Why do people still want to vote Leave?
So , in less than a fortnight now , our nation decides whether to leap into the unknown or to cement a stable future for itself. I sadly , as a mere 16 year old , haven’t the right to vote – but many of you who read this have .
I’ve been listening to the debates and reading the articles for what seems like years now , and with every passing day the idea that someone should vote to leave the EU becomes even more astounding to me.
Team Leave seems to be based on three key principles : immigration , upholding British values and economic ‘prosperity’. Yet, all these three things should be reason to remain in the EU.
Firstly , immigration. Net migration to the UK last year was 330,000 people – that’s a lot of people on the face of things . But, it only happens to be 0.5% of the population of the UK . Also , immigration isn’t a negative consequence of the free movement of people in the slightest.
Team Leave , headed by the near-comical Boris Johnson , claims that this immigration leads to strains on the NHS and that a vote for Leave is a vote for shorter waiting times. This is nothing but a lie. In fact , over a third of the NHS’ doctors are from overseas and leaving the EU would lead to fewer newly qualified doctors in the UK which would in turn increase pressure on the NHS ; not relieve it.
What Conservative minister Boris and his primarily right-winged supporters need to keep in mind is that the way to relieve pressure on the NHS is to build more hospitals and to appoint a health minister who , well , knows about health. Stopping a flow of well trained , highly skilled people is not the way to do this.
As far as British values are concerned , last time I checked ‘ britishness ‘ stood for pride and strength and unity . Jumping ship and scapegoating the EU for our country’s problems is not proud. Weakening our world influence is not strong. Isolationism does not promote unity.
On the topic of unity , I move onto the ‘economic prosperity’ that Vote Leave dreams about. The UK is the world’s 5th largest economy . Fact. Yet , Team Leave uses our economic strength as a reason to leave the union in which we have become so strong. This simply baffles me. Tariff free , we are able to trade freely within the European union – our biggest trader. Leaving the union puts this special agreement in jeopardy and leaves us totally unstable economically and having to negotiate our way back into a favourable position in the union. Sure , Canada did this well , but it took them 9 years. Boris thinks we’ll have 0 tariffs , Nigel thinks it’ll be 5% . The lack of unity in Leave’s leadership is laughable in itself.
Then come the lies. Boris Johnson told us in the ITV debate that we should vote Leave to trade with the rest of the world . What he forgets is that we can currently do that. Granted , I’m not exactly an economist but trading from within a market block of 500 million people seems slightly more prosperous than trading as an isolated , confused, uncertain island.
Obviously I have a clear opinion , and a strong one at that , but I’m a mere 16 year old. I cannot vote. You can. So please , if only just for me , vote Remain on the 23rd of June.
I’ve been listening to the debates and reading the articles for what seems like years now , and with every passing day the idea that someone should vote to leave the EU becomes even more astounding to me.
Team Leave seems to be based on three key principles : immigration , upholding British values and economic ‘prosperity’. Yet, all these three things should be reason to remain in the EU.
Firstly , immigration. Net migration to the UK last year was 330,000 people – that’s a lot of people on the face of things . But, it only happens to be 0.5% of the population of the UK . Also , immigration isn’t a negative consequence of the free movement of people in the slightest.
Team Leave , headed by the near-comical Boris Johnson , claims that this immigration leads to strains on the NHS and that a vote for Leave is a vote for shorter waiting times. This is nothing but a lie. In fact , over a third of the NHS’ doctors are from overseas and leaving the EU would lead to fewer newly qualified doctors in the UK which would in turn increase pressure on the NHS ; not relieve it.
What Conservative minister Boris and his primarily right-winged supporters need to keep in mind is that the way to relieve pressure on the NHS is to build more hospitals and to appoint a health minister who , well , knows about health. Stopping a flow of well trained , highly skilled people is not the way to do this.
As far as British values are concerned , last time I checked ‘ britishness ‘ stood for pride and strength and unity . Jumping ship and scapegoating the EU for our country’s problems is not proud. Weakening our world influence is not strong. Isolationism does not promote unity.
On the topic of unity , I move onto the ‘economic prosperity’ that Vote Leave dreams about. The UK is the world’s 5th largest economy . Fact. Yet , Team Leave uses our economic strength as a reason to leave the union in which we have become so strong. This simply baffles me. Tariff free , we are able to trade freely within the European union – our biggest trader. Leaving the union puts this special agreement in jeopardy and leaves us totally unstable economically and having to negotiate our way back into a favourable position in the union. Sure , Canada did this well , but it took them 9 years. Boris thinks we’ll have 0 tariffs , Nigel thinks it’ll be 5% . The lack of unity in Leave’s leadership is laughable in itself.
Then come the lies. Boris Johnson told us in the ITV debate that we should vote Leave to trade with the rest of the world . What he forgets is that we can currently do that. Granted , I’m not exactly an economist but trading from within a market block of 500 million people seems slightly more prosperous than trading as an isolated , confused, uncertain island.
Obviously I have a clear opinion , and a strong one at that , but I’m a mere 16 year old. I cannot vote. You can. So please , if only just for me , vote Remain on the 23rd of June.
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Original post by TheMcSame
People vote leave because they want to. Whether you think their reason is valid or not is another matter.
I for one stand with Dennis Skinner. Fighting capitalism state-by-state is hard enough, it's near impossible when you're fighting against 28 states.
I for one stand with Dennis Skinner. Fighting capitalism state-by-state is hard enough, it's near impossible when you're fighting against 28 states.
Why would we want to fight Capitalism?
Original post by Calsiwm_Silicad
So , in less than a fortnight now , our nation decides whether to leap into the unknown or to cement a stable future for itself. I sadly , as a mere 16 year old , haven’t the right to vote – but many of you who read this have .
I’ve been listening to the debates and reading the articles for what seems like years now , and with every passing day the idea that someone should vote to leave the EU becomes even more astounding to me.
Team Leave seems to be based on three key principles : immigration , upholding British values and economic ‘prosperity’. Yet, all these three things should be reason to remain in the EU.
Firstly , immigration. Net migration to the UK last year was 330,000 people – that’s a lot of people on the face of things . But, it only happens to be 0.5% of the population of the UK . Also , immigration isn’t a negative consequence of the free movement of people in the slightest.
Team Leave , headed by the near-comical Boris Johnson , claims that this immigration leads to strains on the NHS and that a vote for Leave is a vote for shorter waiting times. This is nothing but a lie. In fact , over a third of the NHS’ doctors are from overseas and leaving the EU would lead to fewer newly qualified doctors in the UK which would in turn increase pressure on the NHS ; not relieve it.
What Conservative minister Boris and his primarily right-winged supporters need to keep in mind is that the way to relieve pressure on the NHS is to build more hospitals and to appoint a health minister who , well , knows about health. Stopping a flow of well trained , highly skilled people is not the way to do this.
I’ve been listening to the debates and reading the articles for what seems like years now , and with every passing day the idea that someone should vote to leave the EU becomes even more astounding to me.
Team Leave seems to be based on three key principles : immigration , upholding British values and economic ‘prosperity’. Yet, all these three things should be reason to remain in the EU.
Firstly , immigration. Net migration to the UK last year was 330,000 people – that’s a lot of people on the face of things . But, it only happens to be 0.5% of the population of the UK . Also , immigration isn’t a negative consequence of the free movement of people in the slightest.
Team Leave , headed by the near-comical Boris Johnson , claims that this immigration leads to strains on the NHS and that a vote for Leave is a vote for shorter waiting times. This is nothing but a lie. In fact , over a third of the NHS’ doctors are from overseas and leaving the EU would lead to fewer newly qualified doctors in the UK which would in turn increase pressure on the NHS ; not relieve it.
What Conservative minister Boris and his primarily right-winged supporters need to keep in mind is that the way to relieve pressure on the NHS is to build more hospitals and to appoint a health minister who , well , knows about health. Stopping a flow of well trained , highly skilled people is not the way to do this.
Personally I have no issue with high immigration and this is not a reason behind me voting Brexit. The main problem has been a constant failure by British governments to adequately fund areas like the NHS and housing to match immigration, and to encourage cultural assimilation. These obviously have nothing to do with being in the EU.
Original post by Calsiwm_Silicad
As far as British values are concerned , last time I checked ‘ britishness ‘ stood for pride and strength and unity . Jumping ship and scapegoating the EU for our country’s problems is not proud. Weakening our world influence is not strong. Isolationism does not promote unity.
As far as British values are concerned , last time I checked ‘ britishness ‘ stood for pride and strength and unity . Jumping ship and scapegoating the EU for our country’s problems is not proud. Weakening our world influence is not strong. Isolationism does not promote unity.
We're not scapegoating the EU for our problems, but legitimately pointing out that it's a piece of crap. I also see no pride or strength in claiming that we're pathetic, subservient people who can not survive without the EU.
Original post by Calsiwm_Silicad
On the topic of unity , I move onto the ‘economic prosperity’ that Vote Leave dreams about. The UK is the world’s 5th largest economy . Fact. Yet , Team Leave uses our economic strength as a reason to leave the union in which we have become so strong.
On the topic of unity , I move onto the ‘economic prosperity’ that Vote Leave dreams about. The UK is the world’s 5th largest economy . Fact. Yet , Team Leave uses our economic strength as a reason to leave the union in which we have become so strong.
Correlation does not equal causation. We're a powerful economy inspite of the EU, not because of it. I cringed when all the luvvies came out and said leaving the EU would destroy our entertainment industries, which would have merit as an argument if the EU built it in the first place, but it didn't. The British people have been innovating and pioneering long before the EU existed. We weren't some backwater that the EU benevolently uplifted.
Original post by Calsiwm_Silicad
This simply baffles me. Tariff free , we are able to trade freely within the European union – our biggest trader. Leaving the union puts this special agreement in jeopardy and leaves us totally unstable economically and having to negotiate our way back into a favourable position in the union. Sure , Canada did this well , but it took them 9 years. Boris thinks we’ll have 0 tariffs , Nigel thinks it’ll be 5% . The lack of unity in Leave’s leadership is laughable in itself.
This simply baffles me. Tariff free , we are able to trade freely within the European union – our biggest trader. Leaving the union puts this special agreement in jeopardy and leaves us totally unstable economically and having to negotiate our way back into a favourable position in the union. Sure , Canada did this well , but it took them 9 years. Boris thinks we’ll have 0 tariffs , Nigel thinks it’ll be 5% . The lack of unity in Leave’s leadership is laughable in itself.
It didn't take Canada 9 years to negotiate a deal with the EU, it took the EU 9 years to negotiate a deal with Canada. The EU's track record on trade deals is abysmal. So far the biggest economy they've ratified a deal with is South Korea. Australia already has deals with China, India and the United States.
Which in itself is a reason for leaving. Unlike David Cameron I have faith that the British civil service can do it's God-damn job properly, and if they can't just find people who bloody can.
Also, how would Boris and Nigel know what tariffs would be? Nigel isn't in the government and Boris is getting the cold shoulder for Tory high command. What's even more laughable is who Cameron and Osborne are calling Brexit a leap into the dark yet keep coming out with exact, precise figures of how much the economy would apparently implode if we left the EU.
Original post by Calsiwm_Silicad
Then come the lies. Boris Johnson told us in the ITV debate that we should vote Leave to trade with the rest of the world . What he forgets is that we can currently do that. Granted , I’m not exactly an economist but trading from within a market block of 500 million people seems slightly more prosperous than trading as an isolated , confused, uncertain island.
Obviously I have a clear opinion , and a strong one at that , but I’m a mere 16 year old. I cannot vote. You can. So please , if only just for me , vote Remain on the 23rd of June.
Then come the lies. Boris Johnson told us in the ITV debate that we should vote Leave to trade with the rest of the world . What he forgets is that we can currently do that. Granted , I’m not exactly an economist but trading from within a market block of 500 million people seems slightly more prosperous than trading as an isolated , confused, uncertain island.
Obviously I have a clear opinion , and a strong one at that , but I’m a mere 16 year old. I cannot vote. You can. So please , if only just for me , vote Remain on the 23rd of June.
We'd be no more isolated than dozens of other advanced economies that aren't in the EU, and the UK has one of the largest consumer markets in the world. People want to trade with us regardless.
Fact is the EU is a dying, sinking ship. There's no reason we have to go down with it.
Original post by WhiteMan16
Why would we want to fight Capitalism?
Capitalism is a system which legitimises EXPLOITATION of labour by paying out unfair wages. There's no need for an explanation from that point really.
Capitalism has run its course and it's time for a true classless, equal society to emerge.
Why would you want to support exploitation?
The main problem is both the leave and stay parties are blaming negative consequences of the oppositions opinion on the EU or leaving.
The reality is, 99% of the all the problems raised were cause by both the Conservative and previous Labour government. Housing issues? We hardly had any new affordable housing in the last 30-40 years..... NHS understaffed? Poor book keeping and overspending under labour, too drastic cuts under the conservatives. Loss of jobs and driving down wages? The inability and indifference of councils in combating house overcrowding with immigrants (which means they can afford lower wages) and catching out those who abuse workers rights. The UK job market has been in shambles for years now.
The reality is, 99% of the all the problems raised were cause by both the Conservative and previous Labour government. Housing issues? We hardly had any new affordable housing in the last 30-40 years..... NHS understaffed? Poor book keeping and overspending under labour, too drastic cuts under the conservatives. Loss of jobs and driving down wages? The inability and indifference of councils in combating house overcrowding with immigrants (which means they can afford lower wages) and catching out those who abuse workers rights. The UK job market has been in shambles for years now.
Original post by TheMcSame
Capitalism is a system which legitimises EXPLOITATION of labour by paying out unfair wages. There's no need for an explanation from that point really.
Capitalism has run its course and it's time for a true classless, equal society to emerge.
Why would you want to support exploitation?
Capitalism has run its course and it's time for a true classless, equal society to emerge.
Why would you want to support exploitation?
What the hell is that drivel? I want to fight against communism so I guess that makes us enemies.
Original post by Noodle0
You've completely missed one of the main reasons why people are voting leave. One of the strongest arguments to leave the EU is for democracy and sovereignty.
This !!!!
The moral superiority seems to be almost entirely occupied by these 'remainers' - I'm sorry but so many of you come off as unbelievably smug.
I can understand the remainer's point of view, I just don't agree with it. Remainers don't seem to have this empathy and have this attitude of you must be racist/short-sighted/ignorant if you're voting leave. So off-putting.
I can understand the remainer's point of view, I just don't agree with it. Remainers don't seem to have this empathy and have this attitude of you must be racist/short-sighted/ignorant if you're voting leave. So off-putting.
So , in less than a fortnight now , our nation decides whether to leap into the unknown
Being a fully independent country is not an unknown, since such a state of affairs is how the UK has existed since it's inception.
Also I'm not trying to be rude, but I suspect your research such as you claim has been quite flawed, since it's no big secret at all regarding the EU's manifold issues, such as democratic accountability, the ongoing struggles of the single currency, corruption, cheap migration from poor to rich countries negatively impacting economies, protectionism causing the EU bloc to fail to grow, Franco-Gerrman dominance of the bloc leading to some very worrying breaches of national sovereignty and generally detrimental EU legislation for other EU member states, etc.
Also don;t worry about only being 16 and unable to vote, you're still young. 18 is only two years away and then you can test your democratic teeth on a general or local election.
Original post by Jebedee
What the hell is that drivel? I want to fight against communism so I guess that makes us enemies.
The typical "commie!" card.
You should probably go look into proper communism, Karl Marx's idea of communism, rather than relying on knowledge around faux branches of communism like Stalinism and Leninism.
Original post by TheMcSame
The typical "commie!" card.
You should probably go look into proper communism, Karl Marx's idea of communism, rather than relying on knowledge around faux branches of communism like Stalinism and Leninism.
You should probably go look into proper communism, Karl Marx's idea of communism, rather than relying on knowledge around faux branches of communism like Stalinism and Leninism.
Proper communism lol. No thanks, I'll stick to my meritocracy thank you.
Socialism results in communism
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