Got 7 summer assessment centres this year. 5 BBs. 2 offers AMA

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anonuser99
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Note that I only actually did 4 of the ACs because I couldn't be bothered to do the rest and I already had offers.
Regardless, I did the process for the rest.

All ACs were research or AM. These divisions have less applicants than IB but a far smaller cohort size.

AMA except what banks these were as I want to keep some anonymity.
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silverswan2002
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Wow congratss, that's insanee!!!😅

A run through of ur profile(work experience/ECs/grades) would be awesome!!😊
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anonuser99
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(Original post by pinkleopard558)
Wow congratss, that's insanee!!!😅

A run through of ur profile(work experience/ECs/grades) would be awesome!!😊
Uni: semi-target, I'm a final year. Relevant-ish degree (this does not matter in the UK though). Very low 2:1 grades (I never put % on my CV though ).

ECs: Committee position in a non-relevant society in my second year.

Work exp: 2 months interning for a fund. 1 year in middle office asset management (placement). Started and ran my own business (was much less formal than this) mostly before uni. Various other part-time roles - I've worked since 14 but that's not all on my CV of course.
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tinygirl96
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tell me more about options
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anonuser99
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(Original post by tinygirl96)
tell me more about options
You're gonna have to be a little more specific
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silverswan2002
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(Original post by anonuser99)
Uni: semi-target, I'm a final year. Relevant-ish degree (this does not matter in the UK though). Very low 2:1 grades (I never put % on my CV though ).

ECs: Committee position in a non-relevant society in my second year.

Work exp: 2 months interning for a fund. 1 year in middle office asset management (placement). Started and ran my own business (was much less formal than this) mostly before uni. Various other part-time roles - I've worked since 14 but that's not all on my CV of course.
Wait so u have summer offers even though ur not in ur penultimate year anymore?Or did u already do the summer internship right after your placement?

Either way, it's all super impressive haha:-)
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anonuser99
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(Original post by pinkleopard558)
Wait so u have summer offers even though ur not in ur penultimate year anymore?
Yes. Plenty of firms take final years for summer interns now. And the ones that don't, you simply tell them you're doing a masters and Bob's your uncle, you're now a penultimate.
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Blondersx
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1) How do you signal that you are planning on doing a masters? Like a line on the top of your CV?

2) Did you apply to internships during your placement? Or after it finished

3) What is the competition for placements like in comparison to summer internships? I guess that most of the target guys aren’t eligible to apply for them

4) What do you think are some easy ways that someone could improve their CV for banking? Is the focus mostly on grades + work experience, or are things like society leadership positions very important too

Congratulations on your offers btw very impressive
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anonuser99
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(Original post by Blondersx)
1) How do you signal that you are planning on doing a masters? Like a line on the top of your CV?

2) Did you apply to internships during your placement? Or after it finished

3) What is the competition for placements like in comparison to summer internships? I guess that most of the target guys aren’t eligible to apply for them

4) What do you think are some easy ways that someone could improve their CV for banking? Is the focus mostly on grades + work experience, or are things like society leadership positions very important too

Congratulations on your offers btw very impressive
1. Good question - most applications don't have a way to directly signal this. So what I'd do on the application form is mark my "graduation date" at my current uni to 2022 on the application form to avoid an automatic rejection. On my CV I added a single line above my bachelors saying Expected Masters with the date 2021-2022 I think. In the end, the offers I got didn't need this but I got ACs from one's that did. So it worked fine.

2. Both. Applied for SA 2020 during my placement. Completely bombed the cycle. Got one phone interview. But I was lazy and tired from working full time. If I'd put more effort in, I could've probably done better. This cycle (for SA 2021) I've clearly done better. And that's a result of improving all aspects of my application. I also did end up interning somewhere this past summer, after my placement.

3. Placement competition is of course much lower than summer competition however there are fewer placements (I think?) and they aren't always in the same type of roles as summers. You'll find a lot more middle office or back-office type placement roles than front-office. Yes, you're right, most of the targets don't offer placements. In fact, I don't think any do. In general tbh, there aren't that many semi-target unis that promote placements either. I can think of maybe 2 or 3 max. In that respect, if you attend these 2 or 3, you can easily get a job at a great name.

4. I always say getting into a competitive job, banking or otherwise (and I'm gonna use a bit of maths jargon here) is a function of your: work experience, school prestige, grades, interpersonal skills, extra curriculars (society positions, sports team etc.), networking and of course luck. By "a function" I mean that these parts all contribute to the end result: an offer. But just like a maths function, if one element is low, others can be higher which pulls the whole function up, and you can still get an offer. E.g. you can have scarce extracurriculars but make up for it with great work experience. Some of these elements have a minimum requirement e.g. grades - you can't be below a 2:1 OR interpersonal skills - you can't just be completely socially inept etc. Above that, everything comes into play. Maximise all the elements and you maximise your chances. Sorry for the maths analogy haha.
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silverswan2002
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Hey another question for you😂

How did u split ur apps between AM and ER(like did u apply to many more ER or AM roles)? Also, is the success rate in general much lower for going into ER compared to IBD(I get that the spots are much more limited for ER but is the ratio overall soo much lower given less applicants etc)?

Is it viable to split apps between Research and IBD or is that much more difficult to prepare for given different technicals/skills/motivation required at interview?
Also, how did u decide/when did u know u wanted to go into Research/AM?
Thx again!!!:-)
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anonuser99
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(Original post by pinkleopard558)
Hey another question for you😂

How did u split ur apps between AM and ER(like did u apply to many more ER or AM roles)? Also, is the success rate in general much lower for going into ER compared to IBD(I get that the spots are much more limited for ER but is the ratio overall soo much lower given less applicants etc)?

Is it viable to split apps between Research and IBD or is that much more difficult to prepare for given different technicals/skills/motivation required at interview?
Also, how did u decide/when did u know u wanted to go into Research/AM?
Thx again!!!:-)
AM and ER is not really hard to split. The only BBs who have an AM division (not WM) are MS, JPM, GS, Deutsche, UBS, CS. For MS, JPM and GS, you can apply for both ER and AM. Deutsche's AM (called DWS) does more PE/Infra/RE than anything, but there are very few spots on those teams if any at all, for full time. The rest is ETF stuff which I'm not into. Research is an easy choice here. UBS is a toss-up, their AM and Research are decent. However, UBS AM is big in Funds of Funds which is not something I want to do and since you can't choose your division, I'd rather take my chances with Research doing either ER or CR. CS doesn't really offer internships in AM, so another easy decision. There arent many other banks if any that have Research and AM divisions, so no need to choose.

If I misinterpreted your questions and you meant overall how many did I apply to even if not at the same firm. Well, by the time I had my first offer, not many AM apps had even opened yet (Fidelity had only just opened). So I didn't apply to that many. ER and AM internships are scarce regardless. Where I can't apply for either, I just don't apply (e.g. Rothschild, Evercore etc.) or I shoot a banking application off if it's easy (BNP).

I'm not HR so I have no idea what the success rate is in ER, AM or banking. One BB AM told me that under 40 out of 2000 apps made it to ACs.

Splitting apps between Research and IBD? Definitely possible at MS, JPM, GS. All of those allow 3 applications. You're gonna have to choose at every other BB. Then there are obviously loads of places that do IB but not research (EVR, CVP, ROTHS etc.). There aren't many research-only boutiques with dedicated internships but the companies themselves exist. ER and IBD are fairly different but not THAT different. The main difference is private vs public markets and deal processes vs research. It's possible to like both of these and have reasons justifying each. Up to you to find them.

Pretty long story that. The short version is: I've had a lot of experience in AM, doing a variety of things, enjoyed it so wanted to stay in it.
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tobifanimokun
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Hey,

How early did you send in your applications and which firms had the smoothest process?

Also, what do you look out for in a banks AM division?
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anonuser99
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(Original post by tobifanimokun)
Hey,

How early did you send in your applications and which firms had the smoothest process?

Also, what do you look out for in a banks AM division?
It varied quite a bit. Some (very few) firms I sent the app in the day it opened. Most I sent in a week or two after it opened and some a month or more after. But the answer to this question doesn't matter. The earlier the better is all you need to know.

I don't know what you mean for the second question. What do I look for in terms of what?
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tobifanimokun
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(Original post by anonuser99)
It varied quite a bit. Some (very few) firms I sent the app in the day it opened. Most I sent in a week or two after it opened and some a month or more after. But the answer to this question doesn't matter. The earlier the better is all you need to know.

I don't know what you mean for the second question. What do I look for in terms of what?
For example, you said you’re not a fan of UBS fund of funds. Is there anything you personally prefer or like to see in the AM division?
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anonuser99
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(Original post by tobifanimokun)
For example, you said you’re not a fan of UBS fund of funds. Is there anything you personally prefer or like to see in the AM division?
It's not something I think about at this stage because I will take whatever I can get lol but if I was to think about it:


  • Do they have funds in my desired asset class?
  • Are they winding up or winding down that asset class?
  • Do they have enough AUM to be sustainable in this environment?
  • Are the funds performing well.

But as I said, I don't really think about it. I just apply to everything.
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natninja
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(Original post by tobifanimokun)
For example, you said you’re not a fan of UBS fund of funds. Is there anything you personally prefer or like to see in the AM division?
Honestly I can't think of much worse than FoF... Your job is literally identifying who is good at their job...
(Original post by anonuser99)
It's not something I think about at this stage because I will take whatever I can get lol but if I was to think about it:


  • Do they have funds in my desired asset class?
  • Are they winding up or winding down that asset class?
  • Do they have enough AUM to be sustainable in this environment?
  • Are the funds performing well.

But as I said, I don't really think about it. I just apply to everything.
Will add to this that if you are trying to go after a specific asset class (or a shop known for being good at a specific asset class) do make sure you know about it! I work in Fund and Portfolio management for a sector specific PE fund and the number of grad candidates who have a generic answer to "why our asset class?"...

Also congratulations OP, hope it goes well!!
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silverswan2002
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Hi just wondering, how difficult was it for you to get your AM placement year.....did you need to have any relevant experience or a competitive profile to land it or would getting such a placement be relatively simple for nearly anyone coming from a target/semi target?
Also, what month did you apply and get your offer for the placement year?
Thanks again for all your answers!!!:-)
Last edited by silverswan2002; 2 weeks ago
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anonuser99
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(Original post by pinkleopard558)
Hi just wondering, how difficult was it for you to get your AM placement year.....did you need to have any relevant experience or a competitive profile to land it or would getting such a placement be relatively simple for nearly anyone coming from a target/semi target?
Also, what month did you apply and get your offer for the placement year?
Thanks again for all your answers!!!:-)
Note: my placement in AM was not front office. This is pretty typical for placements. There are not many front office gigs about.

Tbh I think my boss picked anyone with a decent CV (he was looking for particular degrees, grades, and at least some form of work experience), and a cover letter that sounded like you knew somewhat what you were talking about. Believe me there are a lot of people who write cover letters and have no idea what they're actually applying to.

I'm at a semi-target so I guess so?

What month I applied is kind of irrelevant and I also can't remember. Placements don't work the same as summers or springs. They're often run by alumni or smaller firms who basically want cheap labour for a year and they start recruiting when they please. Bigger firms do have some structured ones but 75% of placements are smaller firms. I've seen placements come out in September and placements come out in July (of the following year).

The best way to do any application is to apply as soon as possible with the best application possible.
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samplespace
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(Original post by anonuser99)
Uni: semi-target, I'm a final year. Relevant-ish degree (this does not matter in the UK though). Very low 2:1 grades (I never put % on my CV though ).

ECs: Committee position in a non-relevant society in my second year.

Work exp: 2 months interning for a fund. 1 year in middle office asset management (placement). Started and ran my own business (was much less formal than this) mostly before uni. Various other part-time roles - I've worked since 14 but that's not all on my CV of course.
You said your degree is relevant-ish. How did you learn for the actual internship relevant material/possible interview questions for your role, because your results seem great.
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anonuser99
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(Original post by samplespace)
You said your degree is relevant-ish. How did you learn for the actual internship relevant material/possible interview questions for your role, because your results seem great.
The knowledge you're expected to have as a summer analyst is nothing you can't find on Google and Youtube. They expect you to do most of the learning on the job + almost all internships will have a training week or two. My interviews didn't contain many technicals (although that may have just been luck, and tbh what I consider "technical" may be different than you).

I've picked up this knowledge gradually over the years (newspapers, books, youtube, WSO) + my learning curve accelerated over placement and the fund internship.
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