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Israel threaten pre-emptive strike on Iran

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Original post by Ferdowsi
The thing is, attacking Iran from the air has been decreed by military experts as logistically impossible, so I don't think it will happen and is hot air to get Iran negotiating.

Most of the military and regional experts in Israel and the USA have said that bombing Iran is a flat out stupid idea that wouldn't even work.


That's complete nonsense.

Bombing Iran's nuclear facilities would be all but impossible for Israel alone, as they don't have the capabilities frankly, but the US is a completely different kettle of fish. America could quite easily do so given the bomb-depths they have at their disposal (i.e. enough to destroy even facilities under mountainess regions). Just have a look at detailed military analysis for further details; heck even the head of the US army has said they could do it.

The Obama administration reportedly has little desire to launch a preemptive strike on Iran's nuclear facilities, but just in case it ever did, US weaponry is capable of destroying even Iran's most protected site, experts tell the Washington Post. Iran's Fordow facility—which, until recently, the country had been keeping secret—was specifically built underneath the northwestern mountain ranges to protect it from aerial assault. Iran's civil defense chief once boasted that it was "impregnable."

US officials admit that they can't destroy the facility in one shot. But after recent training exercises on similar targets, they're confident that given several days of sustained attacks, the Pentagon's latest bunker-buster, the Massive Ordnance Penetrator, could collapse the tunnels around the facility and destroy the centrifuges buried there. Israel has less advanced bunker busters, and that's part of the reason it's more eager to attack; it believes its window of opportunity is closing as Iran moves operations underground.


Source - http://www.newser.com/story/140831/us-could-destroy-irans-nuclear-bunker-experts.html

However, its what happens after that, which is what's being discussed more importantly by the US; i.e. what will such a strike do to future prospects and Iran's reaction et al.
I love how so many people have come out and said it couldn't be done. If you have a bunker busting bomb, the last thing you do is release exactly what it is capable of. Its pure speculation.
Reply 22
Original post by liquid394
this might go againts some of u but due to my dad being in expert in Middle Eastern Law i have learnt that Israel is abit of a B****** to the Arab Countries, its always the media that protray Israel as the weak and right one when it comes to problems between the arab states. The only hope that these Arab states have is if Iran can offer protection. I myself don't agree with the whole nuclear weapon production but i can't blame them as everyone seems to be on them, but atm the world should be more concerned about the crisis in Syria. Sorry if i have insulted or annoyed anyone- everyone is intitled to their own view.
You're making a silly mistake in assuming that just because they're all Islamic states they should like each other. This is not true among all Christian countries so why would it be true among Muslims? Religion is not the most important thing in international relations you know - you only need to look at Iraq to see that there are some who believe the differences between Sunni and Shi'ite factions are worth killing each other for, or closer to home at the situation in Ireland just 20 years ago.

The truth is that the UAE and Saudi's already have their backer in the Americans and they don't want or need protection from Iran. They would not feel safe if Iran manufactured a nuke, on the contrary they would lose power and influence in the region and it would almost certainly lead to an arms race.

All this is besides the point however because despite what the OP would have us believe the Americans are still trying to pursue a diplomatic solution.
(edited 12 years ago)
Reply 23
Original post by MirandaPanda
That's complete nonsense.

Bombing Iran's nuclear facilities would be all but impossible for Israel alone, as they don't have the capabilities frankly, but the US is a completely different kettle of fish. America could quite easily do so given the bomb-depths they have at their disposal (i.e. enough to destroy even facilities under mountainess regions). Just have a look at detailed military analysis for further details; heck even the head of the US army has said they could do it.



Source - http://www.newser.com/story/140831/us-could-destroy-irans-nuclear-bunker-experts.html

However, its what happens after that, which is what's being discussed more importantly by the US; i.e. what will such a strike do to future prospects and Iran's reaction et al.


Well precisely, what people on here seem to believe is that these facilities could be destroyed with a few bombs. . Look at what had to be destroyed in the much, much weaker Libyan air defence system, there will be loads of targets that must be destroyed before they can even get to the nuclear sites. That means anti-aircraft installations, missile depots, power stations, bridges, communication hubs. This would be a huge military undertaking that would cause the price of oil to skyrocket and another global economic crisis, this is why China, the USA, the EU and Russia simply won't allow Israel to drag them into a destructive attack. This is posturing really, I cannot see how anyone would back such a stupid idea. Plus, once it is done, what then? You have a terrified Iranian population who will be being treated even worse than they are at the moment, and an Iranian regime causing chaos. It doesn't make any strategic sense. An attack against Iran would throw the world into enormous uncertainty and with no within sight benefit for the USA.

Only a last week the Chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of staff, Gen Martin Dempsey, said that a strike "would be destabilising and would not achieve their long-term objectives". I don't see the United States following this, if the Israeli government decides to ignore the advice of it's own generals and other hugely knowledgeable people like Meir Dagan. It would be awful from the perspectives of Iranians, and I am in Iran all of this summer, so I hope it doesn't happen!
(edited 12 years ago)
Reply 24
Original post by Annoying-Mouse
What will Iran do with nuclear weapons? It won't attack Israel because of MAD. All that will happen is the international community can't put militarily intervention on the table.


Threaten the Iranian people.

Anyone who seriously think it will "nuke Israel" is a complete idiot. Never going to happen.
Reply 25
Original post by Mr Advice
Obama has also come out saying that the US "will not hesitate" to use force to stop Iran obtaining nuclear weapons.

The world, just as in 1962, is in a precarious position again. And again, the US is over-playing the ambition of other nations.


How is this anything like 62?
Original post by Ferdowsi
Threaten the Iranian people.

Anyone who seriously think it will "nuke Israel" is a complete idiot. Never going to happen.


It's already doing that anyway but yeah it'll pretty much destroy any chances of a regime change.
Reply 27
this can only end in tears ...
Am I missing something but the OP says Obama would not hesitate to use force to stop Iran get nukes and that=Israel threatening ?
A pre-emptive strike (or basically the military option) has been on the table for God knows how long now, this isn't breaking news.

It's all talk too.

(for now)
Original post by anarchism101
Iran hasn't attacked another country in a couple of centuries.

Israel has occupied all of the Palestinian territories and part of Syria for over 40 years and has invaded Lebanon three times in that same period.

Yet Israel are fine with weapons but Iran isn't according to you?


Iran has been waging war via proxy against its enemies for decades and there's a reason (which still exists today) as to why Israel occupied those various territories.

There's also a good reason why Israel having nuclear weapons hasn't sparked a nuclear arms race yet the very prospect of Iran having them, makes it a certainty. Funny how most Arab countries are more worried by Iran than big bad nuclear Israel.
Original post by Mr Advice
Obama has also come out saying that the US "will not hesitate" to use force to stop Iran obtaining nuclear weapons.

The world, just as in 1962, is in a precarious position again. And again, the US is over-playing the ambition of other nations.


I would imagine that this is mainly rhetoric considering that any strike, would result in another Middle-Eastern conflict, which this time would threaten to completely destabilise the area. Also, the US is gripped in a massive economic recession, and having already gotten involved in Libya (via NATO), as well as prior conflicts in the last 10 years and is on the stand by should anything happen in Syria, I don't think it'll want to get involved in another costly conflict.

Besides just 4 days ago, it was announced that Iran are willing to enter into discussions with the UN with regards to nuclear weapons/sanctions/oil/etc.
Reply 32
Original post by Mr Advice
This is a man who won the Nobel Peace Prize as well.


yep, in good company with the founder pf modern day teerorism ,yasser arafat :smile:
Reply 33
Original post by Bishy786
Wouldn't a pre-emptitve strike that be illegal under international law or something?


not exactly, since every country's first obligation is to protect its citizens
Reply 34
Original post by Algorithm69
Pull the other one mate, it's got bells on.


But the bells aren't ringing.

What's your position on Israel having Nuclear weapons?
Reply 35
Original post by MathematicsKiller
Then why does it not totally cooperate with the IAEA?


Oh, it does.

Under whatever law governs nuclear weapons, Iran allows the IAEA to inspect sites which are WITHIN it's legal jurisdiction. That is all Iran has to allow the inspectors to do, which they HAVE done and no evidence has been found to indicate the process of making nuclear weapons.

Further, the sites that the IAEA want to inspect are regarded as MILITARY SITES and it's quite obvious that the IAEA would not need to inspect a military site.

Iran has complied legally with all that the IAEA has asked for except in the cases where the IAEA has wanted to breach it's jurisdiction, contrary to the Western media rhetoric.


It's also interesting that the West is calling for Iran to open it's doors to IAEA inspectors when Israel, the state that the West is endorsing, has always denied IAEA inspectors to visit.
Reply 36
I, for one, would be happy to allow Israel and Iran to enter mutually assured destruction, and take out some of the surrounding countries while they're at it.

No good has ever come from the theocratic middle-east, and no good ever will. Be done with it.
Reply 37
Original post by Veale
not exactly, since every country's first obligation is to protect its citizens


And how would Iran possessing nuclear energy be protecting Israel's citizens?
How did Israel "protect it's citizens" when it instigated the 2006 Lebanon war?

Further, check out the picture below showing the "REAL" country under threat.



The "STARS" represents hostile American/American allies military bases.
Original post by Bishy786

Iran has complied legally with all that the IAEA has asked for except in the cases where the IAEA has wanted to breach it's jurisdiction, contrary to the Western media rhetoric.


This is blatant *******s. Iran has repeatedly being found to be not in compliance with the NPT safe guard agreements including and due to Iran failing to declare its enrichment program. There were also documents - allegedly of Iranian origin - that indicated that Iran was interested in 'weaponization' the IAEA got involved but Iran failed to answer them on these issues.

It was just today that the IAEA has voiced 'serious concern' over possible military dimensions to the Iranian nuclear program, citing a lack of progress in talks.

Respected German analyst (has credentials in nuclear weapons/defense) Hans Rühle believes that out of two detected nuclear weapons tests carried out in North Korea in 2010, at least one of them was Iranian. He also explains how Ayatollah's 'fatwa' against nuclear weapons is *******s. [better reading]

Lastly, Israel is not a signatory to the NPT where as Iran is. There's a reason why most Arab states are more concerned about the mere prospect of a nuclear Iran, than they are with an actual nuclear armed Israel.

It does make me laugh how people question everything Western leaders say, passing it all off as double speak, deception and propaganda but every word uttered by the Iranian regime et al is considered to be honest and truthful.
Reply 39
Original post by thisisnew
This is blatant *******s. Iran has repeatedly being found to be not in compliance with the NPT safe guard agreements including and due to Iran failing to declare its enrichment program. There were also documents - allegedly of Iranian origin - that indicated that Iran was interested in 'weaponization' the IAEA got involved but Iran failed to answer them on these issues.


The key word "allegedly". Is it going to be the same with the UN and the Iraq fiasco. The words that time was "suspected of Weapons of Mass Destruction" which could be "deployed in 45 mins" from an "intelligence source" who later turned out to be a ****ing taxi driver, for Christ's sake, an TAXI DRIVER as an intelligence source to start a whole ****ing war?

It was just today that the IAEA has voiced 'serious concern' over possible military dimensions to the Iranian nuclear program, citing a lack of progress in talks.


Until anything to the contrary is proven, all this is hot air.

Respected German analyst (has credentials in nuclear weapons/defense) Hans Rühle believes that out of two detected nuclear weapons tests carried out in North Korea in 2010, at least one of them was Iranian. He also explains how Ayatollah's 'fatwa' against nuclear weapons is *******s. [better reading]


Again, a whole load of hot air. Nothing has been proven yet. Bring the proof and THEN attack. You can't attack based on presumptions.

Lastly, Israel is not a signatory to the NPT where as Iran is. There's a reason why most Arab states are more concerned about the mere prospect of a nuclear Iran, than they are with an actual nuclear armed Israel.


Last time I looked, India isn't as well as Pakistan yet they possess Nuclear weapons.

Ironically, Israel supports a "nuclear free ME" when in fact they have the the ONLY stockpile of nuclear weapons in the ME. Talk about double standards.

It does make me laugh how people question everything Western leaders say, passing it all off as double speak, deception and propaganda but every word uttered by the Iranian regime et al is considered to be honest and truthful.


My points were derived from a debate on TV (The Big Questions: BBC 1) which was quite interesting as it involved a former ambassador to the IAEA. If you want to have a watch, then the link could be found here and the debate about Iran starts from 20:25 and ends at 41:58.

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