Rishi Sunak considers radical shake-up of A-levels
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-66895259
https://news.sky.com/story/rishi-sunak-considering-british-baccalaureate-as-part-of-education-overhaul-12966778
I do not like the A-level system in England and could complain about it all day but not sure if this the solution.
I'd like to be taught more relevant content in English for a start.
https://news.sky.com/story/rishi-sunak-considering-british-baccalaureate-as-part-of-education-overhaul-12966778
I do not like the A-level system in England and could complain about it all day but not sure if this the solution.
I'd like to be taught more relevant content in English for a start.
Scroll to see replies
Every time the academic standards in the UK education system expose failing standards, those in Educational planning and those in power immediately want to cover it up by grade inflation or fiddle with changes to the 'curriculum' - 'Nothing to see here'
The amazing hypocrisy here is that Scotland had an excellent schooling system of exams called 'Highers' and students in years 12/13 would takes a greater number of 'Highers' giving a broader knowledge base than the equivalent subject intensive A-Levels. In the UK when it became apparent that not all students were academically suited to A Levels, AS Levels were introduced.
Scottish education used to be a leader in academic educational standards. In Scotland, the broad based education system of 'Highers' were disbanded and the dumbed down political 'Curriculum for Excellence' introduced across all Scottish schools. Guess what? Academic standards have plummeted since, and so have standards in basic literacy and numeracy. Education in Scotland has been deliberately politicised and Scotland now languishes near the bottom of the league tables of Western nations. Precisely because it has no rigour in knowledge and fact based education.
Everyone is now expected to get a degree (which devalues this qualification) and students are forced to continue Maths and English to the year 18 because it has never been taught properly from Primary school level to a student leaving school. There will continue to be a loss of confidence in educational qualifications issued by schools and some Universities, and students will not be helped by fiddling with these qualifications.
If our schooling curriculum was so good we would just use the International Baccalaureate. We have to have a specific 'British' Baccalaureate because Ministers know our state educational standards are not even close to the International one.
The amazing hypocrisy here is that Scotland had an excellent schooling system of exams called 'Highers' and students in years 12/13 would takes a greater number of 'Highers' giving a broader knowledge base than the equivalent subject intensive A-Levels. In the UK when it became apparent that not all students were academically suited to A Levels, AS Levels were introduced.
Scottish education used to be a leader in academic educational standards. In Scotland, the broad based education system of 'Highers' were disbanded and the dumbed down political 'Curriculum for Excellence' introduced across all Scottish schools. Guess what? Academic standards have plummeted since, and so have standards in basic literacy and numeracy. Education in Scotland has been deliberately politicised and Scotland now languishes near the bottom of the league tables of Western nations. Precisely because it has no rigour in knowledge and fact based education.
Everyone is now expected to get a degree (which devalues this qualification) and students are forced to continue Maths and English to the year 18 because it has never been taught properly from Primary school level to a student leaving school. There will continue to be a loss of confidence in educational qualifications issued by schools and some Universities, and students will not be helped by fiddling with these qualifications.
If our schooling curriculum was so good we would just use the International Baccalaureate. We have to have a specific 'British' Baccalaureate because Ministers know our state educational standards are not even close to the International one.
Original post by Muttly
Everyone is now expected to get a degree (which devalues this qualification) and students are forced to continue Maths and English to the year 18 because it has never been taught properly from Primary school level to a student leaving school. There will continue to be a loss of confidence in educational qualifications issued by schools and some Universities, and students will not be helped by fiddling with these qualifications.
You make some fair points. A-levels are not for everyone and the alternatives (BTEC and CTEC) are pretty woeful both in content and the manner in which they are assessed. I also agree that we keep tinkering around the edges but at the same time wholesale change is difficult to implement because of the specialist nature of 6th form education. For example, Sunak's devotion to maths is genuinely one of his better ideas, but practically it can't be delivered simply because there are insufficient teachers and repeated attempts to fill the teacher shortfall have failed throughout the Tory years. Until we pay teachers equivalent pay to the private sector we don't stand a chance. It is also worth pointing out that where as teachers are set to enjoy a 6% increase this year, so far 6th form teachers have been promised 0%.
However, I do take umbridge with your point above. Firstly, not everyone does go to university. It is around a third of students who go. But this idea also comes from the days when many young people walked straight into employment and for the truly rose tinted eyes, at the factory at the end of the street they lived in. Those days are long gone and jobs we associate with manual labour, usually the trades, are now high skilled jobs requiring high levels of literacy and maths (well spotted Sunak). You can't be a plumber for example if you can't interpret complex legal standards. We now live in a service based and increasingly information based economy and the skills and knowledge required to work in that economy are high level, dare I say degree level skills.
I do think we need to reform university education. There is still too strong emphasis on the academic rather than on soft skills. Many universities recognise this and have set up programmes on topics like leadership, management, problem solving, resilience, even things like podcasting and technical authorship, but these courses are often poorly attended or not well advertised, or students don't see the value of them.
Yes things need to change but what we have isn't rotten to the core. We would be fools to try and start again. That never works.
(edited 7 months ago)
Wow the party barely clinging to power which has had a revolving door of leaders is just suggesting more and more controversial and sweeping new changes to policy in order to make it look like they're capable of doing anything (while also distracting from other pressing issues like the fact half the labour force is on strike at any given time)?
Honestly the only surprising thing is the thought that they can or will follow through with this. They have less than 2 years before the general election and that is not enough time to fully plan and implement a brand new sweeping educational policy change. If they had spent the last 3 years planning this then they might be able to deliver it before then but since it's just the latest brain fart to pop into the Conservatives' single shared braincell it's not going to happen unless they somehow win the general election, which seems a remote possibility.
Honestly the only surprising thing is the thought that they can or will follow through with this. They have less than 2 years before the general election and that is not enough time to fully plan and implement a brand new sweeping educational policy change. If they had spent the last 3 years planning this then they might be able to deliver it before then but since it's just the latest brain fart to pop into the Conservatives' single shared braincell it's not going to happen unless they somehow win the general election, which seems a remote possibility.
(edited 7 months ago)
I hate the idea of having to do english and maths up until the age of 18
Most of what we learn even for gcses is irrelevant and will never be used again. When I am going need to know the reason that Shakespeare portrayed Beatrice and Hero as foils, or find out what 4^-3/5 ( four to the power of minus three fifths), or why the poet chose to write in three line stanzas instead of four?
These things are completely useless and doing them until 18 will ruin mental health and make people spend less time studying the subjects they want to do to help in their future
Most of what we learn even for gcses is irrelevant and will never be used again. When I am going need to know the reason that Shakespeare portrayed Beatrice and Hero as foils, or find out what 4^-3/5 ( four to the power of minus three fifths), or why the poet chose to write in three line stanzas instead of four?
These things are completely useless and doing them until 18 will ruin mental health and make people spend less time studying the subjects they want to do to help in their future
Original post by agent_duck343
I hate the idea of having to do english and maths up until the age of 18
Most of what we learn even for gcses is irrelevant and will never be used again. When I am going need to know the reason that Shakespeare portrayed Beatrice and Hero as foils, or find out what 4^-3/5 ( four to the power of minus three fifths), or why the poet chose to write in three line stanzas instead of four?
These things are completely useless and doing them until 18 will ruin mental health and make people spend less time studying the subjects they want to do to help in their future
Most of what we learn even for gcses is irrelevant and will never be used again. When I am going need to know the reason that Shakespeare portrayed Beatrice and Hero as foils, or find out what 4^-3/5 ( four to the power of minus three fifths), or why the poet chose to write in three line stanzas instead of four?
These things are completely useless and doing them until 18 will ruin mental health and make people spend less time studying the subjects they want to do to help in their future
What I’m saying. The education system was asking me to explain how Shakespeare presents Macbeth as a violent character throughout the play when I couldn’t string together a page/paragraph worth of writing in an English lesson, couldn’t paraphrase or summarise crap. Only after leaving school am I being taught how to summarise texts properly, how to write in a professional tone, how to avoid plagiarism how to reference/research and do a literature review etc.
I’d say fix this kind of problem first before making English and Maths mandatory until 18.
Another dead cat policy to distract from the fact that the current government has overseen literally collapsing schools
Original post by Talkative Toad
What I’m saying. The education system was asking me to explain how Shakespeare presents Macbeth as a violent character throughout the play when I couldn’t string together a page/paragraph worth of writing in an English lesson, couldn’t paraphrase or summarise crap. Only after leaving school am I being taught how to summarise texts properly, how to write in a professional tone, how to avoid plagiarism how to reference/research and do a literature review etc.
I’d say fix this kind of problem first before making English and Maths mandatory until 18.
I’d say fix this kind of problem first before making English and Maths mandatory until 18.
+ PRSOM
Perpetual story but isn't gonna happen
Original post by gjd800
He's a ******* idiot
To be fair in a lot of other countries, you have to do English and/or Maths and/or Science until the legal school leaving age but I honestly don’t think that this is the solution and I believe that we need to improve the current education system first.
Start teaching me English to a higher quality from at a young age, make sure that by secondary school I can do the basics in English. In secondary school me research skills, referencing, how to summarise stuff, make me analyse politics, philosophy and up to date literature instead of Shakespeare etc
Original post by Talkative Toad
To be fair in a lot of other countries, you have to do English and/or Maths and/or Science until the legal school leaving age but I honestly don’t think that this is the solution and I believe that we need to improve the current education system first.
Start teaching me English to a higher quality from at a young age, make sure that by secondary school I can do the basics in English. In secondary school me research skills, referencing, how to summarise stuff, make me analyse politics, philosophy and up to date literature instead of Shakespeare etc
Start teaching me English to a higher quality from at a young age, make sure that by secondary school I can do the basics in English. In secondary school me research skills, referencing, how to summarise stuff, make me analyse politics, philosophy and up to date literature instead of Shakespeare etc
I had to do all three to school leaving age, 20 years ago when I could leave school at 16. Then they changed the goalposts for the compulsory aspect, leaving people needlessly locked into education until 18.
None of which detracts from Sunak being a clueless moron.
Original post by gjd800
I had to do all three to school leaving age, 20 years ago when I could leave school at 16. Then they changed the goalposts for the compulsory aspect, leaving people needlessly locked into education until 18.
None of which detracts from Sunak being a clueless moron.
I had to do all three to school leaving age, 20 years ago when I could leave school at 16. Then they changed the goalposts for the compulsory aspect, leaving people needlessly locked into education until 18.
None of which detracts from Sunak being a clueless moron.
Yeah England wants to be unique, you needing to be in school until your 18 whilst being able to drop maths, English and Science simultaneously before then (because of sixth form/college), whilst having major exams at 16 years old etc.
Even the rest of the UK as far as I’m aware you can quit school once you’re 16.
It wouldn’t have bothered me doing Maths until I turned 18 but English was just boring for me.
Original post by Talkative Toad
Yeah England wants to be unique, you needing to be in school until your 18 whilst being able to drop maths, English and Science simultaneously before then (because of sixth form/college), whilst having major exams at 16 years old etc.
Even the rest of the UK as far as I’m aware you can quit school once you’re 16.
It wouldn’t have bothered me doing Maths until I turned 18 but English was just boring for me.
Even the rest of the UK as far as I’m aware you can quit school once you’re 16.
It wouldn’t have bothered me doing Maths until I turned 18 but English was just boring for me.
I took my maths GCSE a year early so that I could drift through year 11 and not be arsed about the result at the end.
B in year 10, B in year 11, but with no work. Sorted.
(edited 7 months ago)
Original post by gjd800
I took my maths GCSE a year early so that I could drift through year 11 and not be arsed about the result at the end.
I took my maths GCSE a year early so that I could drift through year 11 and not be arsed about the result at the end.
It’s usually English Language that people like/tend to do a year early these days I think as opposed to Maths but fair play.
Original post by Talkative Toad
Yeah England wants to be unique, you needing to be in school until your 18 whilst being able to drop maths, English and Science simultaneously before then (because of sixth form/college), whilst having major exams at 16 years old etc.
Even the rest of the UK as far as I’m aware you can quit school once you’re 16.
It wouldn’t have bothered me doing Maths until I turned 18 but English was just boring for me.
Even the rest of the UK as far as I’m aware you can quit school once you’re 16.
It wouldn’t have bothered me doing Maths until I turned 18 but English was just boring for me.
School used to only be compulsory up until the age of 16. The compulsory schooling (or apprenticeship/similar) to 18 (17 originally then extended to 18) was brought in by the Conservatives to combat the high youth unemployment rates in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis by basically creating a false economy - can't have youth unemployment if they're all in school. Of course many just became unemployed adults at 18 instead as they didn't really do anything to address the challenges those youths faced in school which then caused them to struggle to obtain employment in a challenging economy.
Original post by artful_lounger
School used to only be compulsory up until the age of 16. The compulsory schooling (or apprenticeship/similar) to 18 (17 originally then extended to 18) was brought in by the Conservatives to combat the high youth unemployment rates in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis by basically creating a false economy - can't have youth unemployment if they're all in school. Of course many just became unemployed adults at 18 instead as they didn't really do anything to address the challenges those youths faced in school which then caused them to struggle to obtain employment in a challenging economy.
School used to only be compulsory up until the age of 16. The compulsory schooling (or apprenticeship/similar) to 18 (17 originally then extended to 18) was brought in by the Conservatives to combat the high youth unemployment rates in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis by basically creating a false economy - can't have youth unemployment if they're all in school. Of course many just became unemployed adults at 18 instead as they didn't really do anything to address the challenges those youths faced in school which then caused them to struggle to obtain employment in a challenging economy.
Yeah I think that I remember it being 16 before.
Original post by Talkative Toad
Yeah I think that I remember it being 16 before.
It was when I was in school.
(although to be fair the neo-liberal Blairites were also onboard with raising the age for much the same reasons, rather than actually engaging with the reasons why those left school to go into work and then struggled finding work)
Original post by artful_lounger
It was when I was in school.
(although to be fair the neo-liberal Blairites were also onboard with raising the age for much the same reasons, rather than actually engaging with the reasons why those left school to go into work and then struggled finding work)
(although to be fair the neo-liberal Blairites were also onboard with raising the age for much the same reasons, rather than actually engaging with the reasons why those left school to go into work and then struggled finding work)
Yeah now the government has taken things a step further and seems to be obsessed with people needing to university (as opposed to making it so that the student is encouraged to do what’s best for them).
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