Ocr A2 Law (criminal): Offical Thread! Watch

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Nicci1187
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#381
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#381
(Original post by lulu7)
no i don't know the reforms. i wasn't aware we had to know the reforms for every defence etc ya know!!!lol
lol this is how much we have to learn!!!!
Well I just thought if criminal damage comes up as an essay (which is has done b4) we're guna need evaluation and reforms...
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zoea85
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(Original post by Nicci1187)
The Law Commission drafted a Bill in 1993 with suggested reforms - nothings been done.
1)INTENTIONALLY CAUSING SERIOUS INJURY - would replace s18 and max sentence would be life.
2)RECKLESSLY CAUSING SERIUOS INJURY - would replace s20 and max penalty increased from 5 years to 7 years
3)INTENTIONALLY OR RECKLESSLY CAUSING INJURY - would replace s47, max sentence 5years
4) NEW OFFENCE OF ASSAULT...guilty of assault if..
a - intentionallly or recklessly apply force or cause an impact on the body of another OR
b - intentionally or recklessly cause a person to believe that such force or impact is imminent
BOTH WOUL REPLACE CURRENT ASSAULT AND BATTERY - max sentence 6 months

Transmission of disease would only come under CLAUSE 1 because it would be wrong to criminalise reckless transmission of minor diseases eg- measles AND wrong to discriminate against those with AIDS

Arguable that gap between clauses 2 and 3 should be widenened. Not 7/5 but 10/5 or 7/3 years
OOOO I was struggling on that part, that's just what I needed!!!!! THANK YOUUUU SO MUCH!!!XXX
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Nicci1187
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No probz, it helps me revise lol
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sonya_p
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#384
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#384
can sum1 clarify the ghosh test to me! its confusing me big time!
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zoea85
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(Original post by sonya_p)
can sum1 clarify the ghosh test to me! its confusing me big time!
This is what I have:

The case of Ghosh created a two part test, part objective and part subjective, to help the court decide when a person can be said to be dishonest.
First, the jury has to consider whether the defendant behaved dishonestly according to the standards of a reason able person (this is the objective part).
Second, the jury must consider whether the defendant themselves believed they were behaving dishonestly.
If the answer to both these questions is YES then the defendant can be said to have behaved dishonestly.

I think thats right...
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Multiplexed
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(Original post by sonya_p)
can sum1 clarify the ghosh test to me! its confusing me big time!
There is no further definition of dishonest. The courts have had to decide whether to apply an objective test or a subjective test. However, the C/A tried to reach a compromise between these two positions in the case of R V GHOSH - the C/A laid down the following guidelines for juries. A jury must ask itself two questions:

1. Would the defendant's conduct be regarded as dishonest by the ordinary standards of reasonable and honest people?

If the jury decides it would not then the defendant must be acquitted, if the jury decided that it would then it must ask itself a further question

2. Did the defendant realise that his conduct would be regarded as dishonest by the standards of reasonable and honest people?

If 1 & 2 are satisfied it does not matter that the defendant himself considers his actions to have been honest. The test is whether he recognises that 'reasonable honest people' would think that it was dishonest, regardless of what he actually though.
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sonya_p
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#387
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thanks for the help zoe and multiplexed.

makes sense
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dilated
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#388
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#388
anyone think "Participation" will come up as an essay question for criminal law 1?
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Ben_Stephenson
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#389
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No..parties was on in January.

Further to the definition of dishonesty, in statute there are 3 principles where the person would not be deemed dishonest.

1. Where the person believed they had a right in law to deprive the other of it.
2. Where the person believed that the deprived would have consented to the appropriation, had they been aware.
3. Where the person cannot trace the owner through reasonable steps (as it appears to THEM).
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Dave_G03
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#390
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#390
IM PANICING NOW! IVE ONLY DONE NON FATALS SOOO MUCH MORE TO LEARN FOR CRIMINAL LAW 2!

is every1 certain that theft and a defence will come up?

In the problem question i mean
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sonya_p
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#391
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do we need to learn obtaining property by deception? its in my book with making off without payment.
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ebarrett4
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#392
(Original post by sonya_p)
do we need to learn obtaining property by deception? its in my book with making off without payment.
Hi, yeah I would because we have had practice scenarios in which, making off without payment has come up as well as obtaining property/services by deception.
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sonya_p
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(Original post by ebarrett4)
Hi, yeah I would because we have had practice scenarios in which, making off without payment has come up as well as obtaining property/services by deception.

err thats no good! :eek: i have to cram so much in now!
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ebarrett4
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(Original post by sonya_p)
err thats no good! :eek: i have to cram so much in now!
Oh im sorry! didnt mean to panic you, I would literally just learn a paragraph on each for when your stating the law in the scenario. How are you feeling about the synoptic paper? x
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sonya_p
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(Original post by ebarrett4)
Oh im sorry! didnt mean to panic you, I would literally just learn a paragraph on each for when your stating the law in the scenario. How are you feeling about the synoptic paper? x
at the moment im not feeling anything about synoptic.... i have refused to think about it until i get my criminal law 2 and literature exam out of the way.

but i assume it will not be that bad....
i am going to make sure i know statutory and judicial properly.
obviously im learning robbery and burglary now so its not that much of a problem really.

what about u?
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Multiplexed
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(Original post by sonya_p)
at the moment im not feeling anything about synoptic.... i have refused to think about it until i get my criminal law 2 and literature exam out of the way.

but i assume it will not be that bad....
i am going to make sure i know statutory and judicial properly.
obviously im learning robbery and burglary now so its not that much of a problem really.

what about u?
Im doing the exact same thing, synoptic wont be that hard. Theres only a few things to revise. Can be done in a day.
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sonya_p
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(Original post by Multiplexed)
Im doing the exact same thing, synoptic wont be that hard. Theres only a few things to revise. Can be done in a day.
weird how they have set majority of the marks for synoptic... :confused:
for criminal law 2 there are about 19 elements, 20 if you add obtaining property by deception.

hmmm

:rolleyes:
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sonya_p
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ok...im getting really irritated now! im doing some past papers. where i think its ABH, it turns out to GBH s20 or s18.

if some one hits the person in the face and that person bleeds, is it ABH? or GBH?

you will bleed if there is a breakage of the skin right? but in the book its ABH. im getting confused
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Multiplexed
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(Original post by sonya_p)
ok...im getting really irritated now! im doing some past papers. where i think its ABH, it turns out to GBH s20 or s18.

if some one hits the person in the face and that person bleeds, is it ABH? or GBH?

you will bleed if there is a breakage of the skin right? but in the book its ABH. im getting confused
Ah.

Start with the least serious offence you think it is, in this case ABH. Then work up to s.20 & s.18 if possible. You dont have to say just one single offence otherwise how are you meant to get AO2 marks?
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sonya_p
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(Original post by Multiplexed)
Ah.

Start with the least serious offence you think it is, in this case ABH. Then work up to s.20 & s.18 if possible. You dont have to say just one single offence otherwise how are you meant to get AO2 marks?


ohhh so there is no definite answer! no wonder i was getting so confused! lol cheers.
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