Degrees are now way too easy, discuss.

Original post by Mediocrity

Each university marks its own papers internally, it is not the same as the exam boards we have for GCSEs and A Level.

Not true.

My university first marked it internally, then sent the papers for external review.

Reply 81

-=|Jay|=-

18

In my subject (History), getting a 2.1 is really very easy if you put in any work whatsoever. What really separated people was the 1sts. There are literally a handful. From about 100 graduates there were like 7 or 8 1sts, 50 or more 2.1s, 30 or so 2.2s and the rest fails or 3rds.

I almost killed myself getting a 1st, and even then I only scraped it. The gap in effort between a 60 and a 70 in my university was monumental.

Don't expect to be considered too different though, a 1st is basically just 'ok so you go to the top of the academic pile, now let's sift through on other criteria such as extra-curriculars and who ACTUALLY has experience'.

Reply 82

Original post by nExow

I'm inclined to agree with you, but I won't declare so until I've some reliable numbers.

There:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10557068

I studied Computer Science, it was hard , and it reflects from that graph. Only half get 2.1 or over. It's because of the Mickey mouse degrees out there, that mine and others degree are being devalued.

You can no way say it is an even playing field for that reason.

You also have to take into account that the number of people going to university has risen. Which translates to more people obtaining a 2.1. The subject and degree mark is what employers should look at imo.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 83

Original post by Iamyourfather

Wiki isn't a good reference.

Also yeah all students must reach at least the same level of subject understanding at degree level but the degree of academic rigor seems to fluctuate from uni to uni.

To prove I'm not biased: I'm studying biochemistry at Essex but I'll be a fool to think my course is equally as hard and as demanding as a biochemistry degree at Cambridge.

With a 2.1, as you have done a science, you will be fine in terms of employment.

Nobody really cares after you land your first job.

You can still do well if you didn't go to Cambridge providing that you think outside of the box when racking up work experience.

Reply 84

Klix88

17

Original post by fat_hobbit

Not true.

My university first marked it internally, then sent the papers for external review.

I think it depends on the university as they're allowed to implement their own regimes.

For example at my undergrad uni, all papers are first and second marked, internally. After this, all First and Fail papers are sent for external moderation. Of the papers marked between 40-69%, a percentage each of 3rd, 2:2 and 2:1 papers are selected at random for external moderation.

There has only been one instance in the last ten years, when all of a subject's papers were sent for external moderation. This followed an internal re-marking process, after errors were found in both the original marking and internal second marking. The external moderator upheld all but one of the re-marked results. Essentially, each paper was eventually marked or checked four times, before the uni's Exam Board would ratify the results.

Reply 85

OP

We're wondering off point a little here, but I partook in a range of EC's, was head of a society and played sport to a very high level. In addition, this year I have also made in excess of £22,000 profit trading equities on my own account. Yet people with no clue about the financial markets are securing analyst positions at the Gold mine, from my course!

As mentioned, I'm not just looking at IB. I know how competitive it is, I'm looking at any job in the financial sector, or any job in the finance department of a different industry. For example, today I had feedback from an interview last week. It was extremely positive, I was told I provided a range of intelligent answers for the competency based questions but that the position was "a little too senior" for me. Yet I have no luck when applying for graduate schemes because I have no UCAS points, catch 22 situation. I have a long history of work experience in different fields prior to going to University which enable me to provide excellent competency based answers and transferable skills.

Original post by Izzyeviel

What else did you do whilst getting this First? If all you did was study well then no wonder you're struggling to get into IB.

Did you do any Internships? Did you play roles in the student union/societies?

Reply 86

OP

Exactly! I've been applying for any role related to Finance, so Management accounting, finance grad schemes, IB etc. I will be trying those schemes when they re-open.

Original post by MagicNMedicine

If you're at a uni that is sending people to Goldman Sachs as analysts then your degree isn't the problem. What sort of jobs are you going for? I know you said 'everything from basic admin to investment banking' but what field are you really trying to get in to. If you're just carpetbombing employers randomly then your search might not be focused enough.

Have you tried the Bank of England or Government Economic Service graduate schemes? In those your degree won't have signalling power but they have assessment centres that allow you to distinguish yourself if you are good.

Reply 87

Original post by EmptyBracket

We're wondering off point a little here, but I partook in a range of EC's, was head of a society and played sport to a very high level. In addition, this year I have also made in excess of £22,000 profit trading equities on my own account. Yet people with no clue about the financial markets are securing analyst positions at the Gold mine, from my course!

As mentioned, I'm not just looking at IB. I know how competitive it is, I'm looking at any job in the financial sector, or any job in the finance department of a different industry. For example, today I had feedback from an interview last week. It was extremely positive, I was told I provided a range of intelligent answers for the competency based questions but that the position was "a little too senior" for me. Yet I have no luck when applying for graduate schemes because I have no UCAS points, catch 22 situation. I have a long history of work experience in different fields prior to going to University which enable me to provide excellent competency based answers and transferable skills.

The dream is over. Forget it.

Reply 88

OP

The dream will always be alive! This is what is wrong with the automated, Americanised HR system that has polluted the UK graduate job market; I could quite easily now go and get 3 A's in A-level Mathematics, Economics and Business and then fly through the automated system. Would that make me any more employable, of couse not! One of my strengths is that I have proven myself on a tougher path than any A-level student has walked, yet I'm overlooked in this market. My resilience will pay off, mark my words!

Original post by fat_hobbit

The dream is over. Forget it.

Reply 89

Original post by EmptyBracket

The dream will always be alive! This is what is wrong with the automated, Americanised HR system that has polluted the UK graduate job market; I could quite easily now go and get 3 A's in A-level Mathematics, Economics and Business and then fly through the automated system. Would that make me any more employable, of couse not! One of my strengths is that I have proven myself on a tougher path than any A-level student has walked, yet I'm overlooked in this market. My resilience will pay off, mark my words!

I don't understand. How did you get into university with no UCAS points?

If indeed you have no UCAS points, you might as well do you Alevels right now. It will count as first attempt.

Still weird as ****.

I agree with you by the way, I had the same problem with IT Management Consultancy firms - highly qualified, but UCAS points means i am ****ed with the likes of accenture. I got around it due to some not being so anal with their UCAS points requirements.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 90

OP

I did an Access to Higher Education Diploma, which is equivalent to three A-levels. It's a year long course designed for people over 19 who want to enter University but don't have A-levels. But now it had left me with this problem as it doesn't have any UCAS points! Despite this, UCAS state on their website some qualifications (like mine) don't carry UCAS point and they should therefore not be used for employment purposes, but still employers persist in this discriminatory practice.

Original post by fat_hobbit

I don't understand. How did you get into university with no UCAS points?

If indeed you have no UCAS points, you might as well do you Alevels right now. It will count as first attempt.

Still weird as ****.

I agree with you by the way, I had the same problem with IT Management Consultancy firms - highly qualified, but UCAS points means i am ****ed with the likes of accenture. I got around it due to some not being so anal with their UCAS points requirements.

Reply 91

c_al

10

I don't know if the grading scheme is different in here in Scotland, nut at my uni you needed 80% average to get a first, and 65% for a 2.1, and it's the same with people i've spoken to at other Scottish unis. Also, getting a first still seems to be really difficult, as out of over 50 people in my department who graduated this year, only one got a first class.

Reply 92

Original post by EmptyBracket

I did an Access to Higher Education Diploma, which is equivalent to three A-levels. It's a year long course designed for people over 19 who want to enter University but don't have A-levels. But now it had left me with this problem as it doesn't have any UCAS points! Despite this, UCAS state on their website some qualifications (like mine) don't carry UCAS point and they should therefore not be used for employment purposes, but still employers persist in this discriminatory practice.

Do your a levels.

What Uni did you go to?

Reply 93

MagicNMedicine

20

Original post by EmptyBracket

The dream will always be alive! This is what is wrong with the automated, Americanised HR system that has polluted the UK graduate job market; I could quite easily now go and get 3 A's in A-level Mathematics, Economics and Business and then fly through the automated system. Would that make me any more employable, of couse not! One of my strengths is that I have proven myself on a tougher path than any A-level student has walked, yet I'm overlooked in this market. My resilience will pay off, mark my words!

Good stuff, if you've done an Access route then you've had to walk the hard route in where others have had it easy from school, so you know you're a bit mentally tougher than most. Now I can see you feel a bit shafted now because you probably think inferior people are getting jobs and you're getting overlooked just because of not having A levels, so this is ****ing you off big time. I was like this when I was on the dole, and my self confidence turned in to arrogance as a defence against rejection so I came across as a **** and to be honest you come over as a **** too on this thread. I can see why though. You just need to try and wind it in a bit. And yeah I definitely encourage going for those schemes I said before. On the GES one you have to play down any chippiness when you're at the interview though because they are always friendly if you come over as humble/normal but if you have a bit of cockiness they will rinse you. One of my mates (who is in now) got rejected first time because he strutted in a bit like "you mofos are talking to the daddy of economics" and they gave him rock hard questions to pull him down a peg.

Reply 94

SpicyStrawberry

18

I disagree really, 40% of people on my course failed their first year and either had to resit assessments or quit. The rest ranged from just scraping a pass to a 2.1, with a small minority getting firsts. People underestimate what a degree entails or don't adjust to the level of study so find it difficult to get those extra marks. I do think it's odd that to pass you can get more wrong than right, though.

Reply 95

Blue56

15

Original post by EmptyBracket

Grade inflation has eroded the value of a degree; a 2:1 is far too easy to achieve. Every man and his dog has a 2:1 these days, they are practically handed out with packets of cornflakes. This is intensifying competition in the graduate job market; high achievers with overall grades of 80% plus are unable to distinguish themselves from the competition. I have graduated from a top 15 University with a high 1st, yet in the job market I am competing against people who might have a grade as low as 57% (disgustingly, my University awards a 2:1 for achieving 57% or a 1st for 67%!).

The education system is broken; degrees have been watered down; the classification system is a joke (10% difference for grade boundaries is MASSIVE). Discuss.

Edit- to add food for thought, here is an interesting article on this issue. Many people posting on this thread seem very keen to disagree despite the overwhelming evidence, perhaps they find it convenient to deny the facts as they know they themselves are one of those who, without all this dumbing down, would have struggled to achieve "good honours":

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/universityeducation/8235115/Dumbing-down-of-university-grades-revealed.html

What university did you go to?

Reply 96

ladynova

16

the problem is OP you think your degree is enough to land you that dream job. In realty no, you need to have done some degree of work experience or internships in the relevant field.

Anyone who expects a graduate job with just a degree on their cv is delusional.

Also due to the fact more people are going to university than ever before means there are going to be an increase in all degrees and therefore an increase in first degrees. Just because more people have them does not mean they are anything to be sniffed at.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 97

Maxxie

15

I wouldn't know, I didn't do a degree in the past.

Reply 98