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The SNP wants to give Scotland to the EU dictatorship Watch

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    > Gives up their say in how the EU is run by exiting the EU
    > Complains they don't have a say in how the EU is run
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    Get your ignorance off of TSR. I suspect you don’t have any qualifications beyond a few failed GCSE’s.
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    (Original post by VirgoStrain)
    Get your ignorance off of TSR. I suspect you don’t have any qualifications beyond a few failed GCSE’s.
    I didn't do GCSEs, I did proper exams.
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    (Original post by xyz544)
    I didn't do GCSEs, I did proper exams.
    You mean an entrance test for working in a corner shop?
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    (Original post by xyz544)
    They claim to be nationalist but the EU does not believe in nations. Its objectives are to get rid of all European nations and merge them into one superstate and to bring in as many immigrants as possible, so as to reduce the indigenous European population to a minority. The SNP is fully sympathetic to these aims and should not be taken seriously as a so called 'nationalist' party.
    Analysis like this always make me laugh. The EU is a capitalist driven, right wing organisation. It wants a "strong" market driven Europe. Nothing to do with this cultural Marxian Jewish conspiracy you seem to be blabbing on about, it wants a powerful united Europe. The EU is eurocentric and tribalist, and has more in common with the Roman empire than whatever mad RACIST theory you're on about.

    The SNP obviously have no real left wing credentials if they're supporting a Capitalist neo-liberal institution like the EU.
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    The EU is hardly a dictatorship. This is a tabloid tier post.
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    (Original post by xyz544)
    That is the point of the EU. To destroy the sovereignty of the European nations.
    You just seem to be parroting the daily mail now.

    All members are free to leave, like Britain. And the EU is not some amorphous, distanced body, how it evolves is dictated entirely by its member states.

    Jeez.
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    (Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
    You realise of course that you can vote MEPs out? And that in the UK parliament you can have an entire party vote against something and it still become law - complaining the UK can be outvoted so it's not democratic is like complaining that my party can be outvoted so the UK isn't democratic. People who complain the EU is a dictatorship are engaging in absurd hyperbole.

    Yeah, the Irish voted against the treaty, went back to the EU for reassurances and slight modifications, which satisfied enough to vote for it a second time. Literally how democracy is supposed to work.
    I do realise, but voting in an election and getting results in a parliament are two different things. We have 73 MEP's there are 751 MEP's a total of 9% despite being the third biggest contributor. Where as Italy contribute less and have the same number of seats.
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    (Original post by FL Watch)
    I do realise, but voting in an election and getting results in a parliament are two different things. We have 73 MEP's there are 751 MEP's a total of 9% despite being the third biggest contributor. Where as Italy contribute less and have the same number of seats.
    Because they've got a broadly similar sized population... if we're moaning about contributions then would you agree that London is underrepresented and the rest of the nation overrepresented in the UK parliament? Would you want the number of mps for London regions to be increased and the rest of the nation be drawn into fewer constituencies.

    Your problem doesn't seem to be that the EU is a dictatorship, but that its not a UK lead dictatorship. English exceptionalism firmly at work.
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    (Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
    Because they've got a broadly similar sized population... if we're moaning about contributions then would you agree that London is underrepresented and the rest of the nation overrepresented in the UK parliament? Would you want the number of mps for London regions to be increased and the rest of the nation be drawn into fewer constituencies.

    Your problem doesn't seem to be that the EU is a dictatorship, but that its not a UK lead dictatorship. English exceptionalism firmly at work.
    Or another option would be not to over rule the nation state. There is a difference to domestic policy to a global institute. In a parliamentary democracy outside the EU, like the USA- they have 100% control over laws- proper democracy attempting to carry out election pledges. Here in the UK we have parliament which is fine and democratic the 650 MP's vote on legislation- that's part power to the British electorate. Back to the point of MEP's they have less influence then the outdated house of lords. If our 73 MEP's decided "I don't like the look of this, I don't think it would be beneficial for the area I represent" We have Zero control- the rest of the nation's will outvote us thus we have legislation the British MEP's didn't vote for and we would have to follow those laws- do you see that as democracy I don't. It should be done on a nation by nation basis for example UK MEP's chose which laws apply in the UK- this will mean If 37 of our 73 MEP's vote the legislation down it won't apply in the UK this is more pragmatic and makes your vote for an MEP worthwhile. Most nations sell themselves out to impress the EU- the Greeks in particular, they are in more poverty due to joining the EU. Actually us joining in the first place was constitutionally void- instead of having an election prior to joining in 1972, instead we had an election in 1975- 3 years after joining. But that's another discussion for another day.
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    (Original post by xyz544)
    Britain made all its own laws until 1972, when Edward Heath signed the Treaty of Rome. That was the beginning. The ultimate objective is World Government.
    No it didn't.

    Ask your parents if they ever made laws pre 1972.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    No it didn't.

    Ask your parents if they ever made laws pre 1972.
    Parliament was 100% sovereign until the kiddie fiddler Ted Heath signed over powers to the EEC, which became the sprawling empire known today as the EU. There was no election prior to joining- therefore our membership was invalid due to

    Magna Carta (1215), the Petition of Right (1628), the Bill of Rights (1689) and the Act of Settlement (1701) requires Parliament to consult the electorate directly where constitutional change which would affect their political sovereignty is in prospect.

    Ted Heath said in 1970 "that it would be wrong if any Government contemplating membership of the European Community were to take this step without `the full hearted consent of Parliament and people'.
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    (Original post by FL Watch)
    Parliament was 100% sovereign until the kiddie fiddler Ted Heath signed over powers to the EEC, which became the sprawling empire known today as the EU. There was no election prior to joining- therefore our membership was invalid due to

    Magna Carta (1215), the Petition of Right (1628), the Bill of Rights (1689) and the Act of Settlement (1701) requires Parliament to consult the electorate directly where constitutional change which would affect their political sovereignty is in prospect.

    Ted Heath said in 1970 "that it would be wrong if any Government contemplating membership of the European Community were to take this step without `the full hearted consent of Parliament and people'.
    He got the "full hearted consent of parliament and people". Over 67% voted in favour, remember?
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    (Original post by VirgoStrain)
    He got the "full hearted consent of parliament and people". Over 67% voted in favour, remember?
    Was the referendum prior or after joining the EU? Ted Heath stated as an election pledge that he needed the full hearted consent of the people. He had consent from Parliament but not the people because of the following

    Heath put us in the EU in 1972
    We had a referendum AFTER joining in 1975 under Harold Wilson
    So knowing this - did heath have consent of the people, no he didn't as no referendum occurred before the election to consult the people about a potential constitutional change, it was a constitutional change, to clear that up.

    What Heath did would have been no different to us declaring independence in 2016 with no election and holding the referendum in 2019.
 
 
 
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