The Student Room Group

We are all screwed

This is my little rant. Many current world leaders have very little interest in trying to fix or at least help the issue of climate change and possibility of mass extinction as a result of extreme weather and climate change. We as younger people and our possible descendants will have to pay for the mistakes of the corruption of those before us who currently have no interest but the prospect of turning a profit.
I shall give you also an example close to home. When the UK was deciding to leave/ remain in the EU the leave campaign made the claim that we send £350 000 000 to the EU every week and why don't we put in into the NHS. WHERE IS THAT MONEY NOW?!? False claims to get us to leave.
And SO many of them lie and i feel like i cant trust them and things are only getting worse. In a couple of years when i can vote i might as well flush it down the toilet as all of them say the same words in different orders in hopes of appearing different. We are in the messed up times. I am ready to just watch it all burn while I sit in what's left of the forests and laugh. Hehe.
That's why I don't always trust the government for now, Brexit was disgrace in my opinion.
Reply 2
Original post by Shrek2onDVD
This is my little rant. Many current world leaders have very little interest in trying to fix or at least help the issue of climate change and possibility of mass extinction as a result of extreme weather and climate change. We as younger people and our possible descendants will have to pay for the mistakes of the corruption of those before us who currently have no interest but the prospect of turning a profit.
I shall give you also an example close to home. When the UK was deciding to leave/ remain in the EU the leave campaign made the claim that we send £350 000 000 to the EU every week and why don't we put in into the NHS. WHERE IS THAT MONEY NOW?!? False claims to get us to leave.
And SO many of them lie and i feel like i cant trust them and things are only getting worse. In a couple of years when i can vote i might as well flush it down the toilet as all of them say the same words in different orders in hopes of appearing different. We are in the messed up times. I am ready to just watch it all burn while I sit in what's left of the forests and laugh. Hehe.

Okay, im not entirely sure how youve managed to link climate change to Brexit and the NHS but lets put that aside for now.
What exactly would you have the government do, given theyre not a magic genie and do not have the power (certainly shouldn't at any rate) to affect such change.
Equally, are you honestly in a good enough financial position to swallow the costs of becoming some green hippie paradise? After all, you benefit exponentially from the exploitation of the world and in particular fossil fuels and all that they give us. Be it your cheap(ish) power, drugs, plastics, next day delivery etc.
As one last thing though, do you honestly believe the world is about to become an uninhabitable waste land from running your v8 a bit too much? Its one of the key reasons people have started to rubbish young peoples claims on climate emergencies and so on. Preaching the death of us all despite no appreciable evidence to support that. Its one thing to have worse weather (or better, depending on your location anyway) its quite another to list the apocalypse as a real outcomne.
Reply 3
Original post by Shrek2onDVD
WHERE IS THAT MONEY NOW?!? False claims to get us to leave.

In the NHS with more money beside.

Turns out 350 000 000 a week isn't actually that much money are far as the NHS is concerned.
As one last thing though, do you honestly believe the world is about to become an uninhabitable waste land from running your v8 a bit too much? Its one of the key reasons people have started to rubbish young peoples claims on climate emergencies and so on. Preaching the death of us all despite no appreciable evidence to support that. Its one thing to have worse weather (or better, depending on your location anyway) its quite another to list the apocalypse as a real outcomne.

It doesn't help either when all the suggestions about climate change make our lives worse and cost more instead of having better efficient technological solutions when they can be applied.
Reply 5
Original post by TheStupidMoon
It doesn't help either when all the suggestions about climate change make our lives worse and cost more instead of having better efficient technological solutions when they can be applied.


Is that true though? I cycle rather than drive. I'm fitter and brighter at the start of the day and I save a fortune in petrol not to mention the fact it is quicker to cycle than drive. Win win win.

We have also invested in insulation, the cost saving of which have paid for the original work and we now save money.

We also eat locally sourced food if possible. More expensive but better quality and careful planning means we throw nothing away.

Not really sure I accept that things have to get worse. Just different.
(edited 8 months ago)
Reply 6
Original post by hotpud
Is that true though? I cycle rather than drive. I'm fitter and brighter at the start of the day and I save a fortune in petrol not to mention the fact it is quicker to cycle than drive. Win win win.

We have also invested in insulation, the cost saving of which have paid for the original work and we now save money.

We also eat locally sourced food if possible. More expensive but better quality and careful planning means we throw nothing away.

Not really sure I accept that things have to get worse. Just different.

They don’t have to get worse, although try telling me cycling isn’t worse than my nice comfy cars when its 2c and raining heavy, but the kind of things we, and by we I mean governments, focus on today are more about optics than any meaningful attempt to save the world and that’s the major problem.
Reply 7
Original post by Djtoodles
They don’t have to get worse, although try telling me cycling isn’t worse than my nice comfy cars when its 2c and raining heavy, but the kind of things we, and by we I mean governments, focus on today are more about optics than any meaningful attempt to save the world and that’s the major problem.

Quite agree on the cycling in the rain. But for me, making big changes is about lots of people doing little things. So if everyone who could (which is probably most people) cycled / walked / public transported to work / school once a week, that would make a massive difference and those who drove 4/5 times a week would face no traffic whatsoever because there would be a reduction in traffic and pollution by 20%.

I also think it is a bit disingenuous to suggest governments are doing nothing. True, we haven't had a functioning government for the last 7 or 8 years now, but prior to that, and no doubt when the next government comes in, much was being done and still is. 20 years ago, the majority of our energy came from coal, gas and nuclear. Now at least half comes from wind. We have also seen creeping legislation that has required houses and cars to be built to better standards and of course don't forget consumer power. People are choosing to buy more locally produced / ethically produced products. I note for example that ASOS, the home of fast fashion is seeing its share price freefall whilst Vinted, the home of second hand clothes seems to be able to do no wrong.
Reply 8
Original post by hotpud
Quite agree on the cycling in the rain. But for me, making big changes is about lots of people doing little things. So if everyone who could (which is probably most people) cycled / walked / public transported to work / school once a week, that would make a massive difference and those who drove 4/5 times a week would face no traffic whatsoever because there would be a reduction in traffic and pollution by 20%.

I also think it is a bit disingenuous to suggest governments are doing nothing. True, we haven't had a functioning government for the last 7 or 8 years now, but prior to that, and no doubt when the next government comes in, much was being done and still is. 20 years ago, the majority of our energy came from coal, gas and nuclear. Now at least half comes from wind. We have also seen creeping legislation that has required houses and cars to be built to better standards and of course don't forget consumer power. People are choosing to buy more locally produced / ethically produced products. I note for example that ASOS, the home of fast fashion is seeing its share price freefall whilst Vinted, the home of second hand clothes seems to be able to do no wrong.

It’s all a problem of sustainability and feasibility. Yeah, we could reduce emissions by a lot if we all walked everywhere but the car is king for a reason, it’s the best, it’s the most convenient, its progress. Don’t get me wrong if everyone else decided to bike, walk or bus I would be ecstatic since I would have the best drives ever but I wouldn’t be joining you lol. To be clear I’m not some anti-environment crazy, my house is powered, pretty much fully, by my own solar energy for example but I’m not willing to discard progress in the pursuit of it, if anything my solar panels and batteries are progress since I haven’t had a power outage even when the rest of the area did.

Just to correct you I never said they were doing nothing, I said they focus on optics over results. Sometimes doing what’s best for optics aligns with what gives results. So, in the case of increasing renewable energy, that’s a good thing, its green and provides some measure of energy independence which is the more important imo. Providing it doesn’t destroy natural habitats etc I’m all for it. I’d just like to address your claim of 50% wind though, that’s just not accurate I’m afraid. Based on data from National Grid, ONS and the Gov Renewable accounts for around 35-40% of our total energy generation, and this includes biomass, “zero-carbon” accounts for around 55-60%, which includes nuclear. To keep this as short as I can I won’t go into everything but a simple way to look at it is, outside of the push for EV’s which really isn’t a long-term sustainable idea when you look into it, all “western”, for lack of a better term, governments have done is shift where on the planet the “bad stuff” comes out of, they haven’t reduced it. We have as a nation, but that’s because all the really dirty stuff we just get from some country that doesn’t care and you can see this in how global emissions are rising year on year. It’s a game of virtue signalling which isn’t really helping the planet, and it’s not good for our nations in the long term.
Reply 9
Original post by Djtoodles
It’s all a problem of sustainability and feasibility. Yeah, we could reduce emissions by a lot if we all walked everywhere but the car is king for a reason, it’s the best, it’s the most convenient, its progress. Don’t get me wrong if everyone else decided to bike, walk or bus I would be ecstatic since I would have the best drives ever but I wouldn’t be joining you lol. To be clear I’m not some anti-environment crazy, my house is powered, pretty much fully, by my own solar energy for example but I’m not willing to discard progress in the pursuit of it, if anything my solar panels and batteries are progress since I haven’t had a power outage even when the rest of the area did.

Just to correct you I never said they were doing nothing, I said they focus on optics over results. Sometimes doing what’s best for optics aligns with what gives results. So, in the case of increasing renewable energy, that’s a good thing, its green and provides some measure of energy independence which is the more important imo. Providing it doesn’t destroy natural habitats etc I’m all for it. I’d just like to address your claim of 50% wind though, that’s just not accurate I’m afraid. Based on data from National Grid, ONS and the Gov Renewable accounts for around 35-40% of our total energy generation, and this includes biomass, “zero-carbon” accounts for around 55-60%, which includes nuclear. To keep this as short as I can I won’t go into everything but a simple way to look at it is, outside of the push for EV’s which really isn’t a long-term sustainable idea when you look into it, all “western”, for lack of a better term, governments have done is shift where on the planet the “bad stuff” comes out of, they haven’t reduced it. We have as a nation, but that’s because all the really dirty stuff we just get from some country that doesn’t care and you can see this in how global emissions are rising year on year. It’s a game of virtue signalling which isn’t really helping the planet, and it’s not good for our nations in the long term.


Exactly.
EX30 Ultra ftw.
Original post by Quady
Exactly.
EX30 Ultra ftw.


I’m really interested in a Polestar 3 myself, but it’s sort of a Volvo. Ill keep an EV along with my other ICE vehicles, at least until E-fuels get online properly and we can get back to proper effective vehicles again.
Reply 11
Original post by Djtoodles
It’s all a problem of sustainability and feasibility. Yeah, we could reduce emissions by a lot if we all walked everywhere but the car is king for a reason, it’s the best, it’s the most convenient, its progress.


It is not the best. At least in an inner city sense anyway. It isn't the best because it isn't the quickest form of transport around the city. It also creates pollution which impacts negatively on people's health and it also creates an environment (roads) which impact negatively on people's wellbeing. So when you say the best, please qualify what you mean by best. I cycle 10 miles into work once a week and it is way faster than driving. In second place is getting the train and in last place is driving and even then I ditch the car 1 mile before my destination and cycle the remaining distance because it takes 5 minutes to cycle or 20 minutes to drive that last mile.

I am not advocating that everyone gives up their cars and starts walking and cycling. Not even slightly. But I am saying that people should think carefully about the journeys they make. My local shop is a 10 minute walk away yet the number of people who lazily drive there is shocking. There is absolutely no need whatsoever. Modern life doesn't have to be so hectic that we can't even walk to the shop any more.

If a good functioning society is measured by happiness rather than wealth and status, I would suggest that the car is way down the list of things that make people happy. When was the last time you drove into a major town or city, parked up and said to yourself, "That was a thoroughly enjoyable experience. I must do that again." Because that is what I do say to myself every time I cycle in.
(edited 8 months ago)
Original post by hotpud
"That was a thoroughly enjoyable experience. I must do that again." Because that is what I do say to myself every time I cycle in.

Maybe your a masochist. :lol:
Reply 13
Original post by TheStupidMoon
Maybe your a masochist. :lol:

Nah - I love exercise. It makes me feel good. I appreciate the same isn't true of everyone. My wife takes no pleasure from exercise.
Reply 14
Original post by Djtoodles
They don’t have to get worse, although try telling me cycling isn’t worse than my nice comfy cars when its 2c and raining heavy, but the kind of things we, and by we I mean governments, focus on today are more about optics than any meaningful attempt to save the world and that’s the major problem.


For all the gripes about UK weather - the amount of days where it's actually raining heavily during a commute in winter are surprisingly small. I cycle the 8 miles to work + 8 miles back in London 4-5 days a week, all year. There's only a handful of days a year that the weather's seriously grim, and otherwise... low temperatures are easily dealt with via basic winter jacket, gloves and overshoes (they all help massively with rain too), the bike's comfy to ride and I get plenty of time to sit in a chair at work anyway, relaxing or invigorating depending on whether I push the pace, the quickest way for me to get to work, by far the cheapest way to get to work, Then your factor in it saves even more time because you rack up 5ish hours of exercise a week that you'd otherwise need to find time for.

Finally... it's just fun being outside, feeling the breeze run past your face, fresh air etc... Various academic surveys showing people cycling or walking to work have a higher than average commute satisfaction

Cars are useful sure, but using them for everything has been a major contributer to the shorter, unhealthier and inactive lifestyles many of the population currently lead - which *isn't* progress.
Original post by hotpud
Nah - I love exercise. It makes me feel good. I appreciate the same isn't true of everyone. My wife takes no pleasure from exercise.

Most bikes are rubbish and so are the roads and can't be considered a replacement to a car and they **** everyone else off. My eco suggestion would be a one or two seater vehicle that ran on renewables.

Original post by AMac86
Finally... it's just fun being outside, feeling the breeze run past your face, fresh air etc...

You would get that on a scooter or motorcycle.

p.s proper bicycles are also expensive and the poorest don't even benefit from the tax dodging cycle to work scheme.
Reply 16
Bike tech is pretty basic at the end of the day and even a relatively cheap basic hybrid (the sort of bike you could pick up second hand for c£100) would be all you need for commutes/utility cycling etc... An expensive road bike is only worth an extra 2-3mph over a hybrid - that's the sort of difference that makes less than 5 minutes on a 20-30 min commute.

Yes there'd be excitement on a motorcycle or scooter too (I have a motorcycle license but not a motorcycle any more), but they're more expensive to buy, fuel, service, register, insure etc... My urban commute would be slower because I wouldn't be able to use cycle lanes or shared pathways to get to work & I'd lose the exercise too.

The cycle-to-work scheme isn't a tax dodge - it's a specific scheme set up under tax legislation to subsidize bicycles, because of the substantial health and wider benefits of increasing active travel.
Original post by AMac86
Bike tech is pretty basic at the end of the day and even a relatively cheap basic hybrid (the sort of bike you could pick up second hand for c£100) would be all you need for commutes/utility cycling etc... An expensive road bike is only worth an extra 2-3mph over a hybrid - that's the sort of difference that makes less than 5 minutes on a 20-30 min commute.


Road bikes are ironically bad for the road due to their poor posture which also harms being able to see all the traffic easily and crap roads.No suspension,poor luggage options and the other popular bikes aren't much better unless you are traveling short distances.



Yes there'd be excitement on a motorcycle or scooter too (I have a motorcycle license but not a motorcycle any more), but they're more expensive to buy, fuel, service, register, insure etc... My urban commute would be slower because I wouldn't be able to use cycle lanes or shared pathways to get to work & I'd lose the exercise too.


Most of the extra costs are caused by the government when it comes to cheaper scooters or getting a licence. You could get a moped for pedal exercise.



The cycle-to-work scheme isn't a tax dodge - it's a specific scheme set up under tax legislation to subsidize bicycles, because of the substantial health and wider benefits of increasing active travel.


It's bad because it targets those who can afford a new bike easily while students for example have to pay extra tax.

Anyway the argument was a better replacement vehicle instead of cars.
(edited 8 months ago)
Reply 18
This hasn't been my experience, or really of any of my friends or numerous colleagues that cycle to work.

Road bikes aren't difficult to use on the road - visibility is as good as if you were walking and much clearer and less obstructed than if you were in a motor vehicle. You'd only have an issue with posture if you had a very inflexible neck or back (to the point of it being a serious medical life issue generally) and there are lots of options for more relaxed geometry (eg: touring bikes). Some roads are bumpier than others sure, but suspension is only really needed if you're going properly off road on trails - if you're on a particularly bumpy road you just rest your weight lightly on the saddle for that section and it's fine.

There are lots of luggage options - plenty of road bikes and almost all hybrids come with mounting points for a pannier rack, or you can fit a bike trailer can be fitted to almost any bike in about 10 seconds. Most of this time this isn't necessary though - I just use a medium size backpack for commuting and errands, or a large hiking backpack if I was doing a larger grocery shop.

Mopeds don't give you any exercise, you sit in/on a seat just like a motorcycle or car. Buying, fueling and servicing are all extra costs I'd have to pay regardless of how governments license motor vehicles - and I can't think of any comparable country that's made a success of delicensing cars or motorcycles - the regulations that exist here are a pretty vital necessity for public safety.

Plenty of people use the scheme who can't afford a bicycle easily - I used it in my first job early on to get a nicely specced bike I could commute daily on when I had a very tight budget, no savings and debt to service.
Reply 19
Original post by TheStupidMoon
Most bikes are rubbish and so are the roads and can't be considered a replacement to a car and they **** everyone else off. My eco suggestion would be a one or two seater vehicle that ran on renewables.


You would get that on a scooter or motorcycle.

p.s proper bicycles are also expensive and the poorest don't even benefit from the tax dodging cycle to work scheme.

My road bike was £400 off eBay. Best bike I ever owned and recycled which is even better. Every little helps.

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