of so NK can say "haha, the Americans sodded off look" and then set about defusing the long term situation in a slightly more constructive way than ww3. Look at Cuba. Not all that bad a place in comparison to NK and a lot of other places. Are the Americans willing to let them be? What message does that send to NK? "Give us an inch so we can take a mile"
What would happen if NK weren't so oppressive? America would start supporting dissident groups as it does in all the countries it doesn't like that aren't so oppressive. America has no right to dictate how north Korea should be run. To demand that it has a free media in the name of human rights that they can then control that media and impose their values and a government of which they approve.
A North Korea that relaxes because its going to be left alone or a nuclear war?
Lets look at the objectivity of values. Is their one thing everyone can agree on? Communists, Capitalists, Zionists, Darwinists, Christians, Muslims, Mormons, Pagans, Ainceent Greeks etc etc etc?
You'd think that the one thing that has sufficient objective backing to be bad to every school of thought imaginable would be the extinction of the human race. Thats where all out nuclear war could lead. Everybody who can agree with that one thing should realise that unwillingness to live and let live, not bombs themselves that is the real threat. Therefore live and let live should be the only value that is projected into NK. To accept differences and work together for mutual benefit and respecting the right of others to think differently to us.
What would happen if NK weren't so oppressive? America would start supporting dissident groups as it does in all the countries it doesn't like that aren't so oppressive. America has no right to dictate how north Korea should be run. To demand that it has a free media in the name of human rights that they can then control that media and impose their values and a government of which they approve.
A North Korea that relaxes because its going to be left alone or a nuclear war?
Lets look at the objectivity of values. Is their one thing everyone can agree on? Communists, Capitalists, Zionists, Darwinists, Christians, Muslims, Mormons, Pagans, Ainceent Greeks etc etc etc?
You'd think that the one thing that has sufficient objective backing to be bad to every school of thought imaginable would be the extinction of the human race. Thats where all out nuclear war could lead. Everybody who can agree with that one thing should realise that unwillingness to live and let live, not bombs themselves that is the real threat. Therefore live and let live should be the only value that is projected into NK. To accept differences and work together for mutual benefit and respecting the right of others to think differently to us.
No - either China or the US need to oust the regime in NK. There needs to be change now.
And just because the US attacks NK does not mean that there will be WW3 - far from it! China would not go to war against its biggest trading partner (the US) unless it were a life or death situation. NK is not profitable or productive for China.
Original post by TheMagicRat
Yeah, I don't know why anyone here is proposing some crazy attack on North Korea as a whole. It is only the regime we don't like. We won't use nuclear weapons on an innocent civilian population. Our problem isn't with them at all.
I am not condoning a nuclear attack on NK. Rather, I am advocating an invasion, or a strike by conventional missiles on Pyongyang and other important areas in NK .
I do not wish for nukes to be used at all in these modern days.
Original post by Bronco2012
Lol at anyone who suggets nuking North Korea is a viable solution.
The radioactive fallout would hurt South Korea as well.
The most viable solution, if the North Koreans are to attack South Korea, Japan or Guam, would be a direct attack on Kim Jong Un, using conventional missiles.
The radioactive fallout would hurt South Korea as well.
The most viable solution, if the North Koreans are to attack South Korea, Japan or Guam, would be a direct attack on Kim Jong Un, using conventional missiles.
Precisely. I fully agree. I do not know what is going through head of those who are advocating a nuclear strike on NK - the aftermath would wreak havoc upon the world and the global economy, if not wreck it altogether.
Original post by the bear
The 15th April 2013 is the 100th anniversary of the birth of Kim Jong Il, grandpa of nutcase supremo Kim Jong Un... he may well celebrate this Special Day by invading South Korea or trying to nuke Japan or America...
Yes. North Korea has already warned the Japanese, British and Russian embassies that they should evacuate immediately. It stated that it will not be able to guarantee the safety of those embassies or its staff after April 10, leading me to believe that it will carry out it threats thereafter.
But I do think it silly and just posturing as they're basically saying "We're going to attack after April 10", which certainly throws any element of surprise down the drain. But maybe they don't need an element of surprise since the United State is clearly not doing anything but drilling with the South Koreans and watching NK closely.
Apparently we also have a nuclear-enabled sub in and around the area, according to Prime Minister Cameron....
No surprise if North Korea conducts new missile test, White House says
WASHINGTON, April 5 (Reuters) - The United States would not be surprised if North Korea were to conduct a new missile test, White House spokesman Jay Carney told reporters on Friday.
Asked about indications that North Korea might be preparing to launch a test missile amid rising tensions in the region, Carney said White House officials had seen the reports.
"We would not be surprised to see them take such an action," Carney said. "We have seen them launch missiles in the past."
WASHINGTON, April 5 (Reuters) - The United States would not be surprised if North Korea were to conduct a new missile test, White House spokesman Jay Carney told reporters on Friday.
Asked about indications that North Korea might be preparing to launch a test missile amid rising tensions in the region, Carney said White House officials had seen the reports.
"We would not be surprised to see them take such an action," Carney said. "We have seen them launch missiles in the past."
Does anyone know when the North Koreans first gained nuclear capabilities?
Original post by Narutopolaris
Does anyone else feel a strange form of euphoria whilst this is all happening? I mean, imagine if War would break out! It would be in our lifetime, without the UK taking part; we could watch nations annihilate themselves for the first time in our history! 
Im so pumped up for war
Im so pumped up for war Yeah and all that fallout and dust which will affect us...
Original post by sugar-n-spice
Does anyone know when the North Koreans first gained nuclear capabilities?
2006 they did their first test. Although since they don't have ICMB's they aren't much of a threat to EUrope or the US
If the United states is really so bothered about human suffering why does it not pour its arms spending into totally eradicating human hunger, thirst and providing basic medicines for all?
Why are the people suffering in countries with ideologies other than its own the only ones it cares about with anything more than tokenism?
I'm sorry but the nonsense about stopping this evil regime by invading being anywhere near the top of priorities for doing good in the world just shows an amount of top down control that risks approaching that of countries that don't bother with the pretence of democracy and freedom.
Why are the people suffering in countries with ideologies other than its own the only ones it cares about with anything more than tokenism?
I'm sorry but the nonsense about stopping this evil regime by invading being anywhere near the top of priorities for doing good in the world just shows an amount of top down control that risks approaching that of countries that don't bother with the pretence of democracy and freedom.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by green.tea
If the United states is really so bothered about human suffering why does it not pour its arms spending into totally eradicating human hunger, thirst and providing basic medicines for all?
Why are the people suffering in countries with ideologies other than its own the only ones it cares about with anything more than tokenism?
I'm sorry but the nonsense about stopping this evil regime by invading being anywhere near the top of priorities for doing good in the world just shows an amount of top down control that risks approaching that of countries that don't bother with the pretence of democracy and freedom.
Why are the people suffering in countries with ideologies other than its own the only ones it cares about with anything more than tokenism?
I'm sorry but the nonsense about stopping this evil regime by invading being anywhere near the top of priorities for doing good in the world just shows an amount of top down control that risks approaching that of countries that don't bother with the pretence of democracy and freedom.
It doesn't. The United States sells a hell of lot of weapons - it especially helps to destabilise many African countries 'til this day by its arms trades - but Russia and China are no better in that regard.
Clearly money is of utmost importance.
Having said that, I believe that if the United States invaded NK, it would be due to the threats - the release of millions of North Korean from suffering would be a welcome byproduct.
(edited 11 years ago)
A great article:
How a Second Korean War Would Harm the US Economy
Every nation that takes on the U.S. military loses. So the armchair generals gaming out a war on the Korean peninsula typically assume that if fighting erupted, North Korea could bloody the South but would quickly be crushed as American forces and their South Korean allies retaliated with overwhelming force.
Real generals know, of course, that wars are messy, unpredictable, and never the cakewalk that desk jockeys tend to predict. In fact, if the recent saber-rattling between North and South Korea escalated into outright war, it could be far bloodier, and exact more damage on the global economy, than most people imagine.
Back in 1953, when the armistice halting the war went into effect, Korea was considered a geographically strategic landmass, but its role in the global economy was insignificant. That has changed. South Korea is now a prosperous democracy with the world's 15th largest economy. It's the home of prominent global corporations such as Samsung, Hyundai and LG. As the sixth largest trading partner of the United States, South Korea plays a key role in the global supply chain for many important products....
How a Second Korean War Would Harm the US Economy
Every nation that takes on the U.S. military loses. So the armchair generals gaming out a war on the Korean peninsula typically assume that if fighting erupted, North Korea could bloody the South but would quickly be crushed as American forces and their South Korean allies retaliated with overwhelming force.
Real generals know, of course, that wars are messy, unpredictable, and never the cakewalk that desk jockeys tend to predict. In fact, if the recent saber-rattling between North and South Korea escalated into outright war, it could be far bloodier, and exact more damage on the global economy, than most people imagine.
Back in 1953, when the armistice halting the war went into effect, Korea was considered a geographically strategic landmass, but its role in the global economy was insignificant. That has changed. South Korea is now a prosperous democracy with the world's 15th largest economy. It's the home of prominent global corporations such as Samsung, Hyundai and LG. As the sixth largest trading partner of the United States, South Korea plays a key role in the global supply chain for many important products....
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by HumanSupremacist
You're not serous, are you?
China is massively emerging - it knows what its doing. It wealth isn't situated in a small area and that's it. It is emerging - did you expect it to be exactly like the United States right now? The United States' success is steadily dropping, whilst the likes of China and India are rapidly increasing.
China is a great emerging heavyweight - why on Earth do you think the United States is hesitant and pussy-footing about with North Korea? They invaded Iraq for much much less.
China is massively emerging - it knows what its doing. It wealth isn't situated in a small area and that's it. It is emerging - did you expect it to be exactly like the United States right now? The United States' success is steadily dropping, whilst the likes of China and India are rapidly increasing.
China is a great emerging heavyweight - why on Earth do you think the United States is hesitant and pussy-footing about with North Korea? They invaded Iraq for much much less.
its why i asked the question, theres no need to get like that. I didnt know and didnt want to presume. I havent looked deeply into china
The big, main problem I have with all of this is that innocent North Koreans will probably die in the wake of any retaliation.
Original post by ss_s95
Vietnam war was different - the war between the north and south was essentially a war with the former Soviet Union and China (two huge powers at the time) against the US and its allies.
Now however, Russia and China are unlikely to support North Korea because there's no incentive in store - both countries maintain economic relations with the US and support for NK would greatly damage that. The only other countries willing to support North Korea are Iran and Syria, and even they couldn't match up to the US, put together.
And might I also add that NK is stuck in a time warp - they're improvising on obsolete technology they had since the Vietnam war, while the US has developed its arsenal much further since then.
Now however, Russia and China are unlikely to support North Korea because there's no incentive in store - both countries maintain economic relations with the US and support for NK would greatly damage that. The only other countries willing to support North Korea are Iran and Syria, and even they couldn't match up to the US, put together.
And might I also add that NK is stuck in a time warp - they're improvising on obsolete technology they had since the Vietnam war, while the US has developed its arsenal much further since then.
I'm disputing the fact that NK are in a time warp, but to simply dismiss them is foolish. If they were running around the Korean Peninsula with Bow and Arrows, then fair enough, but they are not. There weapons may well be a bit outdated, but they can still do a great deal of damage, and the NK troops will outnumber the US 2 to 1.
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