The Student Room Group

Calling an election AFTER triggering Article 50 - what madness is this?!

Ignores repeated calls to hold a general election before negotiations start.

Triggers Article 50, starting a frantic race against time to try to reach a deal within 2 years.

IMMEDIATELY afterwards throws the biggest spanner imaginable into the works by putting the British leadership, and hence negotiation priorities, completely in doubt. The negotiators may as well go home - 2 weeks done, time for 2 months off.

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Reply 1
Original post by nexttime
Ignores repeated calls to hold a general election before negotiations start.

Triggers Article 50, starting a frantic race against time to try to reach a deal within 2 years.

IMMEDIATELY afterwards throws the biggest spanner imaginable into the works by putting the British leadership, and hence negotiation priorities, completely in doubt. The negotiators may as well go home - 2 weeks done, time for 2 months off.


If, and it's obviously a very big if, she loses to a pro-EU coalition then we can walk away from​ A50. It's not a one-way ticket.

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Reply 2
Original post by Doonesbury
If, and it's obviously a very big if, she loses to a pro-EU coalition then we can walk away from​ A50. It's not a one-way ticket.


Of course, but if she wins (obv' she will) we've just wasted 1.5-2 months of extremely valuable negotiating time. There is a real risk we will leave the EU with no agreement at all, and that has just become substantially more likely.

I'm sure negotiations will continue in principle during this time, or at least, TM will want them to, but realistically you can't agree anything in a tense negotiation such as this when one sides motives are completely up in the air.

The logical thing to have done was to call an election a month ago, get it resolved, then trigger article 50 with a strong mandate. Like everyone was urging her to do.
Reply 3
Original post by nexttime
Of course, but if she wins (obv' she will) we've just wasted 1.5-2 months of extremely valuable negotiating time. There is a real risk we will leave the EU with no agreement at all, and that has just become substantially more likely.

I'm sure negotiations will continue in principle during this time, or at least, TM will want them to, but realistically you can't agree anything in a tense negotiation such as this when one sides motives are completely up in the air.

The logical thing to have done was to call an election a month ago, get it resolved, then trigger article 50 with a strong mandate. Like everyone was urging her to do.


Indeed, her infamous last words... “I’m not going to be calling a snap election. I’ve been very clear that I think we need that period of time, that stability to be able to deal with the issues that the country is facing and have that election in 2020.”
It's called politics.
Reply 5
Original post by Aceadria
It's called politics.


Its called :innocent::innocent::innocent::innocent:ing over the country for personal gain, and people should be angry about it.
Original post by nexttime
Its called :innocent::innocent::innocent::innocent:ing over the country for personal gain, and people should be angry about it.


Hardly. Just like you think it's a big negative, many of her supporters will see this as ensuring stability during a tumultuous period.
Reply 7
The 7 weeks won't make one iota of difference in the grand scheme of things.
Reply 8
Original post by Aceadria
Hardly. Just like you think it's a big negative, many of her supporters will see this as ensuring stability during a tumultuous period.


Versus no election at all then perhaps (from the conservative perspective).

But anyone with a functioning brain cell can see that the best time for a general election was before triggering Article 50. She just saw the polls tick up 1 or 2 more percentage points and went for it. She could easily have done the same thing 3 weeks ago. Complete lack of planning, complete contempt for the interests of the country as a whole.

Original post by Drewski
The 7 weeks won't make one iota of difference in the grand scheme of things.


It'll be slightly longer with post-election faff.

Then that's what, 8% of the time we have to negotiate a deal with the EU? A deal which would normally take 5-10 years? Its also at odds with what TM was saying last month - that an election would introduce instability etc.

And its not like we triggered article 50 months ago - its been literally 19 days - any kind of sensible planning would have avoided this.
Reply 9
Original post by nexttime
It'll be slightly longer with post-election faff.

Then that's what, 8% of the time we have to negotiate a deal with the EU? A deal which would normally take 5-10 years? Its also at odds with what TM was saying last month - that an election would introduce instability etc.

And its not like we triggered article 50 months ago - its been literally 19 days - any kind of sensible planning would have avoided this.


No it won't. Assuming no change in government, the result will be in by the early hours of the 9th, at which point everyone will go back to work.

Considering that the bulk of the work and negotiating is being done by the civil service, who don't stop for the election cycle in the first place, then there's not really going to be any noticeable stop to proceedings.
Labour in freefall

Lib Dems gaining little

Seeking a mandate to wreck the country

A 2020 GE could be after Corbyn retires as Labour leader.

Makes sense from a Tory viewpoint
You realise that the 2 year"deadline" is bogus? They are allowed to extend it in the case that both parties want to do unless the UK or EU wants to walk out then they won't.
It is not madness at all. It is the perfect opportunity to make it clear that the Conservative establishment rule Britain and will turn this country into a capitalist utopia free from the fascist EU.
Original post by nexttime
Ignores repeated calls to hold a general election before negotiations start.

Triggers Article 50, starting a frantic race against time to try to reach a deal within 2 years.

IMMEDIATELY afterwards throws the biggest spanner imaginable into the works by putting the British leadership, and hence negotiation priorities, completely in doubt. The negotiators may as well go home - 2 weeks done, time for 2 months off.


If you understood how the negotiation time table will work you wouldn't have made this thread.

Zero will be done until after the French election and very little before the German election.


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Mrs May needed an election while the Labor have Jezza the Clown "in charge". Once he is gone then Labour could get their act together and behave like grown ups.
Reply 15
she doesn't care about the country, she just wants her own agenda to force scotland to remain and remove any opposition. If it was up to her she would have no accountability for any decisions
Reply 16
Original post by Lay-Z
she doesn't care about the country, she just wants her own agenda to force scotland to remain and remove any opposition. If it was up to her she would have no accountability for any decisions


Scotland already voted to Remain, that's kind of the point...
Original post by Doonesbury
Scotland already voted to Remain, that's kind of the point...


Scotland as an entity has not had an EU vote, just as London, Yorkshire, Grimsby and my family haven't. The people who live in Scotland did vote in a UK-wide referendum on the matter, just as the people of London, Yorkshire and Grimsby did (and my family).
Reply 18
Original post by paul514
If you understood how the negotiation time table will work you wouldn't have made this thread.

Zero will be done until after the French election and very little before the German election.


Nonsense - France is one stakeholder of many on the EU side. Whilst our entire side of the table is literally dissolving for a couple months.

If what you way was the case then they wouldn't have triggered article 50 until afterwards, unless the conservatives were completely stupid...

Original post by Drewski
No it won't. Assuming no change in government, the result will be in by the early hours of the 9th, at which point everyone will go back to work.

Considering that the bulk of the work and negotiating is being done by the civil service, who don't stop for the election cycle in the first place, then there's not really going to be any noticeable stop to proceedings.


Civil servants whose bosses are politicians. You cannot hold a negotiation when you don't even know who you're negotiating with or what you're negotiating for. In reality nothing at all can happen until the election is over.

Original post by ssharma123
You realise that the 2 year"deadline" is bogus? They are allowed to extend it in the case that both parties want to do unless the UK or EU wants to walk out then they won't.


You'd be relying on a unanimous decision by all member states wouldn't you? You're willing to gamble no single state will want to act punitively, or be worried about the complex legal situation for the EU elections that happen straight afterwards, or for any other reason?
Original post by nexttime
Ignores repeated calls to hold a general election before negotiations start.

Triggers Article 50, starting a frantic race against time to try to reach a deal within 2 years.

IMMEDIATELY afterwards throws the biggest spanner imaginable into the works by putting the British leadership, and hence negotiation priorities, completely in doubt. The negotiators may as well go home - 2 weeks done, time for 2 months off.


They've already admitted that the two years is just for preliminaries - David Davies told the select committee this in so many words and it has been clear for a while now that they will need to agree interim arrangements and something like a 5- or 10-year negotiation period given the complexities.

This election will be spun as being all about not 'walking naked into the negotiating chamber' with those horrible Europeans (note to self - doesn't 'Europeans' actually include us?), when in fact it's simply about crushing Labour at an obviously vulnerable time when they have a useless leader.

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