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Jeremy Corbyn's intellectual credentials... or lack of. Watch

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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    Alternatively you can be an Eton boy, descended from King William IV via a long line of bankers to the monarchy.
    Are you seriously suggesting that his admission to Oxford had nothing to with his grades at Eton? Even if that was the case, he still graduated with a first from Oxford, and with extremely high praises from his lecturers which are well recorded. You simply cannot pretend that David Cameron is not a very intelligent man.
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    Are you seriously suggesting that his admission to Oxford had nothing to with his grades at Eton? Even if that was the case, he still graduated with a first from Oxford, and with extremely high praises from his lecturers which are well recorded. You simply cannot pretend that David Cameron is not a very intelligent man.
    You need to read this: http://www.spectator.co.uk/2014/09/the-politics-of-ppe/

    Read it properly.

    Then have a think.

    In particular pay attention to:

    Above all, the flightiness of PPE encourages puppeteer politicians, who stand above their society pulling the strings, rather than men and women who represent solid interests within it.
    Cameron=puppeteer politician who stands above society pulling strings
    Corbyn=man who represents solid interests within society (arguably, runs away from Torys :getmecoat:)
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    (Original post by hollywoodbudgie)
    This might not apply to Corbyn, but your general statement reeks of snottiness.
    My mum is from a middle-class family, my dad from a working-class one. I went to a state school, and am now at Cardiff University, and am hoping to go to the University of Birmingham next year. Happy?
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    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    You need to read this: http://www.spectator.co.uk/2014/09/the-politics-of-ppe/

    Read it properly.

    Then have a think.
    The article presents an interesting theory, linking the "flittiness" of the PPE degree with political practice. However, the article really provides very little to support the veracity of this theory, besides the author's own assertion.


    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    Cameron=puppeteer politician who stands above society pulling strings
    Corbyn=man who represents solid interests within society (arguably, runs away from Torys )
    Would you care to explain how exactly that's supposed to stump me?



    You seem to be under the impression that I am an ardent advocate of David Cameron, which I can assure you I am not. I have never asserted in this thread that Cameron is a better political leader than Corbyn, and if I have implied so that is my unintentional mistake. I have asserted, and will continue to do so, that their respective academic careers does indisputably indicate that Cameron is cleverer than Corbyn.

    As I have said multiple times throughout this thread, I think that this fact provides an interesting subject of discussion, in relation to its influence on their political appeal. And that, and its wider ramifications, concerning the importance of intelligence as an attractive trait in any political figure, is supposed to be the primary discussion of this thread.
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    The article presents an interesting theory, linking the "flittiness" of the PPE degree with political practice. However, the article really provides very little to support the veracity of this theory, besides the author's own assertion.
    The author studied PPE at Oxford. You haven't really provided anything to support the veracity of your theory besides your own opinions.


    Would you care to explain how exactly that's supposed to stump me?
    It's meant to demonstrate that the extent of Cameron's education is no real reflection on how to govern a society which is inherently so complex and requires understanding of a whole range of people.

    You seem to be under the impression that I am an ardent advocate of David Cameron, which I can assure you I am not. I have never asserted in this thread that Cameron is a better political leader than Corbyn, and if I have implied so that is my unintentional mistake. I have asserted, and will continue to do so, that their respective academic careers does indisputably indicate that Cameron is cleverer than Corbyn.
    Okay thanks for clarifying. Their respective academic careers do indicate that but I am really unclear of the relevance, especially in light of that article. Cameron's academic education has taught him a lot of stuff, he's clearly good at doing well in exams and is high functioning but that doesn't make him at the baseline more 'intelligent' or 'clever'. Yes, academic results and university prestige etc. are society's way of representing intelligence, but social and emotional intelligence are also incredibly important, especially in politics. Politicians need to empathise with and understand the reality of people who live within the society they are governing. The torys demonstrate their lack of understanding (or lack of caring) on this time and time again. Look at what they are doing to junior doctors, for example.


    As I have said multiple times throughout this thread, I think that this fact provides an interesting subject of discussion, in relation to its influence on their political appeal. And that, and its wider ramifications, concerning the importance of intelligence as an attractive trait in any political figure, is supposed to be the primary discussion of this thread.
    I don't think that Cameron's particular type of education is important in a political figure. But what he does have is a sort of charisma and he knows how to be a puppeteer politician which people can get swayed by. But I think Corbyn is really challenging all of that and even if he isn't the perfect alternative right now, he's sure holding a mirror up and importantly, making debates like this happen right now.

    Also thanks for reading the link. I respect that.
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    their respective academic careers does indisputably indicate that Cameron is cleverer than Corbyn.
    Intelligence =/= academic record
    There are many different types and facets of intelligence.
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    Are you seriously suggesting that his admission to Oxford had nothing to with his grades at Eton? Even if that was the case, he still graduated with a first from Oxford, and with extremely high praises from his lecturers which are well recorded. You simply cannot pretend that David Cameron is not a very intelligent man.
    No but it can't have hurt can it?
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    My mum is from a middle-class family, my dad from a working-class one. I went to a state school, and am now at Cardiff University, and am hoping to go to the University of Birmingham next year. Happy?
    That is my background to a tee, yet I recognise that I am more like the boy in the comic - except obviously I didn't turn into a Tory who can't see past the end of his own nose...
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    (Original post by 13 1 20 8 42)
    Intelligence =/= academic record
    There are many different types and facets of intelligence.
    Basically what I said but the concise version. Thanks. Can you follow me around TSR and do that more often?
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    Although I despise Corbyn, the fact that he dropped out from LMU and still became someone would make him more sympathetic to my eyes than an old Etonian that has been favoured in life since his birth.

    I have a lot of respect for self-made men, and I also dropped out from a polytechnics college - but managed to get an offer for a PhD at Oxford in the end. We shouldn't judge someone on the university he attended, but on his ideas/accomplishments. In the case of Corbyn, it's easy enough to deride him on the latter point; there's no need to use personal attack.
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    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    Basically what I said but the concise version. Thanks. Can you follow me around TSR and do that more often?
    That's a first, usually I overcomplicate simple points. I am sure you would get tired of that eventually. :laugh:
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    (Original post by Josb)
    Although I despise Corbyn, the fact that he dropped out from LMU and still became someone would make him more sympathetic to my eyes than an old Etonian that has been favoured in life since his birth.

    I have a lot of respect for self-made men, and I also dropped out from a polytechnics college - but managed to get an offer for a PhD at Oxford in the end. We shouldn't judge someone on the university he attended, but on his ideas/accomplishments. In the case of Corbyn, it's easy enough to deride him on the latter point; there's no need to use personal attack.
    What is happening. Another post that I completely agree with. I feel confused about you. Very very mixed feelings right now.

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    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    Okay thanks for clarifying. Their respective academic careers do indicate that but I am really unclear of the relevance, especially in light of that article. His academic education has taught him a lot of stuff yeah, and he's clearly good at doing well in exams and is high functioning but that doesn't make him at the baseline more 'intelligent' or 'clever'. Yes, academic results and university prestige etc. are society's way of representing intelligence, but social and emotional intelligence are also incredibly important, especially in politics. Politicians need to empathise with and understand the reality of people who live within the society they are governing. The torys demonstrate their lack of understanding (or lack of caring) on this time and time again. Look at what they are doing to junior doctors, for example.
    It's even simpler than that. I always got top grades - although, I will concede, I went to uni a step down from Oxbridge. But, even with a long-standing interest in politics into the bargain, I don't have the faintest glimmer of an idea how to run a country, or anything else for that matter, and absolutely no experience of real life. That's what matters.

    At least Corbyn has been working for the unions, representing the interests of normal people. Whose interests, other than his own, has Cameron ever attempted to represent?

    And when has he ever demonstrated any more competence in the real world than Corbyn? Even with his education, he couldn't get a job outside the walls of Millbank Tower without Samantha's mum fixing him up with something.

    Btw it matters little even if Tories do care or empathise. They have been funded by the City and by rentiers of various sorts. And they must act in the interests of their clients as far as possible.
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    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    What is happening. Another post that I completely agree with. I feel confused about you. Very very mixed feelings right now.
    Spoiler:
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    those 10 gems look nice, hope you never forget who got you those
    You despise Corbyn too?

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    If it wasn't you, it would have been the guy who repped 10 seconds after you.
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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    It's even simpler than that. I always got top grades - although, I will concede, I went to uni a step down from Oxbridge. But, even with a long-standing interest in politics into the bargain, I don't have the faintest glimmer of an idea how to run a country, or anything else for that matter, and absolutely no experience of real life. That's what matters.

    At least Corbyn has been working for the unions, representing the interests of normal people. Whose interests, other than his own, has Cameron ever attempted to represent?

    And when has he ever demonstrated any more competence in the real world than Corbyn? Even with his education, he couldn't get a job outside the walls of Millbank Tower without Samantha's mum fixing him up with something.

    Btw it matters little even if Tories do care or empathise. They have been funded by the City and by rentiers of various sorts. And they must act in the interests of their clients as far as possible.
    You do know that you're preaching to the converted right now don't you?!
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    I do think that DC is probably more intelligent than JC. I do prefer more intelligent people but it's not necessarily a factor in who I choose to vote for. And there are different types of intelligence.


    (Original post by Josb)
    You despise Corbyn too?
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    She's a Corbyn fanboy
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    (Original post by Thaladan)
    Are you seriously suggesting that his admission to Oxford had nothing to with his grades at Eton? Even if that was the case, he still graduated with a first from Oxford, and with extremely high praises from his lecturers which are well recorded. You simply cannot pretend that David Cameron is not a very intelligent man.
    So? Why should I care? Plato was intelligent. He also thought women had less teeth than men.
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    (Original post by Josb)
    You despise Corbyn too?

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    (Original post by Kvothe the arcane)

    She's a Corbyn fanboy


    He purposely did that to wind me up. He's getting under my skin with this good cop bad cop routine.

    I don't despise him (Corbyn) nor am I a 'fanboy'.

    I don't really align with party politics on the whole because it stops you from thinking independently. But my independent thinking does align with the left wing. Doesn't make me a leftie or a Corbyn fanboy. It just makes me a person who has ideas and principles.
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    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    You do know that you're preaching to the converted right now don't you?!
    Absolutely, you're Corbs I'm McDonnell let's tag team these Tory *******s
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    So? Why should I care? Plato was intelligent. He also thought women had less teeth than men.
    The point of this thread is for people to reveal whether you think intelligence is important.
    (Original post by Ethereal World)
    He purposely did that to wind me up. He's getting under my skin with this good cop bad cop routine.I don't despise him (Corbyn) nor am I a 'fanboy'.I don't really align with party politics on the whole because it stops you from thinking independently. But my independent thinking does align with the left wing. Doesn't make me a leftie or a Corbyn fanboy. It just makes me a person who has ideas and principles.
    I see. I'm somewhat left leaning.
 
 
 
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