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    (Original post by tehforum)
    That's the point.

    There's no level of specificity as to the weapons being used, and the areas that they are being used.

    Because they cannot target combatants, without killing non-combatants to a disproportionate degree then its genocide and a war crime.
    Fair, I am the first to admit that I am not educated in international law - but as far as I am concerned "genocide" is just a blanket term and is pretty irrelevant. I try to observe this situation as objectively as possible, and I fundamentally believe that playing the blame game is futile and will only take everyone round in circles. Less blame, more solutions.

    Two wrongs don't make a right.

    The aims of Israel's 'defence' are reasonable, the application is not. They must understand that war must adhere to a conduct, which they are clearly disregarding - without repercussions. However, Hamas are not helping themselves. Stockpiling weapons under hospitals, spending budget on smuggling arms, building tunnels and launching rockets into Israel - rather than addressing the economical hardship demonstrates their ambitions and ultimately forces the hand of their Israeli neighbours.

    But at the same time, Israel came in heavy handed from day 1, arresting hundreds of 'Hamas' members in the West Bank after the schoolboy murders. This was in my opinion nothing more than a knee-jerk act of revenge (without proof might I add) in order to provoke a response. Further, the targetting of Gaza's only power-plant is inexcusable, along with civilian housing and amenities.

    If there is to be progress, compromise really needs to be initiated by Hamas, and arguably mediated by Qatar, seeing as Egypt has a vested interest to repress them since the fall of Morsi. Let's remember, all ceasefires to date in this most recent conflict have been ended by Hamas.

    But even then, give it 2 years and we will read about it all over again.
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    (Original post by tehforum)
    Clueless.

    The definition of genocide is clear enough, so with the requisite evidence, it is in fact genocide, notwithstanding the lower numbers involved.
    (Original post by tehforum)
    That's the point.

    There's no level of specificity as to the weapons being used, and the areas that they are being used.

    Because they cannot target combatants, without killing non-combatants to a disproportionate degree then its genocide and a war crime.
    If you're correct then the inevitable conclusion is that Israel cannot do anything to stop Hamas firing rockets without committing genocide. Is that what you're saying?
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    Accusations of war crimes are easy to come by, but prosecutions of them are not. While the UN Human Rights Council conducted a war crimes inquiry into a three-week conflict in Gaza in 2008-9 that concluded there had been serious violations on both sides, it had no powers of enforcement. For prosecution to actually go ahead, the domestic country must first have investigated its own conduct.

    Natas says that Israel’s analysis of its own actions during war has never been carried out with sufficient rigor or impartiality, and believes it will be much the same after Operation Protective Edge. So, he says, “two NGOs in Gaza – al-Mezan and the Palestinian Center for Human Rights – will be impartially collecting evidence of war crimes along with the U.N.”

    Though Natas says the Gazan NGOs will also report on any crimes committed by Hamas, Bell says the militant group won’t carry out an internal investigation into its own conduct either. “A terrorist organization is not going to investigate its own war crimes,” he says.
    Interesting quote I found - didn't know this.
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    Can someone explain this war please. I was told the war occurred many years ago but has come a light again... Why are Israel in war with Gaza and Palestinians. Who is in the right? Usually everyone's biased towards this war but any information will be helpful.


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    (Original post by Reem29)
    Anyone with a right mind would disagree with what Israel is doing. There's no justification in my opinion.
    The same appkies if you replace Israel with Hamas in that sentence, but Israel are the ones getting all the stick.
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    Why not go and search one of the other 1,000 threads on the topic on TSR, rather than having your mind made up by the first person who posts whatever their insanely biased view on the topic is.
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    (Original post by FITZ3030)
    Can someone explain this war please. I was told the war occurred many years ago but has come a light again... Why are Israel in war with Gaza and Palestinians. Who is in the right? Usually everyone's biased towards this war but any information will be helpful.


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    (Original post by Huskaris)
    Why not go and search one of the other 1,000 threads on the topic on TSR, rather than having your mind made up by the first person who posts whatever their insanely biased view on the topic is.

    This.
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    (Original post by tehforum)
    Clueless.

    The definition of genocide is clear enough, so with the requisite evidence, it is in fact genocide, notwithstanding the lower numbers involved.
    Here's an interesting article on the subject: http://www.usip.org/sites/default/fi...t2Section1.pdf

    Please allow me to quote the relevant section:

    A person commits the criminal offense of genocide when he or she commits any of the following acts with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group as such:
    (a) killingmembersofthegroup
    It is necessary to prove only that the perpetrator of genocide intended to destroy the group “in part.” The ICTY and the ICTR have interpreted this requirement by adding the adjective substantial, which indicates a quantitative dimension, or significant, which suggests a qualitative dimension. The ICTR has said “that ‘in part’ requires the intention to destroy a considerable number of individuals” (Prosecutor v. Kayishema et al., case no. ICTR*95*1*T, Judgment and Sentence, May 21, 1999, paragraph 97). An ICTY and ICTR trial chamber said that genocide must involve the intent to destroy a “substantial” part, although not necessarily a “very important part” (Prosecutor v. Jelisic ́, case no. IT*95*10*T, Judgment, October 19, 1999; Prosecutor v. Bagilishema, case no. ICTR*95*1A*T, Judgment, June 7, 2001, paragraphs 56–59). In another judgment, the ICTY referred to a “reasonably substantial” number relative to the group as a whole (Prosecutor v. Jelisic ́, case no. IT*95*10*T, Judgment, October 19, 1999; Prosecutor v. Bagilishema, case no. ICTR*95*1A*T, Judgment, June 7, 2001, paragraphs 56–59).
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    (Original post by Algorithm69)
    If Israel is committing genocide they are doing an incredibly poor job executing it. In three years, the Syrian Civil War has claimed 250,000 lives. In 48 years, the Israel - Palestine conflict has claimed 21,000. Only a moron would describe Israel's actions as genocide.
    Very well said. And if anyone wants a Palestinian genocide, one could only conclude it's Hamas themselves. As the Guardian reported
    Hamas officials in Gaza have threatened to restart hostilities "the minute" after the 72-hour ceasefire agreed with Israel expires at 5am GMT on Friday if their demands are not met.
    So basically making demands they know Israel won't agree to, and saying they want to go back to war. For Hamas, it's all about dead civilians, they celebrate when they see dead Palestinians. They revel in Palestinian death, that's why they want to restart the conflict
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    Hamas has just announced that if Israel doesn't immediately agree to their terroristic demands, they will restart the conflict "the minute" the 72-hour ceasefire ends. They clearly revel in Palestinian death, Hamas desperately desires to see more dead Palestinian civilians.
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    (Original post by FITZ3030)
    Can someone explain this war please. I was told the war occurred many years ago but has come a light again... Why are Israel in war with Gaza and Palestinians. Who is in the right? Usually everyone's biased towards this war but any information will be helpful.


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    What is the point of asking 'who is right'? It's war, so it's bound to be controversial and people will have different opinions on who's defending and who's attacking.
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    Hamas: If Gaza blockade isn't lifted, we'll renew fire Friday
    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...556144,00.html

    Nice work there. The blockade is in place as a result of the two hundred civilian deaths from terrorists bombs several years ago. You worsened it yourself.

    What's funny is Egypt also had a blockade, why don't they go and threaten them, see how that goes.
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    (Original post by Agapelove)
    MLK Jr. was fighting for equal rights. The people in Gaza want equal rights with the people of Israel, yes or no?
    Of course not. They want the State of Israel to be dismantled and shipped off to wherever it came from...

    The nonviolent protests in the USA concerning allowing people of the same gender to marry has resulted in some states allowing same sex marriage.

    Now, if homosexuals had gone around using violence against those who do not believe in homosexual marriage, do you think some states would be allowing same sex marriage? I don't think so.
    Could you give me some statistics please? (i.e: how many people marched etc)

    Thanks to the Iron Dome.
    Which doesn't change the fact that HAMAS rockets only kill 0.07722% of the time...

    I live in the USA. Being hit by a rocket is not even a risk to me. Thankfully, the USA has nice neighbors (though the USA did fight with both neighbors early on in our history. Much of the US land by the way used to be a part of México.)
    You mean below the bible belt, right?

    Without Israeli security, there would be a much stronger chance for the rockets to hit and kill people in Israel.
    But they don't.

    Thought-provoking point.
    What would you do if someone, whom you initially welcomed into your home, brought all of his friends over and told you to go and get your own house somewhere else? He then started micro-managing your life, placing restrictions and curfews and allowing you the bare minimum to survive.

    How would you react?
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    (Original post by Algorithm69)
    If Israel is committing genocide they are doing an incredibly poor job executing it. In three years, the Syrian Civil War has claimed 250,000 lives. In 48 years, the Israel - Palestine conflict has claimed 21,000.

    Only a moron would describe Israel's actions as genocide.
    Fabulous.

    The reality is, the Jewish people have been persecuted for hundreds of years. Now that they have their own state it must be defended at all costs. If somebody fires a rocket from a property at Israel, Israel has the right to destroy the site the rocket came from, regardless of who is in it, as it is a threat to them. It's a very simply concept.

    The Pro-Palestinian protests that were chanting 'Heil Hitler' and other racist slogans are disgusting cretins. You go Israel and Netanyahu, don't stop until all Hamas militants are neutralised. Finish the job. :israel:
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    Whilst Israel keeps a poor record of keeping to their ceasefire agreements, it's weird that Hamas wouldn't want to extend this ceasefire agreement given the immense death toll that Gaza has incurred.

    Even amidst the abysmal conditions that Israel enforces , the sentiment to continue fighting until free are also shared by the Gazans.
    http://www.latimes.com/world/middlee...ry.html#page=1

    “I think the fact that people, even in the midst of this terrible physical destruction, are still talking about the economy is testament to how devastating the closure has been for people living in Gaza”

    “Of course I'm putting a lot of hope in the truce talks,” he said. “But if they don't lift the siege, I think we would prefer to stay at war.”

    Israel and Egypt refuse to end the suffocating siege of Gaza: Gazans refuse to live on 'just' the brink of survival without a fight.
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    (Original post by Agapelove)



    A mere mortal can call any group of people 'hypocrites'. Some people call Muslims 'hypocrites'. Muhammad can even be called a hypocrite, because while in one verse of the Qur'an it states that there is no compulsion in religion, in other verses in the Qur'an, fighting unbelievers is demanded. While Muhammad did not appreciate being expelled by the Meccans, he expelled other people groups once he had the power. Muhammad obviously did not obey Jesus' command to 'And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.' (Luke 6:31 KJV)

    However, God is Judge. God looks at each person's heart and sees if that person truly loves Him and truly loves other people (Matthew 22:39). Yeshua/Jesus Christ, who will return as King someday, commands his followers to love their enemies (Matthew 5:44; Luke 6;27-37). Like Muhammad, sadly the Crusaders did not love their enemies, and as a result, thousands of people including Muslims, other Christians and Jewish people were killed. On Judgement Day, they will be held accountable. You and I will also be held accountable for our thoughts, words and actions.
    You said you didn't understand why God allowed genocide before Christ and why God ordered burnt and sin offerings?

    If the Kings of Israel of the past could do such violence, unjustifiable what is called today as "war crimes" - then I don't see any problem for a Prophet of God as a head of state to honestly expand the state through conquest. Muhammad (pbuh) carried out the best of justice - you don't see any contemporary enemies of his claiming injustice.

    But you say that Jesus taught us "to love our enemies" - while on the other hand ancient Israel slaughtered their enemies under the order of the LORD. I believe that God is consistent in his Sunnah - in his Way. So I dismiss these man-made doctrines. The Koran seems more in line with the Torah (and the Tanach) than the man-written Gospels.

    If you were a follower of Moses, with this man-made (Satanic) doctrines (that the lamb of God deleted all the laws of God) in your head, you would have committed apostasy. The same way you accuse Muhammad (pbuh) I too could accuse David and Solomon (for their God-given orders, not sins). But they had something in common. They didn't believe man-made doctrines - that radically changed how God works.

    You have a deep and grave misunderstanding of the Koran. Do you even read from Islamic scholars - read the tafsirs - or talk to Muslims?
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    What would you do if someone, whom you initially welcomed into your home, brought all of his friends over and told you to go and get your own house somewhere else? He then started micro-managing your life, placing restrictions and curfews and allowing you the bare minimum to survive.

    How would you react?
    Sleep with them, duh
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    Obviously the Hamas cheerleaders on this forum will not change their minds - but now that they have broken another ceasefire (started firing rockets before the 72hour period) and have rejected an extension of the ceasefire for talks - it's pretty obvious to everyone who the guilty party is.
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    The Empty Spaces in Gaza including a map, for all those pro Hamas nuts who keep on insisting Hamas is justified in firing from the middle of a city.
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    I have written a blog entry (not commercial, doesn't even have ads) on this topic in light of the IDF's Operation Protective Edge. I would appreciate if you read, considered and shared the entry:

    http://warmingwaters2014.wordpress.com/children/
 
 
 
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