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Original post by yl95
Uh...people aren't unhappy wth the fact that they select children based on ability - they're unhappy because children whose families have high income get better opportunities...at private schools and that bright children whose families aren't affluent don't get the opportunity.
Bright children would end up becoming successful the same way a bright child at a comprehensive school could potentially become successful. If parents have high income, it isn't certain that they would take their children to private schools.
Original post by harryhamilton
Bright children would end up becoming successful the same way a bright child at a comprehensive school could potentially become successful. If parents have high income, it isn't certain that they would take their children to private schools.


It's not as easy as that...and that doesn't address the point of inequality, does it?
Original post by harryhamilton
Bright children would end up becoming successful the same way a bright child at a comprehensive school could potentially become successful.


Yeah, but they have less opportunities at a 'normal' school

My school have completely messed up my A Level options so they've had to change them around, and now I have to try and self teach FM.

At a private school, I doubt the same thing would happen and a lot of people I know at private schools comfortably take 5 subjects for A Level as well, meaning they would get more support from teachers and most likely do better in exams.

Are you saying that this has nothing to do at all with how you'll do in life?
Original post by Hanvyj
Surely segregating children on ability is more reasonable than on the financial situation of their parents?

Putting the most intelligent students with the least intelligent students = the least don't get the attention they need + the most don't get the attention they need.

Putting all the least together = better improvement, as they can have a lesson targeted at their own level.

Putting all the most together = better improvement, as they can have a lesson targeted at their own level

Whereas splitting it up by financial situation doesn't really have any logic behind it. It's a pre-determined factor that just governs that one child will have a good standard of education, another child won't. It's more 'unfair'.
No form of segregation is reasonable. I have to say it is only an act of separation not segregation. A parent may want their child to be in a more competitive environment therefore taking their child to a grammar school. So if everyone should be educated in the same environment, do you believe single sex schools should be allowed? It is not even a matter of splitting regarding financial situation.
Original post by Arithmeticae
Yeah, but they have less opportunities at a 'normal' school

My school have completely messed up my A Level options so they've had to change them around, and now I have to try and self teach FM.

At a private school, I doubt the same thing would happen and a lot of people I know at private schools comfortably take 5 subjects for A Level as well, meaning they would get more support from teachers and most likely do better in exams.

Are you saying that this has nothing to do at all with how you'll do in life?

Sorry to hear about your drama but in your case self learning will be a blessing. You will do brilliantly.
Original post by Catherine97
Thank you! There is a constant assumption that everyone is rich which is absolutely not the case - for example my parents thought long and hard about sending me to private school or state school knowing that it would put a strain on our finances. It sounds awful but had it not been for the fact that both my grandparents died when I was in year seven, I don't know if we could have continued to afford it through sixth form without the added help of inheritance.

I was sent to private school because I was very shy and quiet and my parents thought that by sending me to a school where classes are much smaller was the best option otherwise I may have slipped under the radar.

There's always going to be a mix of people like that, in private and state schools.


I couldn't agree more! Of course there are a lot of rich kids but they're all mixed up with those who aren't quite so fortunate. My parents were in a similar situation - they didn't know whether to send me to grammar school or private. I can't really remember the reason why I ended up private, but I don't regret it. I sometimes think that my grades might have been better if I had gone to a grammar school, as my school is non-selective and it's quite hard when you're not put in sets for anything! But it just shows how your household income doesn't have any effect on your IQ!!
My parents divorced when I was in Year 9 and I honestly don't know how my Mum has managed to keep me at a private school since!

But yes, I totally agree with your reasoning!
Original post by Arithmeticae
Yeah, but they have less opportunities at a 'normal' school

My school have completely messed up my A Level options so they've had to change them around, and now I have to try and self teach FM.

At a private school, I doubt the same thing would happen and a lot of people I know at private schools comfortably take 5 subjects for A Level as well, meaning they would get more support from teachers and most likely do better in exams.

Are you saying that this has nothing to do at all with how you'll do in life?
Of course it does. It actually depends on what you class normal schools as.
Original post by harryhamilton
Of course it does. It actually depends on what you class normal schools as.


I'm not sure what the correct term is, but I think it's a general state school that don't have any restrictions on who can enter.
Original post by yl95
It's not as easy as that...and that doesn't address the point of inequality, does it?

So, are you saying that everyone should have the same job and earn the same wages?
Original post by harryhamilton
No form of segregation is reasonable. I have to say it is only an act of separation not segregation. A parent may want their child to be in a more competitive environment therefore taking their child to a grammar school. So if everyone should be educated in the same environment, do you believe single sex schools should be allowed? It is not even a matter of splitting regarding financial situation.


I don't think single sex schools should be allowed, just like I don't think 'black only' or 'white only' schools should be allowed. That' seems, to me, a perfectly reasonable equality to have government regulation for.
Reply 330
Original post by harryhamilton
Personally, I think that the way schools are functioning are fine, however the only issue is that some schools need to improve the facilities they provide and the teaching quality. If there was only one kind of school, that would only result in chaos and disagreements.

I do agree that facilities and teaching quality need to be improved. Especially in Scottish primary schools, primary education is a vital point in time for developing minds. The system flawed mainly due to our new curriculum for excellence, which removes tests in the final year of primary school and treats primary education as a form of extended child care.


The grammar school system original worked by having the brightest from both comprehensive and privately funded schools. I can't see how this system is flawed. It would also provide more less well off children to gain a foot hold in the political system where there hasn't been a comprehensive prime minister for at least 50 years.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Hanvyj
I don't think single sex schools should be allowed, just like I don't think 'black only' or 'white only' schools should be allowed. That' seems, to me, a perfectly reasonable equality to have government regulation for.
White and black only school idea is ridiculous. I think single sex schools should be allowed and everyone should be entitled with a right to determine what school they want to go to.
Original post by harryhamilton
So, are you saying that everyone should have the same job and earn the same wages?


Oh my gosh. That's obviously not the same thing. GENERALLY, you don't earn a job because of how much your parents earn.
Original post by harryhamilton
No form of segregation is reasonable. I have to say it is only an act of separation not segregation. A parent may want their child to be in a more competitive environment therefore taking their child to a grammar school. So if everyone should be educated in the same environment, do you believe single sex schools should be allowed? It is not even a matter of splitting regarding financial situation.


Some forms of segregation are reasonable though, like segregation regarding performance.

Universities segregate by only letting those capable in etc. Football is segregated by performance, the Olympics are segregated by performance. The employment market is segregated by performance.

We have to draw a line somewhere. Sure, don't segregate on race, religion or sex - but segregation on performance is something that's inherent to our society.

(sorry for quoting twice)
Original post by harryhamilton
White and black only school idea is ridiculous. I think single sex schools should be allowed and everyone should be entitled with a right to determine what school they want to go to.


So what makes splitting people up by race any different to splitting people up by gender? Why should one be OK and the other be ridiculous?
Original post by harryhamilton
White and black only school idea is ridiculous. I think single sex schools should be allowed and everyone should be entitled with a right to determine what school they want to go to.


Could you elaborate on why you think segregating on sex is ridiculous, but gender is not?
Original post by yl95
Oh my gosh. That's obviously not the same thing. GENERALLY, you don't earn a job because of how much your parents earn.

No, if everyone should live an equal life, that means you should have an equal amount of money. The same way some parents want to pay for their children's education.
Original post by Hanvyj
Could you elaborate on why you think segregating on sex is ridiculous, but gender is not?

I'm sorry but I can't elaborate on a claim I have not made.
Original post by Arithmeticae
So what makes splitting people up by race any different to splitting people up by gender? Why should one be OK and the other be ridiculous?
Single gender schools seem to perform a lot better than mixed, this is a clear fact. Separation by race is purely racist and very backwards.
Original post by harryhamilton
I'm sorry but I can't elaborate on a claim I have not made.


Erm, do you object to my wording?

I'll rephrase. Can you elaborate on why the idea of a white and black only school is ridiculous, yet think single sex schools should be allowed.

Said here:
Original post by harryhamilton
White and black only school idea is ridiculous. I think single sex schools should be allowed and everyone should be entitled with a right to determine what school they want to go to.

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