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    Was a monster, a dictator who should never have dictated. Sent too many people to their deaths, before, during and after the war for his foolish 'dream'. A criminal who was scared of his own shadow, a hero? I think not.

    Do any of you regard him as the saviour of humanity or even an idol, influence or inspiration?
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    Without Stalin..there wouldnt be anyone for you to rant about. So, because of that..he was an important figure ..oh and he was successful in his own right
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    I see him as a neccesary evil.....
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    He was a bad man, but he helped to defeat a badder man.


    Thats my advanced summary of the situation.
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    The idol of angsty, spotty teenage communists. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    I see him as a neccesary evil.....
    Likewise, he was a big man, and big men do make big mistakes, however a lot of his mistakes are unforgivable.
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    (Original post by ScotlandStandUp)
    Likewise, he was a big man, and big men do make big mistakes, however a lot of his mistakes are unforgivable.
    you are right, but if anybody had that much power, he can no longer be what he was, he will try to instill his beliefs in others, because he believes he is right and the people (appear to)believe him also.

    power corrupts.....

    Just look at all the kings in the world, how many tyrants, how many saints.....
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    you are right, but if anybody had that much power, he can no longer be what he was, he will try to instill his beliefs in others, because he believes he is right and the people (appear to)believe him also.

    power corrupts.....

    Just look at all the kings in the world, how many tyrants, how many saints.....
    Power does indeed corrupt the corruptable, however he should never have even gotten close to power, as Lenin wrote in his will, he wasn't right for the job.
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    (Original post by ScotlandStandUp)
    Power does indeed corrupt the corruptable, however he should never have even gotten close to power, as Lenin wrote in his will, he wasn't right for the job.
    Yes, how many time have children and even adults disobeyed their parents and the results are mixed, if your parents told you not to do something you despertely wanted what would you have done, stop......

    another thing, everyone is corruptable, it just takes a bit more for some people......
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    Yes, how many time have children and even adults disobeyed their parents and the results are mixed, if your parents told you not to do something you despertely wanted what would you have done, stop......

    another thing, everyone is corruptable, it just takes a bit more for some people......
    There's a difference between doing something in your house and taking over a country, he should've been stopped...

    As for everyone is corruptable, I disagree, sure you can try but some just seem to give you the brick wall stance.
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    I see him as a neccesary evil.....
    this
    the things he did are unforgivable, every family in russia has lost people to his horiffic purges

    however without stalin's brutal but rapid industrialisation of the USSR in the 30s germany may well have won on the european theatre of the war, resulting in even greater loss of life

    saying that Stolypin's economic reforms in the early 20th C were analysed and apparently if the russian empire wasnt broken apart and the revolution didn't happen, its economy would have surpassed what was achieved by stalin in 193-something, ie before the war

    but obv that raises the point of what would have happened if the russian empire didnt pull out of WWI :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by ScotlandStandUp)
    There's a difference between doing something in your house and taking over a country, he should've been stopped...

    As for everyone is corruptable, I disagree, sure you can try but some just seem to give you the brick wall stance.

    Now you sound like someone from our time. who could have stopped stalin, he was sick, but he was clever, he used his allies until they were no use and the rest are just all too scared, he killed millions on a daily basis, I wouldn't have the balls to tell him he was wrong, would you, be a realist......

    I hate to disappoint, but I disagree again, in the bottom of everyone's heart their is something they want, but they can't have but they might be able to in the future, but they don't know, if you can find it and use it then everyone is corruptable, some people is hard to find because good on them they have a truly happy life, like a old married couple with sons and daughters and grandchildren, married for 30 years, millions in the bank, first absis with the queen. uncorruptable. no you tempt them with the idea of immortality, if you are convincing enough they will give(pretty hard). I guess what I am trying to say is we are just all human, bothing more noithing less, greed is what made us made this far into evolution, use it to your own good advantage, but never try to deny it unless you are a christian then I will be out of words....
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    (Original post by Vivisteiner)
    He was a bad man, but he helped to defeat a badder man.


    Thats my advanced summary of the situation.
    =/
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    (Original post by *BCM*)
    this
    the things he did are unforgivable, every family in russia has lost people to his horiffic purges

    however without stalin's brutal but rapid industrialisation of the USSR in the 30s germany may well have won on the european theatre of the war, resulting in even greater loss of life

    saying that Stolypin's economic reforms in the early 20th C were analysed and apparently if the russian empire wasnt broken apart and the revolution didn't happen, its economy would have surpassed what was achieved by stalin in 193-something, ie before the war

    but obv that raises the point of what would have happened if the russian empire didnt pull out of WWI :rolleyes:
    A true historian, balancing the good and bad. but ashame we can't see what would have happened, I believe stalin was neccesary but I don't agree with everything he did.....
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    A true historian, balancing the good and bad. but ashame we can't see what would have happened, I believe stalin was neccesary but I don't agree with everything he did.....
    yes, very much so but what has happened, has happened and we cannot change it, merely analyse it and learn from the mistakes - he DID achieve the "end" because the USSR did beat germany - but the "means" certainly didn't justify it at all, it could have been done without the bloodcurdling loss of life of the purges
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    (Original post by *BCM*)
    yes, very much so but what has happened, has happened and we cannot change it, merely analyse it and learn from the mistakes - he DID achieve the "end" because the USSR did beat germany - but the "means" certainly didn't justify it at all, it could have been done without the bloodcurdling loss of life of the purges
    Are you applying to do history in uni, I just never heard anyone give a balanced view on satlin except myself:p: , Yes you are right and think how stalin would have looked if the cold war got hot.....

    Bad......
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    I am sort glad and disappointed everyone know so much about Stalin but not about Mao, seeing how china have a higher standing in the world than Russia in the world(I think).....
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    (Original post by DR_X)
    Are you applying to do history in uni, I just never heard anyone give a balanced view on satlin except myself , Yes you are right and think how stalin would have looked if the cold war got hot.....

    Bad......
    see sig, above :p: lol - i did history up to GCSE only but i've been interested in it as far as i can remember - also i was born in russia, so obv this particular historical figure is of direct relevance to me

    i don't think that it would ever have happened thou tbh, i reckon stalin knew that a nuclear engagement would be too devastating - and at the time the USA had a larger fleet of strategic bombers AND more bombs so the engagement would have hardly been on "fair" terms, if such a word can apply - plus the USSR would keep the moral high ground by having the USA as the only state that has used nuclear weapons outside of testing

    re mao: russian and soviet events has had much more impact on european history than chinese ones, so obv it would be studied much more in european schools - also the whole cold war thing of "soviets are bad" is ringing even now imo :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by *BCM*)
    see sig, above :p: lol - i did history up to GCSE only but i've been interested in it as far as i can remember - also i was born in russia, so obv this particular historical figure is of direct relevance to me

    i don't think that it would ever have happened thou tbh, i reckon stalin knew that a nuclear engagement would be too devastating - and at the time the USA had a larger fleet of strategic bombers AND more bombs so the engagement would have hardly been on "fair" terms, if such a word can apply - plus the USSR would keep the moral high ground by having the USA as the only state that has used nuclear weapons outside of testing

    re mao: russian and soviet events has had much more impact on european history than chinese ones, so obv it would be studied much more in european schools - also the whole cold war thing of "soviets are bad" is ringing even now imo :rolleyes:
    now I am impressed, not only a fairist but a cambridge fairist.....

    I suppose, but he was a bit kooKoo so you never know.....

    I suppose you are right about china.....
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    Without Stalin, we would have ended up with a huge Nazi empire with that Austrian bugger in charge. Then they would have linked up with the Japanese and could have won the war, which is ****.
 
 
 
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