The Student Room Group

A year on, but it was still wrong

weel just over a year, and no peace in iraq, whatever CNN may be purpouting, but i posted this on another website a few months ago(henc e the lack of truly topical comments) but i just wondered what other people thought of the situation.

'i hate blair and bush, the english government makes me ashamed to be english. how can bush say north korea cant have nucleur weapons when the only country to ever use them is america, (and they didnt need to, they could have just done a test bomb, then the japanese would have surrendered). how can he talk about freedom of speech when mcarthy banned any left wing views in america, and anyone left wing is hunted down, imprisoned, ostricised by society etc and etc. america cares only about itself, like in africa they claim they are giving vital food but all they are doing is seeling off their extra produce for lower prices thsn the local farmers, which undercut them, force the farmers to go into the town for work, destroy the agriculture industry (the only industry in some african states) making everyoe poorer, except america. like 10 years ago when east asia went bust economically the USA-run world bank said they would only give money and aid to help the economies if the countries sold off half their state-run economy to foreign inverstors (US companies exclusively).... and in Iraq, a wrong war, guess who ius getting billions of pounds for reconstructing iraq???? the people who destroyed it in the first place, cheeney (bushs vice - president). america has killed far more civilians than any country posibly ever (in a 50 year period) i mean look at vietnam forcing balck people to fight, whilst the whites like bush got desk jobs in america, its sick, and then in the 60's in the south when they used to go round lynching blacks, but no-one mentions that any mroe do they????????? or perhaps the second world war, the americans claim they won, what a joke!!! the russinas won the war and would have done by themselves, but the brits planned and were successful in operation overlord, and winning the west. America would never have won the war if it wasnt for Britain winning the battle of britain!!!!!! And then after the war, dumping the jews in palestinian land, simply ecause they think its an easy targer, and because aerica has a large jewish lobby, it defies belief. every moment in the last 200 years involving america has been twisted to try and create a history for a country devout of any heritage, the apache movie with john wayne, give me a break what a load of bollocks, if you want heroism thn watch zulu, and thats acually historically accurate(ish[!]). I, for one, have no qualms with americans its just their 'arristocracy' of media barons, sleazy businessman, oil barons, cattle ranchers etc and etc. Oh and by the way guess how many countries america has ivaded in the last 100 years.....5 you say???.... no, maybe 10, 20 even ..............nope over 130!!!!!!!! Those who allege that they wish to spread democracy and liberate the iraqi people should liberate themselves from their own false pretnnces and realise that they are expressing false desires which ish merely brought on by arrogance of power. By attacking Iraq America is merely justifying the ideals that bin laden was attacking on 9/11 of american imperialism. Thus the only case for war appears to be Saddam's huminatarian record which although appalling, is not too disimilar to another states. The USA has commited atrocities in several post-ww2 wars. In the Korean War they slaughtered hundreds of south koreans at My Lai, at Vietnam they committed many atrocities including burning the skin off children with napalm and one wonders what the americans would have hidden away if weapons inspectors came to their country.now i dont accpet terorsim of any kind, especially not of the kind mentioned but the politicans must realise what they are doing and why they are doing it, and the consequences of these actions.....

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Reply 1
Thats brilliant, if only I could be arsed to read that shit.
Reply 2
Che
weel just over a year, and no peace in iraq, whatever CNN may be purpouting, but i posted this on another website a few months ago(henc e the lack of truly topical comments) but i just wondered what other people thought of the situation.

'i hate blair and bush, the english government makes me ashamed to be english. how can bush say north korea cant have nucleur weapons when the only country to ever use them is america, (and they didnt need to, they could have just done a test bomb, then the japanese would have surrendered). how can he talk about freedom of speech when mcarthy banned any left wing views in america, and anyone left wing is hunted down, imprisoned, ostricised by society etc and etc. america cares only about itself, like in africa they claim they are giving vital food but all they are doing is seeling off their extra produce for lower prices thsn the local farmers, which undercut them, force the farmers to go into the town for work, destroy the agriculture industry (the only industry in some african states) making everyoe poorer, except america. like 10 years ago when east asia went bust economically the USA-run world bank said they would only give money and aid to help the economies if the countries sold off half their state-run economy to foreign inverstors (US companies exclusively).... and in Iraq, a wrong war, guess who ius getting billions of pounds for reconstructing iraq???? the people who destroyed it in the first place, cheeney (bushs vice - president). america has killed far more civilians than any country posibly ever (in a 50 year period) i mean look at vietnam forcing balck people to fight, whilst the whites like bush got desk jobs in america, its sick, and then in the 60's in the south when they used to go round lynching blacks, but no-one mentions that any mroe do they????????? or perhaps the second world war, the americans claim they won, what a joke!!! the russinas won the war and would have done by themselves, but the brits planned and were successful in operation overlord, and winning the west. America would never have won the war if it wasnt for Britain winning the battle of britain!!!!!! And then after the war, dumping the jews in palestinian land, simply ecause they think its an easy targer, and because aerica has a large jewish lobby, it defies belief. every moment in the last 200 years involving america has been twisted to try and create a history for a country devout of any heritage, the apache movie with john wayne, give me a break what a load of bollocks, if you want heroism thn watch zulu, and thats acually historically accurate(ish[!]). I, for one, have no qualms with americans its just their 'arristocracy' of media barons, sleazy businessman, oil barons, cattle ranchers etc and etc. Oh and by the way guess how many countries america has ivaded in the last 100 years.....5 you say???.... no, maybe 10, 20 even ..............nope over 130!!!!!!!! Those who allege that they wish to spread democracy and liberate the iraqi people should liberate themselves from their own false pretnnces and realise that they are expressing false desires which ish merely brought on by arrogance of power. By attacking Iraq America is merely justifying the ideals that bin laden was attacking on 9/11 of american imperialism. Thus the only case for war appears to be Saddam's huminatarian record which although appalling, is not too disimilar to another states. The USA has commited atrocities in several post-ww2 wars. In the Korean War they slaughtered hundreds of south koreans at My Lai, at Vietnam they committed many atrocities including burning the skin off children with napalm and one wonders what the americans would have hidden away if weapons inspectors came to their country.now i dont accpet terorsim of any kind, especially not of the kind mentioned but the politicans must realise what they are doing and why they are doing it, and the consequences of these actions.....

Wow you surely have a lot to say... :biggrin: :eek:
The only good thing to come out of the war was getting rid of Saddam. Lot's of civilians got killed, but I suppose Saddam would have killed a load more if he was still in power. The war was obviously fought for the wrong reasons. Now it's up to the iraqis to work out whether it was worth it or not...
There is progress. It may be slight and not noticeable due to the complete insubordination of the American soliders but my dad is flying out to Afghanistan in a few weeks to do an assesment of their airport and the security measures they need to implement so they can start flights back out there in the next 6 months. He is then off to the Sudan and soon to Iraq.

It's the American's that should be footing the blame for the majority of the bad stuff, like most people say they are totally gun ho and shoot anything. The British army and forces are trained in diplomacy and I'm pretty sure the only reason there has been so much carnage in the last few months is because they are patrolling with helicopters and tanks, surely that's enough to scare anybody!?
Danithestudent
It's the American's that should be footing the blame for the majority of the bad stuff, like most people say they are totally gun ho and shoot anything.


I don't really blame the soldiers for being trigger-happy, when so many have been killed in random attacks by people in civilian clothes. But then again they are trained soldiers...
Reply 6
Che
weel just over a year, and no peace in iraq, whatever CNN may be purpouting, but i posted this on another website a few months ago(henc e the lack of truly topical comments) but i just wondered what other people thought of the situation.

'i hate blair and bush, the english government makes me ashamed to be english. how can bush say north korea cant have nucleur weapons when the only country to ever use them is america, (and they didnt need to, they could have just done a test bomb, then the japanese would have surrendered). how can he talk about freedom of speech when mcarthy banned any left wing views in america, and anyone left wing is hunted down, imprisoned, ostricised by society etc and etc. america cares only about itself, like in africa they claim they are giving vital food but all they are doing is seeling off their extra produce for lower prices thsn the local farmers, which undercut them, force the farmers to go into the town for work, destroy the agriculture industry (the only industry in some african states) making everyoe poorer, except america. like 10 years ago when east asia went bust economically the USA-run world bank said they would only give money and aid to help the economies if the countries sold off half their state-run economy to foreign inverstors (US companies exclusively).... and in Iraq, a wrong war, guess who ius getting billions of pounds for reconstructing iraq???? the people who destroyed it in the first place, cheeney (bushs vice - president). america has killed far more civilians than any country posibly ever (in a 50 year period) i mean look at vietnam forcing balck people to fight, whilst the whites like bush got desk jobs in america, its sick, and then in the 60's in the south when they used to go round lynching blacks, but no-one mentions that any mroe do they????????? or perhaps the second world war, the americans claim they won, what a joke!!! the russinas won the war and would have done by themselves, but the brits planned and were successful in operation overlord, and winning the west. America would never have won the war if it wasnt for Britain winning the battle of britain!!!!!! And then after the war, dumping the jews in palestinian land, simply ecause they think its an easy targer, and because aerica has a large jewish lobby, it defies belief. every moment in the last 200 years involving america has been twisted to try and create a history for a country devout of any heritage, the apache movie with john wayne, give me a break what a load of bollocks, if you want heroism thn watch zulu, and thats acually historically accurate(ish[!]). I, for one, have no qualms with americans its just their 'arristocracy' of media barons, sleazy businessman, oil barons, cattle ranchers etc and etc. Oh and by the way guess how many countries america has ivaded in the last 100 years.....5 you say???.... no, maybe 10, 20 even ..............nope over 130!!!!!!!! Those who allege that they wish to spread democracy and liberate the iraqi people should liberate themselves from their own false pretnnces and realise that they are expressing false desires which ish merely brought on by arrogance of power. By attacking Iraq America is merely justifying the ideals that bin laden was attacking on 9/11 of american imperialism. Thus the only case for war appears to be Saddam's huminatarian record which although appalling, is not too disimilar to another states. The USA has commited atrocities in several post-ww2 wars. In the Korean War they slaughtered hundreds of south koreans at My Lai, at Vietnam they committed many atrocities including burning the skin off children with napalm and one wonders what the americans would have hidden away if weapons inspectors came to their country.now i dont accpet terorsim of any kind, especially not of the kind mentioned but the politicans must realise what they are doing and why they are doing it, and the consequences of these actions.....


<Howard bends over, parts cheeks, and emits a fart>
Reply 7
Howard
<Howard bends over, parts cheeks, and emits a fart>


Emit? What a great word for disemboguing a fart! I'll rep you later :wink:
Che i agree with most of your view but not all your evidence. Have you read/heard much from John Pilger?
Evidence wise: britain being a major reason for sucess in Europe and the war in general= i dont think so, American is a major industrial power and its ability to mass produce goods was a key reason for the allied success. One only has to look at the D-Day and the amount of american equipment invovled to see what an impact they made.

America dropping the a-bomb, immoral yes, a pragmatic decision aimed at saving american lives (the most important thing for Truman) yes and that is why it happened and im sure any other country would of done the same.
Reply 9
Gimp
Emit? What a great word for disemboguing a fart! I'll rep you later :wink:


Thankyou Gimp. That'd be nice! "disembouguing".....wtf...... :biggrin:
Reply 10
Avatar for Che
Che
OP
speciez99 thanks for your reply, and howard i apologise for not dumbing down and for coresponding in an intelligent manner, i can only presume deepthinking is omewhat alien to you, and you would much prefer 'liquid news'.. but anyways speciez99, russian would have destroyed the germans in a matter of weeks anyway, and even if the americans hadnt arrived, d-day would have been smaller, and later, but no less successful, as the germans would have pulled all their men back to defend berlin up until about 45 when it would have fallen, leaving normandy free to de ..well..freed... although perhaps the germans would have destroyed it when they left, but then again it wasnt exactly pristine after we had reconquered it. its just another example of the maerican myth, just look at the films 'The Alamo', its pure bollocks, davy crockett wasnt killed in battle he was captured, and isnt even mentioned for anything, let alone bravery, by opposition forces, just an american myth. America wishes for the history and heritage, and the great historic past of Britain, and so synthesises one for its people.
Che
russian would have destroyed the germans in a matter of weeks anyway


The russians where stretched to their limits at that point in the war.
Reply 12
Speciez99
a pragmatic decision aimed at saving american lives (the most important thing for Truman).


not quite true i'm afriad, did my history coursework on this topic so i've read lots of fat books on it, and the upshot its that the 'saving lives' reason was the propaganda fed to the American public. The fact is if they had told the Japanese earlier that they could keep their Emperor (which they did in the end) the war could have ended without any atomic bombs. They discused making the surrender terms clearer after Postam but explicitly decided against it. The only viable reason is that they wanted to drop the bomb. They did, to intimerdate Stalin and make sure Russia had no part in the peace settlement. Russia was bigger worry than Japan and Soviet Diplomacy governed the decision to drop the bomb, not saving lives.
Ohhhh, what a coincidence, now people have the sense to realise that the war was due to greediness for Oil and that the motives to go to war were complete bull. Murderers.
Reply 14
bono
Ohhhh, what a coincidence, now people have the sense to realise that the war was due to greediness for Oil and that the motives to go to war were complete bull. Murderers.


*takes deep breaths, trying to control on coming explosion at bono*
Reply 15
bono
Ohhhh, what a coincidence, now people have the sense to realise that the war was due to greediness for Oil and that the motives to go to war were complete bull. Murderers.


Our people aren't dieing for oil. It is a perk nothing more. We sent our soldiers to Iraqi for two official reasons and one unofficial reason. The two official reasons are getting rid of that dictator and spreading freedom. The unofficial reason is revenge for 911.
moncal
The unofficial reason is revenge for 911.



ummm...why only the Iraqis for revenge for 9/11?
Danithestudent

It's the American's that should be footing the blame for the majority of the bad stuff, like most people say they are totally gun ho and shoot anything. The British army and forces are trained in diplomacy


I agree. the british have to account for every piece of ammunition used and so before firing have o investigate what they plan to target. If the americans did this, nowhere near as many civilians would have been killed.

Rakooga
I don't really blame the soldiers for being trigger-happy, when so many have been killed in random attacks by people in civilian clothes. But then again they are trained soldiers...


i think they can be blamed. i'm sure you've seen the american soldier with 'kill em all!' on his helmet. im sure this mentality isnt shared by all of the americans out there but there are definitely a good few.
Reply 18
Che
and they didnt need to, they could have just done a test bomb, then the japanese would have surrendered).

And you know that how?

Che
Oh and by the way guess how many countries america has ivaded in the last 100 years.....5 you say???.... no, maybe 10, 20 even ..............nope over 130!!!!!!!!

Name them? I can't name 130 countries.

Che
at Vietnam they committed many atrocities including burning the skin off children with napalm

Are you insinuating that the US specifically targetted children with napalm, or that some children might have been hit by it when it was used on large swathes of forest? It was a war; people, including civilians, die.

You've spouted a lot of reactionary, politically-correct nonsense.
Reply 19
moncal
We sent our soldiers to Iraqi for two official reasons and one unofficial reason. The two official reasons are getting rid of that dictator and spreading freedom. The unofficial reason is revenge for 911.


Getting rid of a dictator and spreading freedom? I don't think the US shutting down a newspaper in Iraq is 'spreading freedom'. In fact, shutting down newspapers is what dictatorships do!

The correct democratic way for the US to respond to a newspaper that was spreading stuff they didn't like, was to use their control of the radio, tv and other newspapers to DISCREDIT that newspaper in their own writing.

Shutting down the newspaper provoked the Iraqi people because it was such an undemocratic thing to do. In a democracy there is freedom of speech.

Afghanistan is not a democracy. Have there been elections yet? No. Let's just hope there will be enough international pressure on the US to ensure that it cannot fulfill its aim of installing a dictatorship in Iraq.

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