Labour members: who will you vote for leader?

As I said, people just accept what the Mail, Sun, etc tell them.

I didn't see a complex debate. Labour didn't know what it wanted on Brexit. The LibDems were dead against it, as were the Nats in Scotland, while the Conservatives nailed their colours to the Brexit mast.

Most Labour MPs didn't want Corbyn to be PM, and nobody else did either unless they were the sort that always buy the Labour brand even when it stops doing what it says on the tin. Fortunately there weren't enough of those to trouble Boris and he got a thumping majority. It means Brexit will happen but at least Marxism and its consequent confiscation of assets won't.

The debate involved Tory austerity, Brexit, public services and many more issues.

Well, if you think that then the Labour Party has a lot of problems to solve. You do realise that there could not have been an election if Labour had not agreed to hold one? There is an aphorism about turkeys voting for Christmas that seems very apposite.

Z-hog is a far right conspiracy theorist (I.e. fully paid up Q-ultist) who thinks that there will be no support for centre-left politics and so that RLB would mean another Tory win, which - unless he is a billionaire - he is naive enough to believe is in his best interests

What do you mean?

I'll have to admit I didn't really mean it, can I remind everybody else that everything you're saying is exactly what was said about Corbyn? That he represented the kiss of death for Labour and that he didn't stand a chance? Well, that outside ranker representing the loony left went on to generate a takeover of the party and may well have lost the election but take away the Brexit factor and it would have been a closer run. A close shave, more like.

Not only that, he was a hit with the kids and we can see it well in this forum. The loony left drag the tone away from anything cerebral and turn everything into an emotional affair in the absence of any better alternatives but it bluddy well works with their teachers in the classrooms and the helping hand of the Blairites at the BBC. RLB would probably be the best at it, therefore not necessarily my preferred choice.

The funny thing with the anti-Corbyn rhetoric is that they love the left so much they want to get rid of him.

If Corbyn was an ineffective and useless opponent, why don't you keep him and win the next 3 election cycles?

Of course, they wont because Corbyn exposes them and shows the nation a different picture.

Who's they?



Who's you?



Who's they again?

The Tories and the billionaire-owned media.

Oh, I see. But look, it's not for them to keep him and even if they tried... his resignation would be too much of an obstacle.

Labour is a great proponent of cancerous identity politics. That's a fact. His cabinet had a number of self-confessed marxists, racists and idiots. That's a fact. His economic policies, such as nationalising broadband, energy, increase trade unions etc. have already been tried and tested prior to the 70s and failed. That's a fact. You don't need media to tell you that.

Yeah, forget what I said about reading the Mail and the Sun. You're just high.

There's another way to look at this: which of those (and entourage) is better equipped to go sit at an international conference with other world leaders, were they ever thrust into number 10? Which one would we like to go out there and represent the country without wetting him (or her) self?

It would have to be Starmer, he's the only one with some experience of dealing with a mountain of paperwork. The 'danger' he represents is that he may drag the party back to the centre and therefore not necessarily the preferred choice from the enemy.

Starmer is responsible for creating the policy (second referendum) that costed plenty of seats while Bailey created the popular policies

Bailey created the popular policies

On another thread, someone aptly stated that anyone perceived to be left of Blair is deemed too left. Ed Miliband was even called ‘Red Ed’ and deemed too far left.

That's because the overton window in this country is well and truly broken by how far right Blair dragged the left, and how much further right the right has been dragged. By that metric Corbyn is far left, but in reality Corbyns manifesto would have simply taken us towards a level of public infrastructure marginally lower than that of countries like France. To suggest he is actually far left, rather than this country just being absurdly far right, is to suggest there's little ideological difference between him, thinking capitalist systems can work given the right oversight, and myself, who thinks that the only way to properly stop climate change is with guillotines because the rich are fundamentally the enemies of humanity.