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Why do most women hate feminism in dating/relationships? watch

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    Most women still want a guy who is taller than them, older, more sexually experienced, confident, assertive and other qualities associated with typical masculinity. They also expect the men to ask out, plan dates (preferably pay for dates), call back, initiate sex, propose etc. Also what is traditionally expected from men. They are not looking for an equal but for someone who is in charge and dominates them. When married most women want to stay at home or work part time. Sweden, the bastion of feminism, has one of the highest percentages of women working part time in the world and a high gender wage gap. All other countries that are deemed as most gender equal have very similar outcomes.

    I can't remember how many times I've seen women ask things like : Why didn't he ask me out, he kept looking at me? Is he interested? Why hasn't he proposed yet? Why didn't he make a move when we were in bed together? Why didn't he call back? So I ask the same question : why? Why aren't most women eager to adopt feminism into their private lives after 3 waves of it? After all, you never see any of them say they reject having the right to vote, equal pay or education.
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    (Original post by Anunaki)
    Most women still want a guy who is taller than them, older, more sexually experienced, confident, assertive and other qualities associated with typical masculinity. They also expect the men to ask out, plan dates (preferably pay for dates), call back, initiate sex, propose etc. Also what is traditionally expected from men. They are not looking for an equal but for someone who is in charge and dominates them. When married most women want to stay at home or work part time. Sweden, the bastion of feminism, has one of the highest percentages of women working part time in the world and a high gender wage gap. All other countries that are deemed as most gender equal have very similar outcomes.

    I can't remember how many times I've seen women ask things like : Why didn't he ask me out, he kept looking at me? Is he interested? Why hasn't he proposed yet? Why didn't he make a move when we were in bed together? Why didn't he call back? So I ask the same question : why? Why aren't most women eager to adopt feminism into their private lives after 3 waves of it? After all, you never see any of them say they reject having the right to vote, equal pay or education.
    Right to vote, equal pay, education etc. are very much life changing opportunities for women. I'm guessing some people just see the whole "man makes the first move" thing as a matter of etiquette (or perhaps the result of some kind of deeply engrained socialisation?) or perhaps because women still don't have much confidence.

    I would underline here that feminism is about freedom of choice. Just because all these new doors are suddenly open to you doesn't mean you're obliged to go through them.
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Right to vote, equal pay, education etc. are very much life changing opportunities for women. I'm guessing some people just see the whole "man makes the first move" thing as a matter of etiquette (or perhaps the result of some kind of deeply engrained socialisation?) or perhaps because women still don't have much confidence.

    I would underline here that feminism is about freedom of choice. Just because all these new doors are suddenly open to you doesn't mean you're obliged to go through them.
    This. Feminism is about giving people of all genders choices over their lives.

    I don't know any women who would wait to be asked out.
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Right to vote, equal pay, education etc. are very much life changing opportunities for women. I'm guessing some people just see the whole "man makes the first move" thing as a matter of etiquette (or perhaps the result of some kind of deeply engrained socialisation?) or perhaps because women still don't have much confidence.

    I would underline here that feminism is about freedom of choice. Just because all these new doors are suddenly open to you doesn't mean you're obliged to go through them.
    Suddenly? It's been over 50 years. And women have taken over well paid professions like medicine or law. The current educational gap is now at 60/40 in favour of female students and going up every year. Women under 40 now make more money than men of the same age (it only applied to women under 30 barely a couple of years ago). So you can see how strong the trends are. But little has changed in what women expect from men in relationships and it's not just initial contact but everything else I mentioned. So why ? Why has so little changed in the relationships scene if it's all socialisation? Socialisation also said women can't be doctors or get a degree? Barely two generations have passed and women have taken over wherever they wanted to take over, they certainly weren't shy about that. So why are they so ''shy'' about equality in relationships when they went from 0 to 100 faster than a Veyron in all these other areas?
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Right to vote, equal pay, education etc. are very much life changing opportunities for women. I'm guessing some people just see the whole "man makes the first move" thing as a matter of etiquette (or perhaps the result of some kind of deeply engrained socialisation?) or perhaps because women still don't have much confidence.

    I would underline here that feminism is about freedom of choice. Just because all these new doors are suddenly open to you doesn't mean you're obliged to go through them.
    how does feminism and a law enforcing equal gender pay make any sense when women themselves overall still expect men to pay for their dates, marriage, etc? doesn't this at least appear like hypocrisy?
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    What angers me is that women's choices to be paet time working housewives maintains the headline gender wage gap which morons quote (even though women who entered tbe workforce after ~1990 are paid better than men). This means idiotic affirmative action pressure that promotes incompetent women over competent men, ruining the management of our most important corporations.
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    (Original post by Anunaki)
    Suddenly? It's been over 50 years. And women have taken over well paid professions like medicine or law. The current educational gap is now at 60/40 in favour of female students and going up every year. Women under 40 now make more money than men of the same age (it only applied to women under 30 barely a couple of years ago). So you can see how strong the trends are. But little has changed in what women expect from men in relationships and it's not just initial contact but everything else I mentioned. So why ? Why has so little changed in the relationships scene if it's all socialisation? Socialisation also said women can't be doctors or get a degree? Barely two generations have passed and women have taken over wherever they wanted to take over, they certainly weren't shy about that. So why are they so ''shy'' about equality in relationships when they went from 0 to 100 faster than a Veyron in all these other areas?
    The media probably has some influence. After all, we still expose our kiddies to Disney cartoons, read them fairy tales and encourage little girls to play princesses. The pattern doesn't change as we get older; think of all those Mills and Boon novels, for instance.

    Perhaps we are sending out a subconscious message that you can be whatever you like and do whatever you want, but that you should be "feminine" at the same time. Women may be becoming doctors and lawyers, but girls are still encouraged to be passive, and, dare I say it, to await a prince who will rescue them.

    Of course this doesn't take into consideration factors such as culture, class or parental attitudes. Being a middle-class girl with relative freedom, I was actively encouraged by my parents to, "if you like that boy, ask him on a date."
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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    What angers me is that women's choices to be paet time working housewives maintains the headline gender wage gap which morons quote (even though women who entered tbe workforce after ~1990 are paid better than men). This means idiotic affirmative action pressure that promotes incompetent women over competent men, ruining the management of our most important corporations.
    Have you heard of the glass ceiling? How many women CEOs can you name?
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    (Original post by SmallTownGirl)
    This. Feminism is about giving people of all genders choices over their lives.

    I don't know any women who would wait to be asked out.
    So why do most women still make feminine choices in the most progressive places on Earth? Feminism was supposed to bring gender parity in everything since its Tabula rasa based theory claims men and women are exactly the same at birth and gender is simply an illusion created by patriarchy in order to oppress women? This also goes into other areas like the extremely poor results the most feminist countries when it comes to female STEM students, pay gaps and self-made millionaires.
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    but girls are still encouraged to be passive, and, dare I say it, to await a prince who will rescue them.
    I swear the only people who "encourage" women to be "passive" are girls/women themselves. isn't this a problem women themselves need to sort out?
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    The media probably has some influence. After all, we still expose our kiddies to Disney cartoons, read them fairy tales and encourage little girls to play princesses. The pattern doesn't change as we get older; think of all those Mills and Boon novels, for instance.

    Perhaps we are sending out a subconscious message that you can be whatever you like and do whatever you want, but that you should be "feminine" at the same time. Women may be becoming doctors and lawyers, but girls are still encouraged to be passive, and, dare I say it, to await a prince who will rescue them.

    Of course this doesn't take into consideration factors such as culture, class or parental attitudes. Being a middle-class girl with relative freedom, I was actively encouraged by my parents to, "if you like that boy, ask him on a date."
    Have you ever watched a nature documentary? Who is the chaser/dominant/aggressive gender 99.99% of the time? Or do humans exist in a sort of ethereal vacuum where DNA or natural instincts are completely inexistent?
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Have you heard of the glass ceiling? How many women CEOs can you name?
    the "glass ceiling" concept is a concept that was created by kate millet, a radical feminist. why should we take radical feminists, regarding gender-equality, seriously, when many feminists say "those aren't real feminists"? if there is a glass ceiling, it's more of a "glass screen of apathy" on the part of women who prefer not to work unsociable hours, take less holidays, take no maternity leave, take less part time work and more full time work, etc
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    (Original post by zippity.doodah)
    I swear the only people who "encourage" women to be "passive" are girls/women themselves. isn't this a problem women themselves need to sort out?
    There are different forms of encouragement. There's the belief that a girl should sit prettily and not be rough or noisy, playing with her dolls or with her toy oven.

    However, passivity is also encouraged through the media and sexualisation of women and through sexual harrassment on the street. I suppose a radical feminist might call this, "men putting women in their place." Whether it's true or not, it does reinforce the notion that the man chases the woman and that women and girls are objects onto which feelings are projected. Which I suppose would reinforce passivity.

    Even today women in the workplace are referred to, rather disparagingly, as "career women" and Thatcher was referred to as "the Iron Lady" - implying that being active and taking life by the horns is not a trait that should be associated with feminine behaviour.
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    (Original post by zippity.doodah)
    I swear the only people who "encourage" women to be "passive" are girls/women themselves. isn't this a problem women themselves need to sort out?
    An important fact you need to understand about women is they lie, about everything. Its in their nature, they lie to everyone and everything, including themselves which is why they talk about 'freedom of choice' yet despite this freedom are more unhappy then they've ever been, and most of them can't cut a career, they just become fat single mothers covered in tattoos complaining where all the good men have gone.

    You can't apply logic to the female mind because to them truth and facts are fluid, they change with the wind based on how their emotions feel at the time. It is pointless to debate with them on TSR because they will just say spout some lies of what sounds nice and socially acceptable and then go and do the completley opposite in the real world. You can only judge them by their actions, not words.
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Have you heard of the glass ceiling? How many women CEOs can you name?
    How many CEOs who entered the workforce after 1990 can you name?

    (I assume you also want women on oil rigs, picking up litter, doing roofing, unblocking sewers etc etc)
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    There are different forms of encouragement. There's the belief that a girl should sit prettily and not be rough or noisy, playing with her dolls or with her toy oven.

    However, passivity is also encouraged through the media and sexualisation of women and through sexual harrassment on the street. I suppose a radical feminist might call this, "men putting women in their place." Whether it's true or not, it does reinforce the notion that the man chases the woman and that women and girls are objects onto which feelings are projected. Which I suppose would reinforce passivity.

    Even today women in the workplace are referred to, rather disparagingly, as "career women" and Thatcher was referred to as "the Iron Lady" - implying that being active and taking life by the horns is not a trait that should be associated with feminine behaviour.
    This is a good example of feminine tosh, there is no real facts or knowledge in this post, its pure conjecture based around women having their cake then complaining when they eat it. Its pure nonsense.
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    There are different forms of encouragement. There's the belief that a girl should sit prettily and not be rough or noisy, playing with her dolls or with her toy oven.
    don't mothers buy their daughters those toys though? can you imagine a father being the one, out of the father and mother, to choose/influence the daughter's toys?

    However, passivity is also encouraged through the media and sexualisation of women and through sexual harrassment on the street. I suppose a radical feminist might call this, "men putting women in their place." Whether it's true or not, it does reinforce the notion that the man chases the woman and that women and girls are objects onto which feelings are projected. Which I suppose would reinforce passivity.
    again, I swear women sexualise themselves. consider this: "women's" magazines like HEAT, OKAY!, (etc), are all made by women, and for women. they say things like "check out *female celebrity*'s SEXY beach body!", or "listen to *female celebrity's* advice on sex!". women's magazines probably "sexualise" women more than "men's magazines" do. maybe women themselves, as a gender, should take charge and make "women's magazines" more about STEM, politics, society (etc). and, again, this "women are objects" concept, from germaine greer, is from a radical feminist - I thought radical feminists weren't *real* feminists to a lot of feminists when people bring these people up?

    Even today women in the workplace are referred to, rather disparagingly, as "career women" and Thatcher was referred to as "the Iron Lady" - implying that being active and taking life by the horns is not a trait that should be associated with feminine behaviour.
    you're talking about the late 1970s there. that was coming up to 40 years ago. there are almost half of the government's current cabinet that are women. also, notice that margaret thatcher wasn't a feminist yet she still got to the top without requiring the help of quotas or other such laws? why should women be led to believe that they need help when they cleary don't with MT being a prime example to the contrary?
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    The media probably has some influence. After all, we still expose our kiddies to Disney cartoons, read them fairy tales and encourage little girls to play princesses. The pattern doesn't change as we get older; think of all those Mills and Boon novels, for instance.

    Perhaps we are sending out a subconscious message that you can be whatever you like and do whatever you want, but that you should be "feminine" at the same time. Women may be becoming doctors and lawyers, but girls are still encouraged to be passive, and, dare I say it, to await a prince who will rescue them.

    Of course this doesn't take into consideration factors such as culture, class or parental attitudes. Being a middle-class girl with relative freedom, I was actively encouraged by my parents to, "if you like that boy, ask him on a date."
    Have you seen the women most girls see as role models these days? Beyonce, Rihanna, Kardashians and the sort... They are far more sexually aggressive than men. Rihanna dry humps guys from the crowd during live shows for **** sake. Have you ever watched ''Sex and the city''? Ever read a women's mag? Literally everything is telling young women to take control of their relationships/sex lives and be aggressive as ****. Forget Disney , we're not talking about 5 year olds. But since you mentioned it , have you noticed how even cartoons have extremely independent and fierce characters these days? Frozen, Brave, Shrek, you name it... long gone are the times of Ariel or Cinderella waiting for their prince to rescue them, they are kicking ass and taking names!

    So what it do? Why don't women act accordingly if is socialisation is the issue?
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    (Original post by AnnieGakusei)
    Have you heard of the glass ceiling? How many women CEOs can you name?

    this is just bull****. every single CEO worked their ass off to get to where they are.

    it is not about gender but about merits and skill. the fact that there are very little suggests that the sea of (female) potential candidates are either too idiotic or too impatient in their applications towards that.

    equality of opportunity is given to all members.

    equality of outcome should Never be given to all members; because it just denies men the same ability and is in fact sexist towards men.
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    (Original post by zippity.doodah)
    don't mothers buy their daughters those toys though? can you imagine a father being the one, out of the father and mother, to choose/influence the daughter's toys?



    again, I swear women sexualise themselves. consider this: "women's" magazines like HEAT, OKAY!, (etc), are all made by women, and for women. they say things like "check out *female celebrity*'s SEXY beach body!", or "listen to *female celebrity's* advice on sex!". women's magazines probably "sexualise" women more than "men's magazines" do. maybe women themselves, as a gender, should take charge and make "women's magazines" more about STEM, politics, society (etc). and, again, this "women are objects" concept, from germaine greer, is from a radical feminist - I thought radical feminists weren't *real* feminists to a lot of feminists when people bring these people up?



    you're talking about the late 1970s there. that was coming up to 40 years ago. there are almost half of the government's current cabinet that are women. also, notice that margaret thatcher wasn't a feminist yet she still got to the top without requiring the help of quotas or other such laws? why should women be led to believe that they need help when they cleary don't with MT being a prime example to the contrary?
    Women do not care about jobs, they never do physical labour, they only want to dominate politics so they can give advantages towards themselves. Thats what feminism is about.

    They also love being sexualised, the problem is most women lose their looks by 30 and get very bitter about it, so they complain about the sexualisation of younger prettier women who get all the attention. Its driven by pure jealousy.
 
 
 
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