Safer out of the EU!

If we are out of the Schengen Zone as it is, plus that little issue of us being an island, why does being out of the EU politically protect us from terrorist attacks?

It doesn't. It makes no difference.

Reply 4

Original post by Ethereal World

If we are out of the Schengen Zone as it is, plus that little issue of us being an island, why does being out of the EU politically protect us from terrorist attacks?

It doesn't. It makes no difference.

Because they would argue (well they wouldnt because they arent too bright) it puts a stop to the free movement of people from the single market and our obligations under EU law. It makes it more difficult for EU citizens to travel to the UK.

The actual argument seems to be based on withdrawing from the ECHR.

Reply 5

username1899909

21

Original post by Ethereal World

If we are out of the Schengen Zone as it is, plus that little issue of us being an island, why does being out of the EU politically protect us from terrorist attacks?

It doesn't. It makes no difference.

It certainly helps being an Island but don't forget that for example " Migrants " can sneek into the back of lorries bound to the UK and suddenly a bunch of " Migrants' or sometimes suspect terrorists are running around Kent eueo tunnel causing chaos .... Like yesterday.

Reply 6

Original post by 999tigger

Because they would argue (well they wouldnt because they arent too bright) it puts a stop to the free movement of people from the single market and our obligations under EU law. It makes it more difficult for EU citizens to travel to the UK.

The actual argument seems to be based on withdrawing from the ECHR.

Original post by hazzer1998

It certainly helps being an Island but don't forget that for example " Migrants " can sneek into the back of lorries bound to the UK and suddenly a bunch of " Migrants' or sometimes suspect terrorists are running around Kent eueo tunnel causing chaos .... Like yesterday.

I understand this. This is about terrorist attacks though. I don't think Isis care about whether we are in the EU or not, and our homegrown terrorists certainly won't.

Reply 7

Original post by Sebastian Bartlett

After a number of terrorist attacks over the last couple of years both in the EU and surrounding countries the argument for being safer in the EU is clearly invalid.

Free movement of people is just making it too easy for Terrorists to strike all over Europe, only with stronger borders and control can we be safer in the UK.

Also the EU never stopped any wars it either stood by and let them happen or aided in their creation (Ukraine, Yugoslavia, Syria). Vote Leave for safety and national security.

Considering the terrorists were mostly homegrown to the nation they attacked, then U cant see how it would have stopped them.

We will never know how many wars the EU has stopped since one of its aims was to stop wars between members of the EU, which it has been very successful at. It wasnt designed as a militray force to engage in wars beyond its borders.

Afraid your arguments dont work. Try again.

Reply 8

Original post by hazzer1998

It certainly helps being an Island but don't forget that for example " Migrants " can sneek into the back of lorries bound to the UK and suddenly a bunch of " Migrants' or sometimes suspect terrorists are running around Kent eueo tunnel causing chaos .... Like yesterday.

And what is being out of the EU going to change? This isn't a salty rhetorical question I'm just curious. How are we going to stop the sneaking into the back of lorries thing?

The only thing that would actually affect it is if we stopped any movement into this country at all via any means and from anywhere.

Reply 9

Original post by Ethereal World

I understand this. This is about terrorist attacks though. I don't think Isis care about whether we are in the EU or not, and our homegrown terrorists certainly won't.

The issue has cropped up again following he events in Brussels and an article written by a former head of MI6.
http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/opinions/brexit-would-not-damage-uk-security

Am sure ISIS dont care whether we are in or out.

His argument was based on being in control of borders and being less restrcited on human rights. I doubt the OP understands that.

Reply 10

slade p

4

Yes British people should vote to leave.

Reply 11

Fullofsurprises

20

British governments over the years have systematically cut the funds for customs and border security. At the same time, the volume of traffic between the UK and the continent has vastly increased. The result is that it is much easier than it used to be to enter by various routes, particularly hidden in lorries. The inevitable result is greatly increased illegal immigration. That part won't be affected just by leaving the EU. Given the climate of cuts, it's also very unlikely that an 'independent' UK would change any of it. Boris may rant about leaving, but do you ever hear him advocating the tax increases needed to increased spending on border protection?

Schengen is probably going to effectively cease anyway, also regardless of our membership.

Reply 12

Original post by 999tigger

The issue has cropped up again following he events in Brussels and an article written by a former head of MI6.
http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/opinions/brexit-would-not-damage-uk-security

Am sure ISIS dont care whether we are in or out.

His argument was based on being in control of borders and being less restrcited on human rights. I doubt the OP understands that.

What will change about the way our borders are controlled that would stop terrorists entering as 'legitimate' people or hiding in lorries ? Are we going to check every lorry?

Furthermore I understand the rationale politically and also for integration purposes but my contention is that it won't affect the likelihood, frequency or severity of terrorist attacks by ISIS or other manifestations of extremism.

Terror attacks like the ones in Brussels and Paris aren't really a viable reason for endorsing Brexit they are just convenient fodder for the leave campaign.

We should be focusing on the real reasons for brexit or about how to make the EU influence less anal and restrictive.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 13

Andy98

20

Original post by Sebastian Bartlett

After a number of terrorist attacks over the last couple of years both in the EU and surrounding countries the argument for being safer in the EU is clearly invalid.

Free movement of people is just making it too easy for Terrorists to strike all over Europe, only with stronger borders and control can we be safer in the UK.

Also the EU never stopped any wars it either stood by and let them happen or aided in their creation (Ukraine, Yugoslavia, Syria). Vote Leave for safety and national security.

Only safe when you're dead is what I say

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 14

TaintedLight

20

What you all need to advocate is for a more vigorous vetting process for the cohort of Syrian refugees and a crackdown of local extremists who may or not be citizens of the U.K

Brexit is just a smokescreen. Illegal immigration will flourish as long as people are determined and palms can be greased.

Reply 15

Original post by Ethereal World

What will change about the way our borders are controlled that would stop terrorists entering as 'legitimate' people or hiding in lorries ? Are we going to check every lorry?

Furthermore I understand the rationale politically and also for integration purposes but my contention is that it won't affect the likelihood, frequency or severity of terrorist attacks by ISIS or other manifestations of extremism.

Terror attacks like the ones in Brussels and Paris aren't really a viable reason for endorsing Brexit they are just convenient fodder for the leave campaign.

We should be focusing on the real reasons for brexit or about how to make the EU influence less anal and restrictive.

More physical checks.
More discretion to turn back

I agree it wont stop them smuggling people in or cultivating homegrown terrorists. All this anti EU stiff is what appeals to the Brexit, sovereignty, the commonwelath etc are all what appeals to the Brexit people. Its the same on all forums.

Reply 16

Original post by 999tigger

More physical checks.
More discretion to turn back

I agree it wont stop them smuggling people in or cultivating homegrown terrorists. All this anti EU stiff is what appeals to the Brexit, sovereignty, the commonwelath etc are all what appeals to the Brexit people. Its the same on all forums.

Yes that will alleviate problems with immigration but not terrorism.

Reply 17

sdotd

17

These terrorists have been travelling across the EU due to free movement of people

Reply 18

Original post by Ethereal World

Yes that will alleviate problems with immigration but not terrorism.

Well the idea of having more people on borders and doing physical checks against all EU citizens appeals to them. They believe theres an army of terrorists from the EU and also from the recent migrants.

I do wish they would look at the actual causes and seek to get on with addressing the issues, but hey ho.

Reply 19