Exeter pro life society - controversies
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Original post by brjf
If we look at the way in which it was used in America during the period of segregation, look at the history of planned parenthood there’s a lot of bad history there. On top of that the use of abortion in practically eliminating those with Down’s syndrome.
What does segregation have to do with this? And what is this 'bad history' ?
I dont see the problem? No one wants to have a disabled child who will die young and require constant care for. Anyone who says otherwise is either ignorant of the requirements or a liar, invariably.
Original post by Napp
What does segregation have to do with this? And what is this 'bad history' ?
I dont see the problem? No one wants to have a disabled child who will die young and require constant care for. Anyone who says otherwise is either ignorant of the requirements or a liar, invariably.
I dont see the problem? No one wants to have a disabled child who will die young and require constant care for. Anyone who says otherwise is either ignorant of the requirements or a liar, invariably.
I guess you and I have a completely different set of morals then
Sounds like you are conflating contraception with birth control.
Contraception is a form of birth control intended to prevent pregnancy from occurring.
Not the purpose of abortion.
Contraception is a form of birth control intended to prevent pregnancy from occurring.
Not the purpose of abortion.
Original post by Napp
As an aside though, how can you argue from a moral perspective and not have religion influence it given these morals almost universally stem from religious ideas...?
Do they? I'm not aware of the Bible or Qur'an or any other original source of religious doctrine clearly expressing a stance against abortion...? From what I can see, the only religious idea of any relevance here is "do not kill/murder people"; one which hopefully all of us already agree with anyway.
From a moral perspective, I would say that there's no logical reason why killing a child before it is born should be considered any more moral than killing one after they're born. (Whereas there are emotional reasons why one might prefer killing a child before it is born e.g. not having seen or directly interacted with it, therefore not having formed any emotional attachment or empathy with it.)
The usual arguments boil down to some form of "it's not developed enough to be considered a child yet". But that's just a matter of drawing a line at some point on a continuous scale to say "this is when killing it becomes immoral". It would be logically just as valid to argue that it's moral to kill a newborn baby because a newborn baby isn't developed enough to be considered an adult yet, and only once it becomes an adult does it become immoral to kill it. Both these arguments have exactly the same structure; they just draw the line at a different point in time. Where exactly you draw the line is logically arbitrary, but it's more emotionally palatable to draw it at some point before birth, before anyone actually sees or interacts with the child. So when people think that killing in general is immoral but abortion is an exception to that rule, I see that as a logical inconsistency in their position, likely held due to a combination of self-interest and emotional palatability (though people are rarely ready to admit to that).
None of this explanation that I've given would be found in any religious doctrine. However it is still probably true that on average, a religious person would be more likely to agree with it. I think that's because religious people (especially those who avoid sex before marriage) are far less likely to need abortion to be legal/socially acceptable for reasons of self-interest. If they conceive a child it's probably going to be when they're ready to have one.
(edited 2 years ago)
By all means show me any form of evidence that states women treat abortion as no different than the pill.. there will always be a minority who couldnt give a toss but the idea that any form of majority, let alone a large one do, is absurd. Not to mention that having had one before doesnt make it any less of an unpleasant choice for the woman concerned..
If any lie is being told it is that any notable quantity of people consider abortions a flippant issue. Certainly a woman having forceps shoved up her and a fetus pulled out isnt going top consider it 'just another form of birth control'.
If any lie is being told it is that any notable quantity of people consider abortions a flippant issue. Certainly a woman having forceps shoved up her and a fetus pulled out isnt going top consider it 'just another form of birth control'.
You do know that your conclusiopn isnt anything more than a politically driven assumption right? None of the data in that report says, nor implies, what you're saying?
Nor does it go against what i said for that matter so im not entirely sure what your over all point is? The data doesnt say anyones using it as a substitute for the pill, it doesnt say that people who undergo abortions treat it flippantly (nevermind there is a gross difference between an abortion at a few weeks where you simply take a pill or a medical one..).
As to the other comment, i have no idea what 'lefties' have to do with fox hunting sorry. Theres not much linking 'leftists' to being against ripping animals to pieces with hounds. People with a perverse set of 'morals' maybe who support animal cruelty but thats about it, unless you're saying anyone on the right must support cruel hunting practices?
Nor does it go against what i said for that matter so im not entirely sure what your over all point is? The data doesnt say anyones using it as a substitute for the pill, it doesnt say that people who undergo abortions treat it flippantly (nevermind there is a gross difference between an abortion at a few weeks where you simply take a pill or a medical one..).
As to the other comment, i have no idea what 'lefties' have to do with fox hunting sorry. Theres not much linking 'leftists' to being against ripping animals to pieces with hounds. People with a perverse set of 'morals' maybe who support animal cruelty but thats about it, unless you're saying anyone on the right must support cruel hunting practices?
One of the reasons the author of that article gives for opposing the society is really weird.
"Unlike other political or religious societies, where differences of interpretation are encouraged, ESFL promotes the sole idea that life starts at conception – with little (or no) room for compromise."
That's because the ESFL is an activist society - and it's not at all unique. It's just as ridiculous as criticising the vegan society for not being open to meat-eaters.
"Unlike other political or religious societies, where differences of interpretation are encouraged, ESFL promotes the sole idea that life starts at conception – with little (or no) room for compromise."
That's because the ESFL is an activist society - and it's not at all unique. It's just as ridiculous as criticising the vegan society for not being open to meat-eaters.
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