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Immigrants and Expatriates
A thought just occurred to me which I've been wondering about, and I haven't really seen it discussed much before, so I'll ask - What is the difference between an "immigrant" and an "expatriate"?
Why is it that say, a British person living in South Africa will be referred to, and call themselves "British expatriates/expats", while a Pakistani person living in the UK will be referred to as a "Pakistani immigrant"?
It sounds as though "immigrant" has some negative connotations associated with it. An immigrant is either a job-stealer, or a lazy person who lives off state benefits (frankly, what else is he supposed to be?) - in any case, it's not good to be an immigrant. But an expatriate is a perfectly acceptable thing to be - someone who's just decided to live in another country.
Is there actually a real difference that I've missed between an immigrant and an expatriate which necessitates two different words, or is it simply a way for western immigrants to suppose they're somehow better than say, african ones?
Why is it that say, a British person living in South Africa will be referred to, and call themselves "British expatriates/expats", while a Pakistani person living in the UK will be referred to as a "Pakistani immigrant"?
It sounds as though "immigrant" has some negative connotations associated with it. An immigrant is either a job-stealer, or a lazy person who lives off state benefits (frankly, what else is he supposed to be?) - in any case, it's not good to be an immigrant. But an expatriate is a perfectly acceptable thing to be - someone who's just decided to live in another country.
Is there actually a real difference that I've missed between an immigrant and an expatriate which necessitates two different words, or is it simply a way for western immigrants to suppose they're somehow better than say, african ones?
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I find it funny how you see British expats living in Spain for 20 years yet have little/no grasp of the Spanish language. Incredibly ironic when complaining about immigrants not knowing how to speak English here.
That is rather ironic - but it could be because they suppose that English is a universal language which everyone is supposed to speak? 
In any case, why do they call themselves British expats instead of immigrants? Is it anything more than snobbery?
In any case, why do they call themselves British expats instead of immigrants? Is it anything more than snobbery?
Yep. British people (especially the la-dee-daa middle-class types!) when outside Europe like referring to themselves as EXPATRIOTS. I once met a bunch of them in a hotel in Bangalore. I made it quite clear to these folks they were little better than immigrants and if they didn't learn my bloody language (Kannada) then these pasty white folks should consider going back to where they bloody come from!
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate with the local population rather than swanning around in suits and hiding in hotels. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'.
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
DISCLAIMER: This was satire. They were not offended. They found it funny. It was intended as a spoof of the average Daily Wail article on immigrants.
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate with the local population rather than swanning around in suits and hiding in hotels. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'.
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
DISCLAIMER: This was satire. They were not offended. They found it funny. It was intended as a spoof of the average Daily Wail article on immigrants.
effofex
Yep. British people (especially the la-dee-daa middle-class types!) when outside Europe like referring to themselves as EXPATRIOTS. I once met a bunch of them in a hotel in Bangalore. I made it quite clear to these folks they were little better than immigrants and if they didn't learn my bloody language (Kannada) I'd send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from!
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
I think thats a bit of an over-reaction.. I doubt you would like it if an english person came up to you and said the same things..
You're an expatriate of the country you leave, and you're and immigrant to the country you go to. The words aren't always interchangeable. But I do think the "British expatriates" refer to themselves that way to distance themselves from the word "immigrant."
EXPATRIATE:
-Higher status and purchasing power.
-Similar or more lavish lifestyle than which he'd have in his home country. Eg. Private car with driver, maid, American/British/International school for the kids, imported food, etc.
-Limited interaction with the local society, except with upper-class people who probably speak fluent English.
-An expat works for a foreign company and gets his salary paid in foreign currency(higher PP).
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
INMIGRANT:
-Usually has lower status and lower purchasing power .
-Living standars may be better or not.
-More interaction with local people. Usually tries to learn the local language.
-Usually employed at less skilled jobs with low/middle remuneration.
-And most importantly, an inmigrant usually moves to another country with the hope of finding a job, settling down, perhaps bringing the rest of the family later... and without professional assistance. Whereas an expat is hired by a foreign employer AT his homecountry, an inmigrant usually 'tries his luck' in a foreign country with good results or not, and of course, it is very risky.
Source: a Spanish expat living in India.
-Higher status and purchasing power.
-Similar or more lavish lifestyle than which he'd have in his home country. Eg. Private car with driver, maid, American/British/International school for the kids, imported food, etc.
-Limited interaction with the local society, except with upper-class people who probably speak fluent English.
-An expat works for a foreign company and gets his salary paid in foreign currency(higher PP).
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
INMIGRANT:
-Usually has lower status and lower purchasing power .
-Living standars may be better or not.
-More interaction with local people. Usually tries to learn the local language.
-Usually employed at less skilled jobs with low/middle remuneration.
-And most importantly, an inmigrant usually moves to another country with the hope of finding a job, settling down, perhaps bringing the rest of the family later... and without professional assistance. Whereas an expat is hired by a foreign employer AT his homecountry, an inmigrant usually 'tries his luck' in a foreign country with good results or not, and of course, it is very risky.
Source: a Spanish expat living in India.
doginthesky
I think thats a bit of an over-reaction.. I doubt you would like it if an english person came up to you and said the same things..
It was in jest. We all had a good giggle over it straight after.
I'm sure they saw the irony. Some English folks have indeed used the same approach on me!
effofex
Yep. British people (especially the la-dee-daa middle-class types!) when outside Europe like referring to themselves as EXPATRIOTS. I once met a bunch of them in a hotel in Bangalore. I made it quite clear to these folks they were little better than immigrants and if they didn't learn my bloody language (Kannada) I'd send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from!
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
effofex
It was in jest. We all had a good giggle over it straight after.
I'm sure they saw the irony. Some English folks have indeed used the same approach on me!
I'm sure they saw the irony. Some English folks have indeed used the same approach on me!
Seriously? With total randomers?
Victor-PP
EXPATRIATE:
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
This is probably true of the majority of expats where I live; they move here when a big company relocates them (usually renting their house for them, paying for their kids school fees etc), and they will often get relocated again after a certain period of time; they're rarely here permanently.
nolongerhearthemusic
You're an expatriate of the country you leave, and you're and immigrant to the country you go to.
Pretty much this though. I think they're terms that can be applied similarly, but from different perspectives, the same way in which someone relocating to another country is both an emigrate and an immigrant at the same time.
effofex
Yep. British people (especially the la-dee-daa middle-class types!) when outside Europe like referring to themselves as EXPATRIOTS. I once met a bunch of them in a hotel in Bangalore. I made it quite clear to these folks they were little better than immigrants and if they didn't learn my bloody language (Kannada) I'd send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from!
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
You're nobody to tell someone what language to learn or who to socialize with, let alone 'send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from'. If they don't learn Kannada, it is their choice. They can have the lifestyle they like and if you don't like it, that's your problem. I don't know if you really came up to them and said that, but if you did, it says a lot about what kind of person you are.
Yeah I wondered that to. Even if you have a high status job, work for a foreign company and have a lavish lifestyle if you come form the third world your an immigrant even if you had a similar lifestyle back home. Also it's irritating how some expats don't make an effort in their host country. Like live in compounds, don't even bother learning the language, send their kids to say the british international school and only socialise with other expats and in general don't make an effort with intergrating other then eating the local cuisine.
Victor-PP
You're nobody to tell someone what language to learn or who to socialize with, let alone 'send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from'. If they don't learn Kannada, it is their choice. They can have the lifestyle they like and if you don't like it, that's your problem. I don't know if you really came up to them and said that, but if you did, it says a lot about what kind of person you are.
I was in the same hotel as them. It was a bit of satire. Get it? They found it FUNNY.
I'm not a fan of FORCING people to learn languages when they relocate abroad.
effofex
Well I'd only known them for an hour.
Mind you, alcohol does function as a useful social lubricant in such situations. One chap found it so funny he nearly fell in the pool.
Mind you, alcohol does function as a useful social lubricant in such situations. One chap found it so funny he nearly fell in the pool.
Well, this is sounding less and less believable each post you make :P
But anywhos, high five my fellow south-indian
effofex
Yep. British people (especially the la-dee-daa middle-class types!) when outside Europe like referring to themselves as EXPATRIOTS. I once met a bunch of them in a hotel in Bangalore. I made it quite clear to these folks they were little better than immigrants and if they didn't learn my bloody language (Kannada) I'd send these pasty white folks back to where they bloody come from!
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
The looks on their faces were priceless! The fact that these folks were supposedly degree-educated and 'managers' was even funnier.
I then proceeded to give them a bloody good lecture on how immigrants like them should integrate (not hide in hotels) with the local population. For some reason they got confused when I started calling them 'ethnic minorities'!
They then went completely red with embarrassment. (or maybe it was sunburn - I'm not sure)...
What a rude post, I doubt you would talk about black immigrants to the UK in such a fashion, nor would you go up to a Pakistani women and demand she intergrated with the natives.
Moe Lester
What a rude post, I doubt you would talk about black immigrants to the UK in such a fashion, nor would you go up to a Pakistani women and demand she intergrated with the natives.
See my above post. It was SATIRE. They found it funny. It was meant in JEST. Some people do indeed have a sense of humour.
FYI, some people DO indeed suggest that immigrants to the UK (expatriots?) should speak English in public and integrate with the natives. Not that I agree with that.
effofex
I was in the same hotel as them. It was a bit of satire. Get it? They found it FUNNY.
I'm not a fan of FORCING people to learn languages when they relocate abroad.
I'm not a fan of FORCING people to learn languages when they relocate abroad.
और वे नरजा नहिन करा रहा था?
I guess you speak hindi, too.
Victor-PP
EXPATRIATE:
-Higher status and purchasing power.
-Similar or more lavish lifestyle than which he'd have in his home country. Eg. Private car with driver, maid, American/British/International school for the kids, imported food, etc.
-Limited interaction with the local society, except with upper-class people who probably speak fluent English.
-An expat works for a foreign company and gets his salary paid in foreign currency(higher PP).
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
INMIGRANT:
-Usually has lower status and lower purchasing power .
-Living standars may be better or not.
-More interaction with local people. Usually tries to learn the local language.
-Usually employed at less skilled jobs with low/middle remuneration.
-And most importantly, an inmigrant usually moves to another country with the hope of finding a job, settling down, perhaps bringing the rest of the family later... and without professional assistance. Whereas an expat is hired by a foreign employer AT his homecountry, an inmigrant usually 'tries his luck' in a foreign country with good results or not, and of course, it is very risky.
Source: a Spanish expat living in India.
-Higher status and purchasing power.
-Similar or more lavish lifestyle than which he'd have in his home country. Eg. Private car with driver, maid, American/British/International school for the kids, imported food, etc.
-Limited interaction with the local society, except with upper-class people who probably speak fluent English.
-An expat works for a foreign company and gets his salary paid in foreign currency(higher PP).
-Moreover, an expatriate will be likely to move to another country with a job contract, established conditions and length of stay abroad, assistance, etc.
INMIGRANT:
-Usually has lower status and lower purchasing power .
-Living standars may be better or not.
-More interaction with local people. Usually tries to learn the local language.
-Usually employed at less skilled jobs with low/middle remuneration.
-And most importantly, an inmigrant usually moves to another country with the hope of finding a job, settling down, perhaps bringing the rest of the family later... and without professional assistance. Whereas an expat is hired by a foreign employer AT his homecountry, an inmigrant usually 'tries his luck' in a foreign country with good results or not, and of course, it is very risky.
Source: a Spanish expat living in India.
The odd thing is that in the UK, 'immigrants' are quite often blamed for not bothering to integrate with the locals, and not learning English, but clustering together and mixing with just their own kind, and speaking their own language.
The living standard of a Pakistani immigrant, for example, is also usually much higher in the UK than it is in Pakistan. Here they'll have their own car, maybe a terraced house, and free healthcare - whereas in rural Pakistan they'd be farming their own food, and living in a wooden thing no bigger than by bedroom.
With regards to status and employment - a fair number are here for unskilled work, but then you also get a great number of doctors, software engineers and others from India, who are still "immigrants".
Further, British expats living in Spain, for example, are often retired - and so their relocation has litte to do with the company they work for moving them there, but more to do with the nice weather.
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