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Muslims aren't the problem, Islam is Watch

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    (Original post by usi227)
    It's such an interesting debate... It's always good to look at the argument from the other person's point of view and I think people are becoming more and more confused with culture and religion. They're so integrated these days that it can often be tricky to distinguish between them. I'm a Pakistani Muslim and I can say without a doubt that many of the issues the Muslim community comes under fire for such as the "oppression of women" or "condoning of terrorism" are strictly prohibited in The Quran (Holy book). A religion that promotes peace and in fact is translated as peace cannot surely encourage the kind of behaviour we are seeing these days. Culture on the other hand is a different story. I saw a great example of this on BBC Three tonight. The documentary was called "Is Britain racist?". A guy who was interviewed said something along the lines of "We don't want Muslims in Britain, bringing things like female genitalia mutilation with them". Nowhere in The Quran does it mention that Muslims must practice in female genitalia mutilation. It is simply a cultural thing. So, next time your here something to do with Islam, think to yourself, is it cultural or truly Islamic? The Muslims are most definitely at fault... and that's coming from a Muslim.
    Is it cultural or truly Islamic - it's both. FMG is considered mandatory in two of the Islamic schools of jurisprudence, and commendable in the other two. I do agree that it's not practised by the majority of Muslims (and is also practised by some non-Muslims) so to an extent it's cultural and a mostly regional practice, but please don't pretend it has nothing to do with Islam.

    Incidentally, male circumcision isn't mentioned in the quran either. It's rather disingenuous of you to pretend that if something isn't in the quran, it's not part of Islam.

    Abu Dawid 41:5251 "Narrated Umm Atiyyah al-Ansariyyah: A woman used to perform [female] circumcision in Medina. The Prophet (peace be upon him) said to her: Do not cut severely as that is better for a woman and more desirable for a husband."

    Sahih Muslim 3:684 "Abu Musa reported: There cropped up a difference of opinion between a group of Muhajirs (Emigrants and a group of Ansar (Helpers) (and the point of dispute was) that the Ansar said: The bath (because of sexual intercourse) becomes obligatory only-when the semen spurts out or ejaculates. But the Muhajirs said: When a man has sexual intercourse (with the woman), a bath becomes obligatory (no matter whether or not there is seminal emission or ejaculation). Abu Musa said: Well, I satisfy you on this (issue). He (Abu Musa, the narrator) said: I got up (and went) to 'A'isha and sought her permission and it was granted, and I said to her: 0 Mother, or Mother of the Faithful, I want to ask you about a matter on which I feel shy. She said: Don't feel shy of asking me about a thing which you can ask your mother, who gave you birth, for I am too your mother. Upon this I said: What makes a bath obligatory for a person? She replied: You have come across one well informed! The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: When anyone sits amidst four parts (of the woman) and the circumcised parts touch each other a bath becomes obligatory."

    Reliance of the Traveller e4.3 "Circumcision is obligatory (for every male and female) by cutting off the piece of skin on the glans of the penis of the male, but circumcision of the female is by cutting out the clitoris (this is called Hufaad)"
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    (Original post by luminarychild)
    Breeding hate
    To be fair, this is one of those rare cases where hating something is good for you.
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    I so disagree with you when you say that Islam is the problem, what makes you say that? Have you actually researched this in depth or have you just followed what is said in the media and made assumptions based upon that? This is what I hate the most. Islam is the religion of peace, as a muslim myself I do not think its the religion's fault at all, its actually those so called minority of people who are portraying it in a bad way. Grrrrrr im mad now!!
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    I so disagree with you when you say that Islam is the problem, what makes you say that? Have you actually researched this in depth or have you just followed what is said in the media and made assumptions based upon that? This is what I hate the most. Islam is the religion of peace, as a muslim myself I do not think its the religion's fault at all, its actually those so called minority of people who are portraying it in a bad way. Grrrrrr im mad now!!
    The Quran is full of violent and unpleasant passages. Thankfully the majority of Muslims don't put them into practice, but there are some who do and just because you don't like their interpretation doesn't mean they're not getting it from Islamic scripture.
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    I so disagree with you when you say that Islam is the problem, what makes you say that? Have you actually researched this in depth or have you just followed what is said in the media and made assumptions based upon that? This is what I hate the most. Islam is the religion of peace, as a muslim myself I do not think its the religion's fault at all, its actually those so called minority of people who are portraying it in a bad way. Grrrrrr im mad now!!
    Why is it whenever I hear a Muslim say Islam is a religion of peace I start to suspect their motives?
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    Islam isn't the problem. Ignorance is.
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    (Original post by mariam687)
    but you dont know the religion, its the media tht portrays all tht. Yes, there are terrorists etc bt you cant assume all muslims are like that and you cant blame it on the religion itself. ITS NOT JUST MUSLIMS WHO ARE TERRORISTS AND EXTREMISTS

    is2g all this bs does my head in
    If the holy book of a religion causes X, Y & Z, even if misinterpreted, it is at fault.
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    (Original post by Wolfram Alpha)
    Islam isn't the problem. Ignorance is.
    but Islam causes ignorance so Islam is the problem.
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    I assume you have read the Quran since you say yourself that it is full of violent and unpleasant passages. So which parts do you think are violent and unpleasant because I'd really like to know what your talking about?
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    (Original post by Sgt_Haytham)
    This is what the Leader of the EDL party, 'Tommy' Robinson, said whilst on The Big Questions back in 2012. Although I do not follow or support his group, I do have to agree to this point.

    I watched the 39 minute long video and he was constantly cut when trying to make his points.


    Anyway, I do agree that the religion is at fault, not the people who follow it.

    What do you think?
    why can't people be nice to each other ?
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    Well instead of suspecting and assuming things, I think you should actually look into the religion yourself if you really think that way
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    I assume you have read the Quran since you say yourself that it is full of violent and unpleasant passages. So which parts do you think are violent and unpleasant because I'd really like to know what your talking about?
    Yes I have read it myself and the fact you're denying there's violence in there is pretty strong evidence you haven't. You can google violent passages yourself, but I'll provide just a couple here:

    Quran 2:191 ~ And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al- Haram until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers.

    Quran 3:56 ~ And as for those who disbelieved, I will punish them with a severe punishment in this world and the Hereafter, and they will have no helpers."

    Quran 5:33 ~ Indeed, the penalty for those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive upon earth [to cause] corruption is none but that they be killed or crucified or that their hands and feet be cut off from opposite sides or that they be exiled from the land. That is for them a disgrace in this world; and for them in the Hereafter is a great punishment.
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    I assume you have read the Quran since you say yourself that it is full of violent and unpleasant passages. So which parts do you think are violent and unpleasant because I'd really like to know what your talking about?
    Who are you talking to?
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    Your contradicting yourself there by saying that I haven't read the Quran, that's pretty stupid considering that I never denied violence in the first place but oh well. As for those passages, its there for a reason, as the Quran states that the disbelievers will get punished since they are simply not followers of Islam. Also, those passages don't solely reflect on the majority of people, its the minority, again.
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    Forget it lol
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    Your contradicting yourself there by saying that I haven't read the Quran, that's pretty stupid considering that I never denied violence in the first place but oh well. As for those passages, its there for a reason, as the Quran states that the disbelievers will get punished since they are simply not followers of Islam. Also, those passages don't solely reflect on the majority of people, its the minority, again.
    I'm not contradicting myself, I said it was violent and by your indignant response you implied it wasn't and asked me to provide examples. Why would you ask for examples if you already knew the Qur'an does contain unpleasant and violent passages?

    Whatever reason they may or may not be there for is totally irrelevant, it doesn't change the fact that those violent and disgusting passages are still there.
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    (Original post by BaconandSauce)
    Who are you talking to?
    Me, although it appears she hasn't learned how to quote yet.
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    Also, those passages don't solely reflect on the majority of people, its the minority, again.
    so only a minority of Muslims believe in this part of the quran
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    What I meant when I said that point was that only one passage is directed towards the disbelievers, since it clearly states that the disbelievers will receive a punishment. This is what I meant when I said the passage is only directed towards a minority of people (which is the disbelievers and not the majority (which is the true believers). Obviously some people condemn killing in Islam but sadly some do not and it is these people that are not practising Islam properly.
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    (Original post by Khadijah489)
    What I meant when I said that point was that only one passage is directed towards the disbelievers, since it clearly states that the disbelievers will receive a punishment. This is what I meant when I said the passage is only directed towards a minority of people (which is the disbelievers and not the majority (which is the true believers). Obviously some people condemn killing in Islam but sadly some do not and it is these people that are not practising Islam properly.
    there are more disbelievers in Islam then there are believers in islam in fact it is about a quarter of the world who are Muslim and the rest aren't

    you seem to be a very confused person just pushing platitudes and being quite dishonest in your replies.
 
 
 
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