Do you believe that your background will decide your fate?
Do you believe that your background (social class, parents education level, birth country) will heavily influence where you end up and how far you would go in life?
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
(edited 10 years ago)
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Most people will reply with the obvious answer which is that it does heavily influence the lives of individuals, but then you'll get one fool who will start kicking up a fuss about how generalisations are bad and how a few people are able to come from a squalid background and become a huge success, therefore somehow making everyone else in the thread wrong.
(edited 10 years ago)
Everything is deterministic, there isnt some etheral force influencing our decisions or choices.
"Decide your fate" is a bit extreme, but as Mockery said, it clearly does have a huge influence upon people, for various reasons. Of course, we shouldn't ignore the role of genes as well - a significant proportion of the differences between people can be attributed to genes (this is completely different from saying that genes are deterministic, before anyone flames me).
Original post by GnomeMage
Do you believe that your background (social class, parents education level, birth country) will heavily influence where you end up and how far you would go in life?
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
If you don't try, you will never know.
I'm not saying anybody's wrong, but I personally don't think that the background influences what happens. More that you influence that from your own choices, and less from your history.
Yes it does heavily influence your achievements. Your opportunities and particularly mindset (unconscious and conscious) influenced by the setting in which you grow up. Life is a series of lucky chances. Saying that however, it is not an excuse for people to achieve below what they are capable of. Ultimately though, you cannot fault people for trying their best and not achieving things, as corny as it sounds. Despite what some absolute retards think on this forum, life needs its losers as well as its winners. You cannot be a winner without first having losers to compare yourself to and feel good about not being, if you have that sort of mindset.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by GnomeMage
Do you believe that your background (social class, parents education level, birth country) will heavily influence where you end up and how far you would go in life?
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
I have some really well off peers that are born with everything taken care off . they are good looking, thick wallet, they get good grades, get selected for uni teams (sports), get into the best uni, graduated with first class and have a great start in life with their careers.
sometimes i just feel like stop trying.
I tend not to think like that to be honest.
There are those people who have rich parents (Doctors, Investment Bankers, Lawyers), they go to the best schools, etc. But you have to think about how their parents became so successful. Their parents had to study and work hard to give their children the best opportunities in life. Every year, students from deprived areas such as Tower Hamlets are getting into medical schools, some are getting into top universities such as Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial/UCL for top subjects such as Economics, and they will have brilliant careers. They will give their children the best opportunities in life, so you must really congratulate their parents for working hard.
I think they have influenced me but wont determine my fate
Response: Yes. If you do not accept the TRUE meaning of life your head will fall off and your destiny will never be fruitful. Your logic contradicts itself OP, you have turned science on its head. What a false fallacy for us all to laugh at. Debunked.
MASSIVE influence
Original post by AnharM
I tend not to think like that to be honest.
There are those people who have rich parents (Doctors, Investment Bankers, Lawyers), they go to the best schools, etc. But you have to think about how their parents became so successful. Their parents had to study and work hard to give their children the best opportunities in life. Every year, students from deprived areas such as Tower Hamlets are getting into medical schools, some are getting into top universities such as Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial/UCL for top subjects such as Economics, and they will have brilliant careers. They will give their children the best opportunities in life, so you must really congratulate their parents for working hard.
There are those people who have rich parents (Doctors, Investment Bankers, Lawyers), they go to the best schools, etc. But you have to think about how their parents became so successful. Their parents had to study and work hard to give their children the best opportunities in life. Every year, students from deprived areas such as Tower Hamlets are getting into medical schools, some are getting into top universities such as Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial/UCL for top subjects such as Economics, and they will have brilliant careers. They will give their children the best opportunities in life, so you must really congratulate their parents for working hard.
But your parents influence your work ethic and attitude to schooling. And just because someone comes from Tower Hamlets, doesn't mean they had a bad up-bringing. It's not money that means middle-class parents tend to have more academically successful children - you can't buy work ethic and intelligence. It's just a correlation, so while middle-class parents are more likely to inculcate a strong work ethic and positive approach to schooling than working-class pupils. When you combine this with the society they live in, these effects are multiplied - it's difficult to see how working hard at school will influence you when the biggest names in the local area are drug dealers rather than doctors and lawyers.
So basically, the statement 'your upbringing has a massive impact upon your later success' is not mutually exclusive with 'some people from poor backgrounds become successful'.
Neither is that statement deterministic. Your parents may have a huge influence on you, but that doesn't mean they completely determine your fate.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by Moosferatu
Yes it does heavily influence your achievements. Your opportunities and particularly mindset (unconscious and conscious) influenced by the setting in which you grow up. Life is a series of lucky chances. Saying that however, it is not an excuse for people to achieve below what they are capable of. Ultimately though, you cannot fault people for trying their best and not achieving things, as corny as it sounds. Despite what some absolute retards think on this forum, life needs its losers as well as its winners. You cannot be a winner without first having losers to compare yourself to and feel good about not being, if you have that sort of mindset.
Totally agree with you.
It can be incredibly difficult to break out of multi-generational rhythms of behaviour and circumstance and more often than not you need a bit of help and guidance from a third party along the way. It's by no means impossible though. If you really want to be one of life's 'winners' then you have to ask yourself - is this the only way to be happy? And more to the point 'Are they really happy?'. Sometimes the most seemingly secure people can be having extreme inner turmoil that no one would ever know about.
(edited 10 years ago)
It has a large influence, yes, but as the old cliché goes, the rest is up to you.
I'm quite happy in my community I find that people here are open, friendly and generous. Sometimes the middle classes can become quite annoying with their aspirations but on the whole even they are nice people to be around. This differs to where I grew up where there was a lot of snobby behavior about who got into grammar school and who's friends went to public school but I think I would be happy back there just to be part of a thriving community. If you're happy being working class with a family and a secure job then fair enough. If you have middle class aspirations so long as you choose a business within the scope of your class fine. Most middle class aspirations are fulfilled by safe careers and so on. As long as you're not working class and want to work in the NYSE I'm sure you'll be fine. This point of view probably comes with age when you begin to become more realistic about your dreams - though there is always the one in a million who comes from a working class background and makes it onto the floor of the NYSE for most of us it is just a dream.
(edited 10 years ago)
It has a strong, sometimes impenetrably powerful impact on your -but I don't believe it decides it for us.
What decides your fate is not your circumstances, but what you do about it. I'm not saying trying means you'll definitely get out of a crappy situation, but if you have a considerably bigger chance of getting out if you do try.
or if you receive a golden ticket from a creepy factory owner and inherit a lifetime's supply of chocolate and menacing little orange men, damn you Charlie Bucket...
What decides your fate is not your circumstances, but what you do about it. I'm not saying trying means you'll definitely get out of a crappy situation, but if you have a considerably bigger chance of getting out if you do try.
or if you receive a golden ticket from a creepy factory owner and inherit a lifetime's supply of chocolate and menacing little orange men, damn you Charlie Bucket...
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