Why does manchester uni rank so low for even physics in the league tables?

I thought manchester uni is supposed to be strong in physical sciences and especially physics. But why it ranks so low on the league table? And even more confusing is they are asking for A*AA grades? When it ranks so low?

Link?

They ask for A*AA because it's a hugely popular course, no doubt helped long in recent years by the fact they have both Brian Cox and the 2010 Nobel Prize winners who first isolated graphene easily.

Reply 3

kaffee

OP

9

Original post by PythianLegume

They ask for A*AA because it's a hugely popular course, no doubt helped long in recent years by the fact they have both Brian Cox and the 2010 Nobel Prize winners who first isolated graphene easily.

Ok I checked it up - Novoselov and Geim, both studied in Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology, but merely did their work on graphene in UoM.

Hmm. But Brian Cox studied in UoM.

But why research assessment still so low? Even lower than Nottingham Trent? And graduate prospects also low.

So you mean the teaching is not that great; entry requirements are high simply because the course is popular?

Is UoM 'prestigious' for physics, anyhow still? Is popularity/hype or academic standards a more definitive factor for 'prestige'? And I just found out, UoM came in 28 for QS World ranking for physics, finally overtaking Durham. Probably thats the reason for its high entry requirements. Can it be considered 'prestigious' then?

By the way, what is the reason that UoM is so highly ranked for music?

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 4

username1107539

12

Original post by kaffee

I thought manchester uni is supposed to be strong in physical sciences and especially physics. But why it ranks so low on the league table? And even more confusing is they are asking for A*AA grades? When it ranks so low?

Because Manchester in general is a s***hole. They told me at interview that they are "harder to get into than Oxford" - utter trubbish. They're pretentious and like Liverpool uni they have the attitude that because at one point they were well regarded, they simply don't need to try any more. It'll bite them on the proverbial eventually.

Reply 5

William Turtle

14

Original post by kaffee

Ok I checked it up - Novoselov and Geim, both studied in Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology, but merely did their work on graphene in UoM.

Where they worked earlier in their careers is irrelevant when it comes to Manchester's research assessment...

I believe that Geim doesn't really teach undergrads - he says he doesn't like them.

Are the research assessments you're talking about from 2008? Or are they the new 2014 ones?

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Reply 6

Rock_Set

2

Original post by PythianLegume

They ask for A*AA because it's a hugely popular course, no doubt helped long in recent years by the fact they have both Brian Cox and the 2010 Nobel Prize winners who first isolated graphene easily.

The standard offer is A*A*A now, I went for a group interview and they gave us the offers before the interview

Reply 7

TheBBQ

21

When I went to my interview they really liked to show off about their nobel prize winners and brian cox.. whilst other unis focused more on the courses and where the students went afterwards and the actual relevant things.

Reply 8

username457532

17

When I went to look round Manchester back in 2010 the physics department wasn't open on the open day. Decided it was a **** uni and didn't apply.

Reply 9

Crumpet1

19

Which league tables are you looking at? It seems to rank well in these two?
http://www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings?s=Physics%20%26%20Astronomy

http://www.theguardian.com/education/table/2013/jun/04/university-guide-physics

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 10

William Turtle

14

Original post by Crumpet1

Which league tables are you looking at? It seems to rank well in these two?
http://www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings?s=Physics%20%26%20Astronomy

http://www.theguardian.com/education/table/2013/jun/04/university-guide-physics

Both of those tables are a pile of crap (possibly what the OP has been looking at). Don't base anything on domestic league tables, because they include dodgy student satisfaction scores.

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Reply 11

William Turtle

14

Original post by kaffee

I thought manchester uni is supposed to be strong in physical sciences and especially physics. But why it ranks so low on the league table? And even more confusing is they are asking for A*AA grades? When it ranks so low?

Looks like you're talking rubbish. Look at international league tables. According to the Times, Manchester is 5th in the UK for physical sciences (50th in the world).

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Reply 12

kaffee

OP

9

Original post by Crumpet1

Which league tables are you looking at? It seems to rank well in these two?
http://www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings?s=Physics%20%26%20Astronomy

http://www.theguardian.com/education/table/2013/jun/04/university-guide-physics

The position is like 12ish, 10ish. I mean, considering the fact that UoM's high international ranking (30+ in the QS world ranking) is attributed mainly to its strength in the physical sciences, shouldn't it be making single digit position on the national league tables? It can rank number 1 for music, so I'm just wondering why it can't do the same for the subject it's well known for. Hmm now I have just realized even for Chemistry on the CUG league table its 14th only. I'm actually hoping for someone to assure me how full of crap the national league tables are.

Reply 13

Crumpet1

19

Original post by kaffee

The position is like 12ish, 10ish. I mean, considering the fact that UoM's high international ranking (30+ in the QS world ranking) is attributed mainly to its strength in the physical sciences, shouldn't it be making single digit position on the national league tables? It can rank number 1 for music, so I'm just wondering why it can't do the same for the subject it's well known for. Hmm now I have just realized even for Chemistry on the CUG league table its 14th only. I'm actually hoping for someone to assure me how full of crap the national league tables are.

You're expecting far too much from league tables, which are flawed in terms of the weighting that they put on various factors such as student satisfaction. Any decent university in any subject can bob around the top 20, but so long as they are consistently remaining in the top 20 or thereabouts you don't have anything to worry about. There are many excellent universities in the UK, and aside from Oxford and Cambridge very few of them hold consistent places in the rankings.

Reply 14

kaffee

OP

9

Original post by William Turtle

Both of those tables are a pile of crap (possibly what the OP has been looking at). Don't base anything on domestic league tables, because they include dodgy student satisfaction scores.

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Yes I am talking about the crappy domestic league tables. Ok you seem pretty saavy. Then can you help me with this other question. Does the entry standard score include the grades the universities accept in clearing? Is it such that if a particular university does not enter clearing, the entry standard score will automatically be pulled up the coming year? Or is the score purely based on the offers the university make?

Reply 15

kaffee

OP

9

Original post by Crumpet1

You're expecting far too much from league tables, which are flawed in terms of the weighting that they put on various factors such as student satisfaction. Any decent university in any subject can bob around the top 20, but so long as they are consistently remaining in the top 20 or thereabouts you don't have anything to worry about. There are many excellent universities in the UK, and aside from Oxford and Cambridge very few of them hold consistent places in the rankings.

Ok. Can you help me with this: between Manchester and Birmingham which one should I choose. For law. Why Manchester's 'satisfaction with feedback' on the guardian league table for law always hovers around 50 something?

Reply 16

kaffee

OP

9

Original post by William Turtle

Where they worked earlier in their careers is irrelevant when it comes to Manchester's research assessment...

I believe that Geim doesn't really teach undergrads - he says he doesn't like them.

Are the research assessments you're talking about from 2008? Or are they the new 2014 ones?

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Ok.. I checked back at the website again and heres what it says "The REF outcomes will be published on 18 December 2014. Further information is available."

But do you have more information about it? Or have you heard any rumors? If not how do you think Manchester will fare?

Reply 17

Crumpet1

19

Original post by kaffee

Ok. Can you help me with this: between Manchester and Birmingham which one should I choose. For law. Why Manchester's 'satisfaction with feedback' on the guardian league table for law always hovers around 50 something?

They're much of a muchness. I'd suggest you visit both and decide which one you prefer. Or more practical, apply to both and see where you receive offers from. You have five choices after all.

Don't forget Birmingham is an LNAT uni. Had you planned to take it?