A guide for getting into graduate medicine (and dealing with rejections)

Hi, first of all congratulations on your offer!

I have recently graduated with a degree in Biomedical Science and I am taking a gap year and I want to improve my medical school application. I have quite poor A level grades at BCC in maths, bio and geography. I took the UCAT last summer, but my UCAT score was only 2690 and a VR score of 570, far too low for GEM. How long would you suggest I prep for the UCAT for? Do you have any advice on how to ace the VR section, as I know Warwick emphasises on a good VR score. I want to apply to Warwick GEM, but I am currently struggling to meet the 70 hours of hands on work experience. I have shadowed a GP for 3 hours and I shadowed a Physician associate for 3 hours. I have also completed the online BSMS virtual work experience which accounts for 10 hours according to Warwick. I also currently work two jobs, one as pharmacy dispenser, which I don’t know if it counts as “hands on patient care” , as I know Warwick is extremely strict with what qualifies as appropriate work experience, although I do interact with patients and advice them on medication and illnesses. My second job is a phlebotomist, but I won’t be able to get a reference from the manager unfortunately, so I wanted to know if an NHS payslip would be enough evidence to prove I provided hand on patient care. I am kind of stressing out because the whole reason I took a gap year was to fulfill Warwick’s work experience requirement. Do you have any advice on how to get more hand on patient care and how to ask for references? I would really appreciate any words of wisdom 😊.

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Hi all,
I recently got an offer to study graduate medicine at Warwick University, starting September 2023. It has taken me three cycles to finally gain an offer. Getting into graduate medicine is extremely difficult and takes a lot of hard work. I am going to start posting as much as I can on all the different factors that helped me get an offer. I will discuss my GCSEs, A-levels, work experience, UCAT, interview prep, dealing with stress, coping with failure and anything else you'd like to know.
Will speak more soon!

Reply 3

OP

Original post by Faz27

Hi, first of all congratulations on your offer!

I have recently graduated with a degree in Biomedical Science and I am taking a gap year and I want to improve my medical school application. I have quite poor A level grades at BCC in maths, bio and geography. I took the UCAT last summer, but my UCAT score was only 2690 and a VR score of 570, far too low for GEM. How long would you suggest I prep for the UCAT for? Do you have any advice on how to ace the VR section, as I know Warwick emphasises on a good VR score. I want to apply to Warwick GEM, but I am currently struggling to meet the 70 hours of hands on work experience. I have shadowed a GP for 3 hours and I shadowed a Physician associate for 3 hours. I have also completed the online BSMS virtual work experience which accounts for 10 hours according to Warwick. I also currently work two jobs, one as pharmacy dispenser, which I don’t know if it counts as “hands on patient care” , as I know Warwick is extremely strict with what qualifies as appropriate work experience, although I do interact with patients and advice them on medication and illnesses. My second job is a phlebotomist, but I won’t be able to get a reference from the manager unfortunately, so I wanted to know if an NHS payslip would be enough evidence to prove I provided hand on patient care. I am kind of stressing out because the whole reason I took a gap year was to fulfill Warwick’s work experience requirement. Do you have any advice on how to get more hand on patient care and how to ask for references? I would really appreciate any words of wisdom 😊.

Thanks

I'm going to try and write about these different factors in greater detail in the future but I'll try and give some quick feedback now.
Ok, so first thing is congrats on graduating! From going through lots of uni research, most require atleast a 2:1. Biomedical science is also a good degree to have done as some universities require a science-based undergrad degree. A-levels don't tend to matter really applying to grad medicine as they tend to focus on your degree. Make sure you read into the entry requirements (for grads) before applying to any universities to give yourself the best chance possible of interview.
Your UCAT would have actually met threshold for grad medicine at Warwick this year. The other grad med unis do have much higher thresholds. If you are considering applying to 5-year courses, some UCAT thresholds are much lower (~2400/2500). I'll try and go into more detail with UCAT later but I'd say do a little everyday for say 10 weeks. Make sure you do questions timed from the start.
Regarding work experience, check what unis specifically require for work experience and email them to clarify on any concerns. I'm going to be a bit blunt with the work experience, but it's with good intentions to get you in. Shadowing won't take you particulary far, I believe Warwick only accept 10 hrs? For warwick, I don't think the pharmacy role will be considered "hands-on care". Your top bit of work experience is the phlebotomy as you're having 1:1 interactions with patients and making an active contribution to their care. Why can you not get a reference from your manager? The most common experience for applicants to Warwick appears to be HCAs in GPs and hospitals as you get to do such a diverse range of stuff. You have still got till like September to gain more experience so there's no stress currently! Try and find some roles as HCAs in hospitals where they can train you from scratch. Many care homes also need support looking after residents (but it needs to be a caring role). Try not to just see the work experience as a box-ticking experience as it's highly likely they will see straight through it in the interview. I have found successful applicants perform well in interviews as they actually have had a real-world experience of being in healthcare. You need to understand what this world is like that you're going into.

Reply 4

Faz27

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Thanks

I'm going to try and write about these different factors in greater detail in the future but I'll try and give some quick feedback now.
Ok, so first thing is congrats on graduating! From going through lots of uni research, most require atleast a 2:1. Biomedical science is also a good degree to have done as some universities require a science-based undergrad degree. A-levels don't tend to matter really applying to grad medicine as they tend to focus on your degree. Make sure you read into the entry requirements (for grads) before applying to any universities to give yourself the best chance possible of interview.
Your UCAT would have actually met threshold for grad medicine at Warwick this year. The other grad med unis do have much higher thresholds. If you are considering applying to 5-year courses, some UCAT thresholds are much lower (~2400/2500). I'll try and go into more detail with UCAT later but I'd say do a little everyday for say 10 weeks. Make sure you do questions timed from the start.
Regarding work experience, check what unis specifically require for work experience and email them to clarify on any concerns. I'm going to be a bit blunt with the work experience, but it's with good intentions to get you in. Shadowing won't take you particulary far, I believe Warwick only accept 10 hrs? For warwick, I don't think the pharmacy role will be considered "hands-on care". Your top bit of work experience is the phlebotomy as you're having 1:1 interactions with patients and making an active contribution to their care. Why can you not get a reference from your manager? The most common experience for applicants to Warwick appears to be HCAs in GPs and hospitals as you get to do such a diverse range of stuff. You have still got till like September to gain more experience so there's no stress currently! Try and find some roles as HCAs in hospitals where they can train you from scratch. Many care homes also need support looking after residents (but it needs to be a caring role). Try not to just see the work experience as a box-ticking experience as it's highly likely they will see straight through it in the interview. I have found successful applicants perform well in interviews as they actually have had a real-world experience of being in healthcare. You need to understand what this world is like that you're going into.

Hi, thank you so much for replying! I have applied for so many HCA positions but unfortunately, keep getting rejected. Obtaining a reference from my phlebotomy job is a weird one, as I won't be able to get one from my line manager and I am not sure if obtaining a reference from a colleague would be accepted by Warwick. I will definitely dedicate more time over the summer for the UCAT. I used medify last cycle, however, if you would recommend any other resources I would love to know. I want to study medicine at Warwick more than anything, but fulfilling the work experience requirement is so stressful! How would you suggest I should ask people for references on official letterhead, as I am so awkward and I don't like telling people I know in real life that I want to apply for medicine? On Warwick's work experience page, it says "If your primary work experience is within Pharmacy then you must have a second experience outside of Pharmacy which also demonstrates hands-on care" I don't know if my role as pharmacy dispenser/assistant would count? As my line manager from the pharmacy would definitely provide me with a reference.. I am taking this gap year to strengthen my medical application and I plan on taking the UCAT early.

(edited 1 year ago)

Reply 5

OP

Universities Forum Helper

Original post by Faz27

Hi, thank you so much for replying! I have applied for so many HCA positions but unfortunately, keep getting rejected. Obtaining a reference from my phlebotomy job is a weird one, as I won't be able to get one from my line manager and I am not sure if obtaining a reference from a colleague would be accepted by Warwick. I will definitely dedicate more time over the summer for the UCAT. I used medify last cycle, however, if you would recommend any other resources I would love to know. I want to study medicine at Warwick more than anything, but fulfilling the work experience requirement is so stressful! How would you suggest I should ask people for references on official letterhead, as I am so awkward and I don't like telling people I know in real life that I want to apply for medicine? On Warwick's work experience page, it says "If your primary work experience is within Pharmacy then you must have a second experience outside of Pharmacy which also demonstrates hands-on care" I don't know if my role as pharmacy dispenser/assistant would count? As my line manager from the pharmacy would definitely provide me with a reference. I currently hold a deferred offer for a Physician Associate course and I was going to apply for medicine this cycle, but I did not realise I could not apply to medicine 2023 entry, whilst holding a deferred 2023 offer. I am taking this gap year to strengthen my medical application and I plan on taking the UCAT early, so I can decide if my score and application will be good enough for GEM. But I feel like my efforts will go to waste and I won't end up with an offer for medicine, whilst I reject my PA offer. Do you have any advice on what to do if you feel like you aren't good enough to study medicine?

I'm sorry if this is harsh, but you need to overcome the awkwardness asking people. I know it can be a bit daunting, but you're going to have to face much higher levels of pressure as a doctor. If you struggle communicating with the public (which is understandable), are you sure it's medicine you want to do which is a communication job at its core. You need to be clear to them and explain exactly how you want the letter. Ask them in person as i think it is more polite. If you cannot get into any HCA roles, try applying for work in care homes. Experience like washing people, toilet duties etc is showing a level of commitment that is needed for medicine. I think if you truly want to do medicine, you'll be able to overcome these problems

Reply 6

Admit-One

21

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Hi all,
I recently got an offer to study graduate medicine at Warwick University, starting September 2023. It has taken me three cycles to finally gain an offer. Getting into graduate medicine is extremely difficult and takes a lot of hard work. I am going to start posting as much as I can on all the different factors that helped me get an offer. I will discuss my GCSEs, A-levels, work experience, UCAT, interview prep, dealing with stress, coping with failure and anything else you'd like to know.
Will speak more soon!

Congrats on your offer and honesty about how hard it was to get to this stage.

I wish more students had their eyes open to this when I see them posting threads about GEM before even starting undergrad!

Reply 7

Faz27

Thank you for replying, it was definitely a reality check I needed. I definitely need to get over the awkwardness and will be asking my line manager at the hospital to see if there are any job opportunities, so I can get more hands on patient experience. I do enjoy interacting with patients and medicine is something I want to do, so I am going to try my absolute hardest. I look forward to you posting more about your med medical application journey and any tips on how to prepare for the UCAT :smile:

Original post by GradMedPursuit

I'm sorry if this is harsh, but you need to overcome the awkwardness asking people. I know it can be a bit daunting, but you're going to have to face much higher levels of pressure as a doctor. If you struggle communicating with the public (which is understandable), are you sure it's medicine you want to do which is a communication job at its core. You need to be clear to them and explain exactly how you want the letter. Ask them in person as i think it is more polite. If you cannot get into any HCA roles, try applying for work in care homes. Experience like washing people, toilet duties etc is showing a level of commitment that is needed for medicine. I think if you truly want to do medicine, you'll be able to overcome these problems

Reply 8

AlexTail

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Hi all,
I recently got an offer to study graduate medicine at Warwick University, starting September 2023. It has taken me three cycles to finally gain an offer. Getting into graduate medicine is extremely difficult and takes a lot of hard work. I am going to start posting as much as I can on all the different factors that helped me get an offer. I will discuss my GCSEs, A-levels, work experience, UCAT, interview prep, dealing with stress, coping with failure and anything else you'd like to know.
Will speak more soon!

Congrats,

I failed to secure a place in my 3rd application cycle but it’s nice to see people in similar stage get a spot.

would appreciate it if you could provide some details regarding your degree and UCAT result and what you did to make your application more appealing. I have a biomedical science degree (2:1) with a master degree(1st) along with work experience in hospitals working with patients and I can’t seem to get more than 1 interview a cycle.
my UCAT for this year was 2710 (B2) with a 630 in VR but got an automatic rejection from Warwick

Reply 9

OP

Original post by AlexTail

Congrats,

I failed to secure a place in my 3rd application cycle but it’s nice to see people in similar stage get a spot.

would appreciate it if you could provide some details regarding your degree and UCAT result and what you did to make your application more appealing. I have a biomedical science degree (2:1) with a master degree(1st) along with work experience in hospitals working with patients and I can’t seem to get more than 1 interview a cycle.
my UCAT for this year was 2710 (B2) with a 630 in VR but got an automatic rejection from Warwick

Thanks mate. I'm sorry you didn't get an offer it's such a tough proces. I have a first in biomed. I have 18 months working as an HCA taking bloods, ECGs, vaccinations etc in a GP practice. I actually got a lower UCAT than you (2700, B2, 600 VR). As long as you hit the minimum threshold for warwick UCAT, it doesn't really matter. Sounds like they didn't accept your work experience. Could you describe more in depth what it is?

Reply 10

AlexTail

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Thanks mate. I'm sorry you didn't get an offer it's such a tough proces. I have a first in biomed. I have 18 months working as an HCA taking bloods, ECGs, vaccinations etc in a GP practice. I actually got a lower UCAT than you (2700, B2, 600 VR). As long as you hit the minimum threshold for warwick UCAT, it doesn't really matter. Sounds like they didn't accept your work experience. Could you describe more in depth what it is?

Having a 1st does lower the UCAT requirement as far as I know, just checked the GEM spreadsheet on here and majority were on the high end of 2700, so I assumed it’s the UCAT but then they also had lower VR which Warwick says cares about a lot.

I worked in patient experience in Charing Cross for 6months, did extensive shadowing at Bart’s hospital and did work at a pharmacy for a year. Also worked as care assistant for 3 months but that was outside the scope of Warwick timeline

Reply 11

OP

Original post by AlexTail

Having a 1st does lower the UCAT requirement as far as I know, just checked the GEM spreadsheet on here and majority were on the high end of 2700, so I assumed it’s the UCAT but then they also had lower VR which Warwick says cares about a lot.

I worked in patient experience in Charing Cross for 6months, did extensive shadowing at Bart’s hospital and did work at a pharmacy for a year. Also worked as care assistant for 3 months but that was outside the scope of Warwick timeline

I've spoken to admissions directly. Minimum requirement is a 2:1. Having higher does not improve your chances or lower the UCAT. I'm not sure what patient experience is sorry. Shadowing and pharmacy experience won't cut it alone for warwick as they want hands-on healthcare exp. Once you've upped that you should get to interview level.

Reply 12

GradMendes

10

Original post by GradMedPursuit

I've spoken to admissions directly. Minimum requirement is a 2:1. Having higher does not improve your chances or lower the UCAT. I'm not sure what patient experience is sorry. Shadowing and pharmacy experience won't cut it alone for warwick as they want hands-on healthcare exp. Once you've upped that you should get to interview level.

Was just about to second this. Warwick have a section on their website directly about using pharmacy as work experience… there are certain requirements you have to meet otherwise it’s not accepted as a placement.

Not sure what patient experience is either… you may be better off getting another HCA job as this is the best possible experience you can get before applying.

Shadowing is fine but can only make up 20/70 hours and would only be really accepted on the side of a HCA job for example, unless your pharmacy position met their requirements.

I worked as a HCA, shadowed a GP and also volunteered on a ward where I had to do things like feed patients, help them change, mobilise and so on (but just not observations or anything too clinical). Hope that helps @AlexTail!

(edited 1 year ago)

Reply 13

sully2341

5

I've just had a read through this thread and noticed some people mention needing help with the UCAT and the VR section. I managed to score 890 on VR with an average of 790 overall this year and an average of 770 in 2021 so I'll try and give you tips that helped me. I'm just gunna copy and paste a message I sent to someone about VR, hopefully it can help you out with your UCAT prep this year! If you have any questions or need help, feel free to dm me.

"...I do really recommend Medify, I think it's mock exams are insanely useful to practice with. I'd say the two most important things for me are 1) Making use of the keyboard controls to save important seconds, and 2) Knowing when a question is a time-waster.

For VR, it's very very easy to get caught up reading and rereading a passage and just wasting time on it. There are only 4/11 that are true/false/cant tell, absolutely make sure you have enough time to complete these four as they are much easier marks to guarantee compared to the 7/11 that are more reading comprehension. If that means you have to completely guess, flag, and come back to one of the harder passages that is totally okay. Each question has different difficulties but they are all equal marks. It's better to answer 8-9/11 sets of questions with confidence and completely guess the rest than to struggle on the hard marks and miss out on guaranteeing the easy marks.

And, it's important when reading a passage to apply a single key phrase to each paragraph you read. Most passages will stick with the same format of Intro/Backstory, Focus A (random examples but e.g. talking about history of King George), Focus B, (Talking about his involvement in a war), Recent developments (e.g. talking about modern interpretations of his actions). So when you see the question, you can be like Oh, this question is about this paragraph and you don't have to spend as much time finding it. This will come with prep and the more you expose yourself to passages and actively use this approach you'll start to see how most passages follow the same structure. It'll help you speed read the text and gain a good base understanding without having to try and commit certain names/dates and their position in the text to memory.

Spend some time, at least 4-6 weeks doing prep before your real exam, one week per section is usually good. Maybe less if you feel confident on a section. And make sure to spend at least a week, hopefully 2 weeks doing a Full Mock a day. By the time I did my exams both years round I had done over 5000 practice questions in total and about 10-15 mocks so really try and aim for minimum 3500 practice questions and 10 mocks.

That's kinda everything I can get down here without rambling for ages but try structuring your approach in that way and hopefully it works out for you. If it's all stuff you've heard before, just make sure you're properly applying them before you write them off. Wishing you the best of luck!!!"

Reply 14

OP

Original post by GradMedPursuit

Hi all,
I recently got an offer to study graduate medicine at Warwick University, starting September 2023. It has taken me three cycles to finally gain an offer. Getting into graduate medicine is extremely difficult and takes a lot of hard work. I am going to start posting as much as I can on all the different factors that helped me get an offer. I will discuss my GCSEs, A-levels, work experience, UCAT, interview prep, dealing with stress, coping with failure and anything else you'd like to know.
Will speak more soon!

About me:
At 16, I had no clue what kind of career I wanted. I got good (but not amazing) grades of 5As, 5Bs and 1C. I decided to do A-level chemistry, physics and biology as I enjoyed the sciences. I still wasn't sure on what I wanted to do at university, so I decided to apply to medicine and biomedical science. I got a pre-interview rejection for medicine (due to GCSEs) and conditional offers for biomed. After achieving A*BB, I took the offer for Birmingham uni. I really enjoyed the breadth and depth of the course, but couldn't see myself working in a lab/office-based job. I also couldn't really see any clear path completing a masters or PhD. It was actually becoming a tennis coach part-time that I found I enjoyed working with people and found it very rewarding. After acheiving a 1st class degree, I decided I needed to get some experience in the healthcare sector to determine whether medicine is a career I truly wanted to pursue.

Reply 15

Elsatrish1

8

hey!

I graduate from Physiology at Newcastle Uni in 2024 but I plan on taking a gap year, so I'm interested in applying for 2025 entry.

My top choice of GEM course / medical school at the moment is Liverpool, I pretty much have my heart set on going there for the A101 course. I am also interested in the Manchester, who have just announced an A101 course starting from 2024 entry. I am really excited about this because I had Manchester as my insurance for undergrad and I regret not choosing it tbh. I love the city so much and it would be much closer to home, same as Liverpool. I am set on wanting to go to medical in the North West, although I am currently at Newcastle Uni who also offers an A101 course. I think I am still going to apply for Newcastle but I'd rather not be here any longer.

just wondering as well when you think a good time is to start prep for the admissions test? Liverpool (and Notts) requires the GAMSAT so I was thinking to start in September and aim for the March 2024 test. I hate cramming and I think it will be best if I plan in advance so I can also focus on getting my 2:1. I will also be doing the UCAT but I'll focus on that more next year I think.

have you got any advice in particular about what you did in the years where you didn't get in and weren't doing anything academic? I'm hoping to use that year to travel, save lots of money and also sort of build up my application. how much did you do for your successful application? I know they are looking mostly at what you thought, felt and general reflection rather than what you saw. I would also love more information on interviews and how you prepped for that?

(edited 9 months ago)

Reply 16

Asc999

Keen to hear you share what made your attempts unsuccessful. I'm applying to grad and undergrad entry at Southampton. I have a 1st in my BSc and a PGDip, UCAT of 3260, 8 years NHS experience and am currently a specialist paramedic so I think I have a reasonably strong application but the competition ratio is incredibly high.

Reply 17

marble arch

12

Original post by Asc999

Keen to hear you share what made your attempts unsuccessful. I'm applying to grad and undergrad entry at Southampton. I have a 1st in my BSc and a PGDip, UCAT of 3260, 8 years NHS experience and am currently a specialist paramedic so I think I have a reasonably strong application but the competition ratio is incredibly high.

amazing UCAT, any tips?!

Reply 18

Asc999

Original post by marble arch

amazing UCAT, any tips?!

Honestly I didn't really have much of a strategy to revising other than repetition. I only practiced QR and AR as I was quite weak on those and just relied on the mocks to improve on VR and DM. Think in total did about 15 mocks and 1000 of the AR questions on Medify.

Reply 19

RKU03