The Student Room Group

TSR Doctors' Society Part II

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Original post by Ghotay
Had a ‘full-blown’ covid patient in A&E, went to ITU. First we’ve had in a long time. My brother works in a nearby hospital and has had several new cases come through in the last few days. Feels like the second peak is starting... anyone else having similar experiences?


Not so far, touch wood. Our unit is covid free and we haven’t had any proper first wave covids for a good while.
Honestly have no idea how many covid patients we have. The hospital has decided for a couple of months not to make this public (hospital staff) knowledge for some reason. I'm seeing some relaxation of PPE use though (at an individual basis not hospital policy) and worry about in hospital transmission
Original post by Anonymous
Curious to know what other registrar rotas are like. Our current medical senior rota is working one shift somewhere in between 1 in every 2 or 3 weekends (if you include nights). Eg you might work 5 days on a ward and then an afternoon/evening on the Saturday, then be back in Monday for another 5 days. Or 5 ward days and a Sunday morning and then back in for the 5 weekdays. You get the idea. Some times you might work a full weekend with other out of hours shifts and zero days around about it. If you are on a ward block you do not get a zero hour day during the week but do a 6 day/5day/6 day/5 day week sort of pattern. Shifts require you to be in the hospital and working, and are not on call from home. Week day shifts are 9.5 hours and the weekend shifts are a variety of lengths, from 5 to 10 hours long.

Is this level of out hours/weekend commitment normal for a senior middlegrade level medical rota? Hospital is a district general.

I just can't see myself coping with this for any length of time as almost every weekend is written off - either because you are in one day of it, or because you are recovering.


That sounds complicated. I'm LTFT but our FT reg rota is generally a 1:8, so working two weekends (1 days,1 nights) in an 8 week cycle. We get quite a few zero days both because of this and because our standard days are 10 hours (7.30-5.30) so need zeroes to be in compliant.
Is JRCTB the best way to go about logging e portfolio stuff during FY3? Or are there cheaper alternatives? :biggrin:
Original post by Stuffme
Is JRCTB the best way to go about logging e portfolio stuff during FY3? Or are there cheaper alternatives? :biggrin:


There is in fact a free alternative :tongue: I asked my new hospital's postgraduate centre to re-allocate me to Horus as a non-training grade. They had to send some emails and it took a bit of chasing up, but eventually it happened so that was quite a bit of money saved compared with signing up for a Royal College portfolio.
Original post by Stuffme
Is JRCTB the best way to go about logging e portfolio stuff during FY3? Or are there cheaper alternatives? :biggrin:


Original post by Democracy
There is in fact a free alternative :tongue: I asked my new hospital's postgraduate centre to re-allocate me to Horus as a non-training grade. They had to send some emails and it took a bit of chasing up, but eventually it happened so that was quite a bit of money saved compared with signing up for a Royal College portfolio.

Excuse my ignorance - why do you need a portfolio during FY3?
Original post by Hygeia
This is actually a question I have thought about in the past (and discussed with hubby) - my job is very much a part of maintaining stable mental health for me and I wouldn't even consider stopping work if I won the lottery. I love my job and would potentially drop from 70% LTFT to 60% if money wasn't an issue but otherwise would want to continue working. I have been shielding for the last 3 months and unable to work properly and it has really highlighted how important my job is to me!

Do you not think it would be different if you weren't shielding though? If you were able to do other things, and didn't have the stress of covid hovering in the background?
Original post by Stuffme
Is JRCTB the best way to go about logging e portfolio stuff during FY3? Or are there cheaper alternatives? :biggrin:


Is ePortfolio necessary during F3 ? I was hoping to have a year off 😢😢😢
Original post by nexttime
Excuse my ignorance - why do you need a portfolio during FY3?

My FY3 was a full time post and I had an appraisal at the end so this seemed the easiest way of keeping things together. I didn't actually use it that much in the end (certainly not compared with the Foundation Programme with its mandatory 15 reflections per job :angry:) so I didn't want to pay hefty fees.

I did a couple of reflections, a few DOPS, uploaded my teaching bits and bobs, course certificates, pdf of the poster I did and that was that. Certainly not worth paying £169 for.
I'm not sure why my question about winning the lottery was so troublesome and warranted a report and deletion. I would recommend the one who reported my comment to think more charitably about one and other. The exercise didn't need to be shared on this platform if you didn't need to, it's valuable if you do it in private too (which I encourage!), and if it stimulated a productive discussion then that's fantastic.
@Democracy Hey man, bit of a tangent but I am not an applicant yearning for personal statement fodder, my personal statement was submitted long ago, however if I was then that shouldn't be a problem, right? There's nothing inherently wrong with sharing our perspective on these matters, after all who are aspiring medics going to come to to understand our perspective within this profession if we as a collective treat our experience as sacred secrets? (I'm not saying you do; this was directed more-so towards the person who reported my question).

For context, this was a practice I learnt from a YouTuber Ali Abdaal (an FY3 doctor) who asked many of his colleagues this question "if you won the lottery would you still practice medicine" and received an almost unanimous "Absolutely not, I would be out of this profession within the next minute". Before entering medicine myself all but only one (GP) of the countless doctors I had interacted with expressed that pursuing medicine was not a good idea and instead finance (or any other high-paying profession) would provide me with a much happier life. It seems a relevant conundrum within our community and perhaps it might be valuable to someone if they we were to address it, that's all. But hey.. maybe not.
Original post by Democracy
There is in fact a free alternative :tongue: I asked my new hospital's postgraduate centre to re-allocate me to Horus as a non-training grade. They had to send some emails and it took a bit of chasing up, but eventually it happened so that was quite a bit of money saved compared with signing up for a Royal College portfolio

Ahh I may need to ask mine. A consultant in the North West Thames region gave me a job on spot so I asked about it but he said unless I extended my 6 month post to 12 months they can't provide me with one :'(

May ask postgrad then and see what happens..
Original post by Democracy
My FY3 was a full time post and I had an appraisal at the end so this seemed the easiest way of keeping things together. I didn't actually use it that much in the end (certainly not compared with the Foundation Programme with its mandatory 15 reflections per job :angry:) so I didn't want to pay hefty fees.

I did a couple of reflections, a few DOPS, uploaded my teaching bits and bobs, course certificates, pdf of the poster I did and that was that. Certainly not worth paying £169 for.

so you decided yourself how much to do? I think ill just replicate how much I did in foundation years...2 CBD + 3 mini-cex every 4 months with 1 reflection..
Original post by Stuffme
so you decided yourself how much to do? I think ill just replicate how much I did in foundation years...2 CBD + 3 mini-cex every 4 months with 1 reflection..

Why though.
Original post by Stuffme
so you decided yourself how much to do? I think ill just replicate how much I did in foundation years...2 CBD + 3 mini-cex every 4 months with 1 reflection..


Only 1 reflection !! The dream, as an F1, I had to write 6 reflections for each rotation. 🤦🏻*♀️
Original post by Democracy
My FY3 was a full time post and I had an appraisal at the end so this seemed the easiest way of keeping things together. I didn't actually use it that much in the end (certainly not compared with the Foundation Programme with its mandatory 15 reflections per job :angry:) so I didn't want to pay hefty fees.

I did a couple of reflections, a few DOPS, uploaded my teaching bits and bobs, course certificates, pdf of the poster I did and that was that. Certainly not worth paying £169 for.

You are going to love GP - the target is 3 reflections per week :tongue:
Original post by Anonymous
You are going to love GP - the target is 3 reflections per week :tongue:

I reflect every year on the 20+ compulsory e-learning modules that e-learning is not a style that suits me well and does not engage further thought processes, nor alter my practice! All learning should be reflected upon - otherwise, what is the point in doing it? Which is often my reflection for much of our compulsory stuff......
Original post by Anonymous
I'm not sure why my question about winning the lottery was so troublesome and warranted a report and deletion. I would recommend the one who reported my comment to think more charitably about one and other. The exercise didn't need to be shared on this platform if you didn't need to, it's valuable if you do it in private too (which I encourage!), and if it stimulated a productive discussion then that's fantastic.
@Democracy Hey man, bit of a tangent but I am not an applicant yearning for personal statement fodder, my personal statement was submitted long ago, however if I was then that shouldn't be a problem, right? There's nothing inherently wrong with sharing our perspective on these matters, after all who are aspiring medics going to come to to understand our perspective within this profession if we as a collective treat our experience as sacred secrets? (I'm not saying you do; this was directed more-so towards the person who reported my question).

For context, this was a practice I learnt from a YouTuber Ali Abdaal (an FY3 doctor) who asked many of his colleagues this question "if you won the lottery would you still practice medicine" and received an almost unanimous "Absolutely not, I would be out of this profession within the next minute". Before entering medicine myself all but only one (GP) of the countless doctors I had interacted with expressed that pursuing medicine was not a good idea and instead finance (or any other high-paying profession) would provide me with a much happier life. It seems a relevant conundrum within our community and perhaps it might be valuable to someone if they we were to address it, that's all. But hey.. maybe not.


The impression I got from the "hey doctors!!!" intro, curious use of anon, and general vagueness regarding whether you're a doctor or not is that....you might not be, in which case, it's not very fair to be (mis)using the anon function here when the rest of the forum is clearly set up for those kind of questions. If that's not the case then my apologies.

(I didn't report your post though :tongue:).
Original post by Anonymous
You are going to love GP - the target is 3 reflections per week :tongue:

So I've heard :tongue: I feel like I'm back in the zone for it after a couple of years respite though.

Original post by Stuffme
so you decided yourself how much to do? I think ill just replicate how much I did in foundation years...2 CBD + 3 mini-cex every 4 months with 1 reflection..


I did, but not in a prescriptive, pre-planned way and I didn't want to replicate the Foundation Programme with the every four months thing. I did things that interested me anyway e.g. med student teaching, wrote an OSCE station and end of year MCQs, attended courses, etc, and uploaded the relevant evidence. Do you actually find CBDs and MiniCEXs helpful?

I did two or three reflections over the course of the year: on PACES, on a datix, on ?something else. Also did an MSF because it was part of the appraisal requirement. My appraisal went fine and my supervisor was more than happy with what I'd done over the year.
(edited 3 years ago)
Original post by UnelmaDr
Hi all =) last time I was here was as an applicant, so it's really lovely to see familiar accounts that helped me back then <3

I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this.
My foundation program was recently changed due to "human error" - the program entered in Oriel earlier in the year had already been allocated. I found out recently that's the case when the new hospital contacted me to sign a contract (I've got new set of rotations in different hospitals, which will now required me to drive 35-40mins rather than a 5 min drive/walk). It seems that there's nothing I/they can do now (although this is from those who made the error in the first place).

Does this happen often during junior doctor training? Deaneries forgetting we are human beings with lives and just change things as they see fit, without even contacting us to tell us there's been an error or trying to mitigate the damage they've caused? I'm not naive, but I just expected better and was expecting to be treated with respect, rather than being essentially told that these rotations meet F1 competency requirements and that's all that matters (though I agree that's the priority, we have an allocation/ranking system for a reason and we work hard to get good scores). Just felt like a slap in the face, esp as I was starting on my dream rotation (a specialty I wanted to explore) with really nice hours, which would've enabled me to do few non-medicine related projects.

Sadly it's not unheard of at all. It does suck but there is really very little you can practically do to get out of the hole they put you in, other than just cracking on. If you've now got a long commute you can try and weasel them out of some financial support to alleviate cost of travel, but beyond that you're SOOL. Ultimately the admin folks only priority is to ensure safe staffing levels of wards and filling rota gaps, and they'll cause absolute disruption to individual trainees if required.

It seems the only way to make amends is to try and get taster weeks - you could perhaps try and negotiate extra ones as payback for them switching you off the rotation you want so late in the day? But no guarantees.
Original post by UnelmaDr
Hi all =) last time I was here was as an applicant, so it's really lovely to see familiar accounts that helped me back then <3

I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this.
My foundation program was recently changed due to "human error" - the program entered in Oriel earlier in the year had already been allocated. I found out recently that's the case when the new hospital contacted me to sign a contract (I've got new set of rotations in different hospitals, which will now require me to drive 35-40mins rather than a 5 min drive/walk). It seems that there's nothing I/they can do now (although this is coming from those who made the error in the first place).

Does this happen often during junior doctor training? Deaneries forgetting we are human beings with lives and just change things as they see fit, without even contacting us to tell us there's been an error or trying to mitigate the damage they've caused? I'm not naive, but I just expected better and was expecting to be treated with respect, rather than being essentially told that these rotations meet F1 competency requirements and that's all that matters (though I agree that's the priority, we have an allocation/ranking system for a reason and we work hard to get good scores). Just felt like a slap in the face, esp my first rotation was my dream rotation (a specialty I wanted to explore) with really nice hours, which would've enabled me to do few non-medicine related projects.

Maybe we should just forget to do the most basic aspects of our jobs and see how that goes.

Yeah I agree you should try to at least get expenses. Take to BMA, everything you can. I assume they've massively breached the 6 week rota deadline? That's something on your side at least.

In terms of do you get screwed higher up in training... I think its pretty similar when you're F2/SHO, and then after... yes, but in a different way I think? And people are generally a lot more invested in the department they are working in so mind less? What I mean is, errors like yours are a lot less frequent, with rotas often under the control of regs/consultants, or at least, an administrator who is going to have to frequently deal with you. You're given a lot more autonomy in general.

However you run into other types of being screwed over - you might have very distant rotations (we rotate for 6 months to somewhere >2 hours drive away, so far that you exceed the maximum mileage allowance for expenses, and on call rotas requiring you to pay for accommodation nearby out of your own pocket). Another is, for example, if someone goes off sick for the on call one of the SpRs has to cover it. No ifs or buts - we have to, drawing names out of a hat if necessary. Fortunately its rare for me but on one paeds rotation I had the SpRs would get regularly called out of a day shift at 3pm to work the night shift that night- horrid. And just in general... I have worked far more late days, and come in on days off, vastly more often in my 1 year as an SpR then I did in 3 years as an SHO. But like I say, I (and we) mind less as its our department now and we would see the consequences if we didn't step up. That's what responsibility is about I guess.

But I think it will depend on the department/speciality. For example, CMT (or IMT now) is notorious for just being two/three more years of anonymous rotations, still an anonymous face on a rota that no one cares about.

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