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Original post by moggis
UN*******BELIEVABLE!!!!

Believe it or not tryng to make a million in a season is rather tricky even if you have a big bank to play with.

For one thing you need a lot of markets with big limits that are easy to trade.

Year after year one of the easiest markets to make money from is the Champions League top scorer market.

But this season Messi's injury meant that Ronaldos price was ridiculously short and the situation was almost impossible for me to make much money from.


Until last night!

When brilliant Barca scored 6 and Lewandowski and Muller scored thus forcing Ronaldos price up to a juicy 15/8.


So I was just about to do some bets on this new Ronaldo price having spent a leisurely early afternoon ( it's a tough job but.....) reading the Racing Post,posting on here and reading a book when I find that the market is bloody well suspended because some ******* game has kicked off at 3-00 PM!!!!!!!!!!!!!


3-PM on a Wednesday!!!


As I say ....it's not easy making a million.........

:frown:


But of course his price changed, as it's going to be harder for him to become top scorer now as a few people have scored more.
Reply 81
Original post by arichmond64
But of course his price changed, as it's going to be harder for him to become top scorer now as a few people have scored more.



Had to read that a couple of times as I wasn't 100% sure what you're saying.But hopefully I havnt misunderstood.

Yes of course you are right to say that "of course his price changed " and the reason why it changed.

But the point is the following day Real Madrid were playing an inferior team and Ronaldo can usually be relied on to score in those games- in Europe anyway.

Thus I could have bet on him at 15-8 and ,

a) if he didn't score v Shaktar ( or whoever) that 15/8 price either doesn't change or goes out slightly to 2/1

b) he scores 1 goal in which case his price comes down to say 6/4

c ) he scores 2 or more goals and his price is slashed.


As we now know he scored twice and his price was cut to 4/7.


In other words I missed an opportunity* by not realising a game was kicking off.


Sorry if that's not what you meant.



* It's not ideal but I did in fact bet on him scoring 2 goals or more in the game itself at odds of 10-3 in various accumulators. NB I did it for 'insurance' reasons as ideally I only wanted him to score once as I am hoping to make money on this market by betting on other players and hoping one of them wins it.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by moggis
Had to read that a couple of times as I wasn't 100% sure what you're saying.But hopefully I havnt misunderstood.

Yes of course you are right to say that "of course his price changed " and the reason why it changed.

But the point is the following day Real Madrid were playing an inferior team and Ronaldo can usually be relied on to score in those games- in Europe anyway.

Thus I could have bet on him at 15-8 and ,

a) if he didn't score v Shaktar ( or whoever) that 15/8 price either doesn't change or goes out slightly to 2/1

b) he scores 1 goal in which case his price comes down to say 6/4

c ) he scores 2 or more goals and his price is slashed.


As we now know he scored twice and his price was cut to 4/7.


In other words I missed an opportunity* by not realising a game was kicking off.


Sorry if that's not what you meant.



* It's not ideal but I did in fact bet on him scoring 2 goals or more in the game itself at odds of 10-3 in various accumulators. NB I did it for 'insurance' reasons as ideally I only wanted him to score once as I am hoping to make money on this market by betting on other players and hoping one of them wins it.


But all this was factored into the price, like the price was the price because of these things.... if he scores it comes down, if he doesn't it goes up.

I just don't get what you think you know what the bookies/traders/market makers don't/
Reply 83
Original post by arichmond64
But all this was factored into the price, like the price was the price because of these things.... if he scores it comes down, if he doesn't it goes up.

I just don't get what you think you know what the bookies/traders/market makers don't/



Oh ok.

Well there's only one(quick) thing I can say to that I think.Altough I may elaborate at another time.

Cheers.

Spoiler

(edited 8 years ago)
haha, how old are you btw? How long have you been doing this full time for a living? What is your total profit over this time.

I'm genuinely interested because if everything you say is legit then it's pretty damn good, regardless of whether any of us have faith in the system.
The bubble will burst eventually. Least it's sport's betting and not fixed-odds/high octane gambling like roulette or slots.
Reply 86
Original post by Danny the Geezer
The bubble will burst eventually. Least it's sport's betting and not fixed-odds/high octane gambling like roulette or slots.



I believe honesty is important ( unless you've murdered someone and hidden the body rather well) and so let me tell you that my bubble may well burst.

But only because in an effort to prove that this is the best way to bet on football I sail very very close to the wind.

I try to bet at the very limit of what I think is possible.

Cheers
Original post by moggis
I believe honesty is important ( unless you've murdered someone and hidden the body rather well) and so let me tell you that my bubble may well burst.

But only because in an effort to prove that this is the best way to bet on football I sail very very close to the wind.

I try to bet at the very limit of what I think is possible.

Cheers


That's good, know your limits and stick to them.

I play roulette occasionally and have in the past made small fortunes. However I don't recommend it as you lose more than you win.
Reply 88
Original post by arichmond64
haha, how old are you btw? How long have you been doing this full time for a living? What is your total profit over this time.

I'm genuinely interested because if everything you say is legit then it's pretty damn good, regardless of whether any of us have faith in the system.


Unless someone is deleting my posts I believe most of that has been said already on here.

As far as my age is concerned let me put it this way- I'm so old that no woman has fallen in love with me at first sight for over 6 years now.......and I increasingly find that to be a relief.

On the other hand I have bucket loads of experience of following football although for most of my life I didn't bet on it.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Danny the Geezer
That's good, know your limits and stick to them.

I play roulette occasionally and have in the past made small fortunes. However I don't recommend it as you lose more than you win.


No offence intended, but this guy is probably in a different league as far as betting goes. Anyone worth their salt knows roulette and other casino games are for mugs.

I think you might be correct Moggis, in the sense that these long terms bets are deffo the way to go, as opposed to match betting, as the market is very efficient.
Reply 90
Original post by Danny the Geezer
That's good, know your limits and stick to them.

I play roulette occasionally and have in the past made small fortunes. However I don't recommend it as you lose more than you win.




Between you and me I once lost £120,000* in 2 weeks playing a poker related game on betfair.


Needless to say nowadays the only reason I play casino games is in order to help convince bookies I'm not a professional gambler.Ha.



* It would be a big mistake for anyone to think that because I have said this it means the stuff I'm saying about football is likely to be nonsense.


At the time I wanted to write the greatest ever gambling book and so I 'invested' some of the money I made from football betting in other areas.

Edit Not to mention the fact that my mother was dying.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by moggis
Between you and me I once lost £120,000* in 2 weeks playing a poker related game on betfair.


Needless to say nowadays the only reason I play casino games is in order to help convince bookies I'm not a professional gambler.Ha.



* It would be a big mistake for anyone to think that because I have said this it means the stuff I'm saying about football is likely to be nonsense.


At the time I wanted to write the greatest ever gambling book and so I 'invested' some of the money I made from football betting in other areas.

Edit Not to mention the fact that my mother was dying.


How much is the 120k relative to winnings?
That's a lot to lose.
Original post by Reue
Hard to believe this considering I've known people to be sports gubbed after being only £30 up. Care to provide any supporting screenshots?


Hmm... agreed!
Reply 93
Original post by hellodave5
How much is the 120k relative to winnings?
That's a lot to lose.



Well I've already said that I'm between £500,000 and £1 million up from football betting.


And I will be very very disconsolate if at the end of this season I can't claim to be £1 million plus up overall from football betting.


As regards the £120,000 I actually recovered most of it in a manner of speaking.

That money came from money that I would have bet on my long term football bets.

Yes yes it was a potentially disastrous loss because I didn't have enough money left to cover my various football bets that I had already made.

However....to cut a very long very dramatic story short......at the end of that season ( 2008-9 ?) I landed what was at the time my biggest ever win from a single bet,£221,000.

The point being that ordinarily I would have used at least £60,000 of the £120,000 to hedge that winning bet.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by moggis
Well I've already said that I'm between £500,000 and £1 million up from football betting.


And I will be very very disconsolate if at the end of this season I can't claim to be £1 million plus up overall from football betting.


As regards the £120,000 I actually recovered most of it in a manner of speaking.

That money came from money that I would have bet on my long term football bets.

Yes yes it was a potentially disastrous loss because I didn't have enough money left to cover my various football bets that I had already made.

However....to cut a very long very dramatic story short......at the end of that season ( 2008-9 ?) I landed what was at the time my biggest ever win from a single bet,£221,000.

The point being that ordinarily I would have used at least £60,000 of the £120,000 to hedge that winning bet.


Wow. Very nice. Are there good information sources (to read up) to get good at what you do?

I'm rather skeptical of claims like this in honesty. Any screen shots?
Reply 95
Original post by hellodave5
Wow. Very nice. Are there good information sources (to read up) to get good at what you do?

I'm rather skeptical of claims like this in honesty. Any screen shots?



No there aren't good information sources about this.

That's the whole point.

You are absolutely right to be skeptical

Let's be clear. If I am right then almost everything you read about football betting on the Internet and in books is wrong or very misleading.

And that's one of the reasons I don't want to show* anything that might convince too many of the wrong people.ie because it would likely shake up the world of football betting too much

* not yet anyway

But you see there's a very very easy way for you to find out yourself!

Spoiler

(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by moggis
No there aren't good information sources about this.

That's the whole point.

You are absolutely right to be skeptical

Let's be clear. If I am right then almost everything you read about football betting on the Internet and in books is wrong or very misleading.

And that's one of the reasons I don't want to show* anything that might convince too many of the wrong people.ie because it would likely shake up the world of football betting too much

* not yet anyway

But you see there's a very very easy way for you to find out yourself!

Spoiler



Fair enough! Thanks for the insight. I will one day look into betting. Interested in it at a behavioral academic level - but never tried it myself.

I don't know anything about football unfortunately, but I'm sure they do loads of different things.

The thing I don't understand is that they most likely have very intelligent statisticians working for them which sets the value of bets to be in their favor (not sure to what extent, but yeah). Surely all of the meaningful information is already factored in - so there is nothing to really gain from putting the bet on - apart from mere chance of winning.

Stock markets seem more of a controlled type of betting :tongue: I just don't understand how its possible to really play bookies on statistics.
Reply 97
Original post by arichmond64
But all this was factored into the price, like the price was the price because of these things.... if he scores it comes down, if he doesn't it goes up.

I just don't get what you think you know what the bookies/traders/market makers don't/



As everyone is being so amicable let me deal with this point.


I am asked what I think I know that the traders or market doesn't.


Let's start with the traders. What am I claiming to know that they don't?

Why ,nothing.


Well that is to say I know nothing about this specific market - Champions League top scorer- that they don't.

What about the market then?


Here I can only speculate of course.All I know is that a) I can beat many long term markets surprisingly easily and b) I'm not that smart.


The main reason that this market and other long term ones can readily be beaten is because the prices refer mainly to the chance of something occurring ........at the END of the season.

I on the other hand am betting on things that I believe have a fair chance of happening in the short term.Yes trading.

Now the question is that if I can make money doing this why don't a lot of other people do it thus rendering this method of making money nigh on impossible?


And the short answer to that is.........

I have covered it up because I think anyone interested in any of this should spend 5 minutes thinking about what that short answer might be....


And no the short answer isn't that it's because I find gamblers to be among the most irrational people I have ever known .Not when I'm sober anyway.


Spoiler

Reply 98
Original post by hellodave5
Fair enough! Thanks for the insight. I will one day look into betting. Interested in it at a behavioral academic level - but never tried it myself.

I don't know anything about football unfortunately, but I'm sure they do loads of different things.

The thing I don't understand is that they most likely have very intelligent statisticians working for them which sets the value of bets to be in their favor (not sure to what extent, but yeah). Surely all of the meaningful information is already factored in - so there is nothing to really gain from putting the bet on - apart from mere chance of winning.

Stock markets seem more of a controlled type of betting :tongue: I just don't understand how its possible to really play bookies on statistics.




I hadn't seen this when I wrote the above post. I may reply to it if I think my previous post hasn't answered it.

You don't need to know much about football to beat long term soccer markets btw.
Do you not use exchanges to place these bets, as the bookies rip you off on a cash out? I noticed you said you've cashed out plenty of times previously.

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