Admin Sec & Medical Support Officer
Hi, I have got the info from the AFCO but does anyone have any other info on these branches. I have seen that there is loads of other really useful info on some of the other branch. Anything would be of help. Thanks
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I had ad(sec) as my forst choice, then when I got my letter asking me to go to OASC at the start of Nov they said that they wouldn't be recruiting for that until tax year commencing 2007. Bummer. Then, when at the final review at OASC at the end of Nov, they said that if that was what I really wanted to do, they'd encourage me to put it down. When I spoke to the OC at the AFCO today I asked him about this and he said that they had initially decided it was closed, but then a had a review and went back on this. Whether that means they only have 2 vacancies or 20, I don't know, but I'd guess not many, cos I didn't get in and I'm great afterall!!! (joke!)
Crazy Kat
Training scheduals, promotion times, anything really that will help in my filter interveiw.
Cheers. My email address is karenwickham@btinternet if that is easier.
Cheers. My email address is karenwickham@btinternet if that is easier.
Trg - IOT obviously then the Admin Secretarial Officers Course (ASOC) at Southwick Park, approx 14 weeks long and gives you a broad overview of the different elements of the branch and prepares you for your first job.
Jobs - First Tour likely to be a Stn Adjt or OC General Duties Flt - basically you are the gash shag who gets all the crappy jobs in Admin Wg. Compile duty rosters, responsible for Discip, compile routine orders, organise parades/ceremonial/stn visits.
Subsequent Tours - OC P1 - This is the law side of the RAF, using Queens Regs and Manual Air Force Law. Advise on orderly room procedures, discipline matters, administrative casework (Redress of Complaint, Administrative Warnings). Good job and can be very busy depending on which unit you are at. Still very much a Junior Junior officer job
OC Works Flt - all of the property management aspects of the Stn ie bricks and mortar. Depending on the size of the unit can be the busiest but not necessarily the most high profile job in Admin Wg for a Jnr Off. This role also has an Out of Area responsibility in Tactical Property Management (Afghanistan, Basrah)
OC Personnel Services Flt - in simple terms Human Resource Management. Can be responsible for P1 depending on the size of the unit. PSF has a direct operational role in the Deployed Admin Group (DAG= a smallish formation of adminers that managed personnel matters on operations, establish at all deployed RAF bases).
OC Accounts Flt - As it says. All manner of accounting for the unit, but not the unit Biudget which is normally looked after by the Stn Budget Mgr.
Other jobs -
IOT Flt Cdr - approx 5 Admin(Sec) posts at IOT.
Aide de Camp (ADC), ie a personal slave to a 1* plus (very high profile and can get you promoted quicker than most, but generally you have to be a blond dolly bird to get this job, having said that I have done it and I am not blond or female!!). Worthwhile and rewarding but it depends on your principal!!
Staff Job - either in Property Mgt at the RAF Infrastructure Organisation (located at RAF Benson) or an A1 (Admin) staff job at HQSTC (either in A1 Ops or in Personnel Casework) or at HQPTC (Personnel Casework). These are the main 2 but there are others.
Recruiting - You will have seen one at the AFCO and at OASC. No need to say more.
Out of Area - a must for all Jnr Officers - either in A1 (personnel), Property management or media ops are the main 3. You have a few bizarre ones (I did a short detachment with the Cdo Bde as their J1 person).
Career Profile - a normal profile would have at least 2 or 3 stn jobs (GD Flt, P1, PSF, Accts or Wks) a staff job and an out of branch job (ADC, IOT Recruiting) plus preferably an out of area attachment.
Tour lengths from 12 months to 2 years (first tour likely to be 12-14 months). Most out of Area are 4 months long.
Time promotion from Fg Off - Flt Lt (normally 3-4 years although you may lucky enough to get Acting Flt Lt). You will be considered for promotion to Sqn Ldr after your 3rd substantive year as a Flt Lt. Promotion to Sqn Ldr vaires between 3 - 10 years, average is 6 years!!
Probably missed a few things but feel free to ask away.
Just to add at some point you will do your Junior Officers Command Course - 3 weeks of learning how to be a Flt Cdr with some Air Power blah thrown in. For Adminers the course is a bit of a waste of time as far as content goes, but it does allow you to get on with and discuss some things with the master race. This latter aspect I found very useful.
You will also have to complete Individual Staff Studies, which is an 18 month writing course (learning service writing conventions). To be honest a bit of a balls ache but a hurdle you have to jump through.
In terms of professional training - there are pre-employment courses for Accounts, Personnel and Works Services run at the Sec Trg school. There is also the DAG course for those going out of area in an A1/J1 job.
You will also have to complete Individual Staff Studies, which is an 18 month writing course (learning service writing conventions). To be honest a bit of a balls ache but a hurdle you have to jump through.
In terms of professional training - there are pre-employment courses for Accounts, Personnel and Works Services run at the Sec Trg school. There is also the DAG course for those going out of area in an A1/J1 job.
For info - there are 32 training places up for grabs for Admin Sec officers for the forthcoming training year. However, the bulk will be taken up by personnel already in the system who have had to wait due to the introduction of JPA and the move of Sec Trg School from Halton to Southwick Park.
In terms of recruiting PMA advise that the branch will be open again in March.
In terms of recruiting PMA advise that the branch will be open again in March.
TomD
For info - there are 32 training places up for grabs for Admin Sec officers for the forthcoming training year. However, the bulk will be taken up by personnel already in the system who have had to wait due to the introduction of JPA and the move of Sec Trg School from Halton to Southwick Park.
In terms of recruiting PMA advise that the branch will be open again in March.
In terms of recruiting PMA advise that the branch will be open again in March.
Thanks for the info Tom - some very valuable posts there!
Sorry to bring up an old thread... but can i get some more info on the MSO side?
My first choice is WSOp(Cmn), with my second choice being MSO. I believe i know the 'ins and outs' of WSOp now, however, i know absolutely sod all about MSO.
After IOT, where is the training done and how long does it last? Where are the likely places you will be posted?
Also, i am currently doing the equivalent job of MSO in an NHS psychiatric hospital. I understand the RAF also has psych docs/nurses. As an MSO, would you be looking after both A&E and Psych docs, or could you be placed in a psych-only environment?
Anything else you could tell me about this branch would be grand.
My first choice is WSOp(Cmn), with my second choice being MSO. I believe i know the 'ins and outs' of WSOp now, however, i know absolutely sod all about MSO.
After IOT, where is the training done and how long does it last? Where are the likely places you will be posted?
Also, i am currently doing the equivalent job of MSO in an NHS psychiatric hospital. I understand the RAF also has psych docs/nurses. As an MSO, would you be looking after both A&E and Psych docs, or could you be placed in a psych-only environment?
Anything else you could tell me about this branch would be grand.
MSO is a pretty small and specialist branch and I doubt that you will get much advice from a generalist site like this, unless we have an MSO lurking. Your best bet is to try and approach a medical unit directly and ask your questions and see if you can jack up a visit either directly, via an AFCO or even via your NHS contacts.
As far as I know, MSOs are an integral part of almost every medical set up, so you can anticipate a lot of deployments, and a lot of changes of post. They will not only be embedded within units dealing with A&E (eg Field Hospitals) and Psych (various units around the country), but also remedial (eg Headley Court), general practice (ie every Stn Med Centre), policy development (in Air Command), career management (rumoured to occur in Air Command!) and on Tac Med Wing (RAF Lyneham, dealing with the logistics of aeromedical evacuation).
Make sure that you present your choices in a rational and informed light at OASC. Whilst you can suggest a preference for WSOp (Cmn) you will be posted according to your aptitudes and the Service needs at the time, so you have to be prepared to take up any of the WSOp options. Also, be prepared to justify a first choice NCA trade and a second choice Officer branch - not an easy justification to make imo.
As far as I know, MSOs are an integral part of almost every medical set up, so you can anticipate a lot of deployments, and a lot of changes of post. They will not only be embedded within units dealing with A&E (eg Field Hospitals) and Psych (various units around the country), but also remedial (eg Headley Court), general practice (ie every Stn Med Centre), policy development (in Air Command), career management (rumoured to occur in Air Command!) and on Tac Med Wing (RAF Lyneham, dealing with the logistics of aeromedical evacuation).
Make sure that you present your choices in a rational and informed light at OASC. Whilst you can suggest a preference for WSOp (Cmn) you will be posted according to your aptitudes and the Service needs at the time, so you have to be prepared to take up any of the WSOp options. Also, be prepared to justify a first choice NCA trade and a second choice Officer branch - not an easy justification to make imo.
All
I am a Senior RAF Medical Support Officer - a Direct Entrant from University - and can answer any queries you have on the Branch. A brief resume follows:
BRANCH STRUCTURE
RAF MSOs are a fairly rare breed. The Branch has had a fairly odd structure which is now evening out. We are led by 3 Gp Capts - at present this is the senior rank that an RAF MSO can attain. The Branch also encompasses all the Commissioned Medical Technical Branches (Environmental Health, Radiography etc), and personnel from these branches can move across to the main stream MSO branch. In total the MSO Branch (encompassing Med Tech) should be approaching 100 personnel. The RAF MSO is a multi-tooled specialist who has a range of skills in adminstration, logistics, operations and governance.
TRAINING
RAF MSOs complete IOT. At the present time the Initial Medical Support Officer Course is under significant review - I believe it is hoped that an iteration of the new course will run in the new year. Initial training for new entrant MSOs (in the form of a specific course) has not been good over the years and a concerted effort is now being made to get it right.
The other 'initial' courses all new entrant MSOs should complete are:
Aeromedical Evacuation Ground Phase
3 weeks long, run at HQ Tactical Medical Wing RAF Lyneham. At present this is an attendance course for MSOs. It provides an overview of Aeromedical Evacuation.
Operational Induction Course
2 weeks long, run at HQ Tactical Medical Wing RAF Lyneham. Is designed to enhance the skills of the individual in field living and provides specific to role training.
Other courses are job dependent.
POSTS
A number of areas where MSOs could be posted (incomplete):
AIR HQ - RAF High Wycombe. A multitude of posts covering such areas as operations, logistics, governance, training, administration and policy. The MSO rank range is from Fg Off to Wg Cdr. There are about 20 posts.
Defence Medical Services Department - London. 8 posts currently ranging from Sqn Ldr to Gp Capt. 1 Sqn Ldr is currently based in the USA.
Defence Medical Education & Training Agency - Fort Blockhouse, Gosport. 6 posts, Flt Lt - Gp Capt.
HQ Tactical Medical Wing - RAF Lyneham. The Wg is responsible for initial deployment of all RAF medical services personnel on operational or exercise deployment anywhere in the world. The Wg also provides strategic Aeromedical Evacuation, Critical Care in the Air Support Teams, Deployable Aeromedical Response Teams and training courses. The OC is a Wg Cdr, there is a Sqn Ldr post (OC Ops Spt (Trg) Sqn) and 5 Flt Lt posts (OC Logs Flt, OC Ops Flt, OC Ops Induction Trg, OC Training Stds and Coord and OC Management Plans).
No 4626 Sqn Royal Auxiliary Air Force - RAF Lyneham. 1 permanent post (Flt Lt) , 4 Reservists.
No 612 Sqn Royal Auxiliary Air Force - RAF Leuchars. 1 permanent post (Flt Lt), 1 full-time Reservist.
Defence Medical Rehabilitation Centre - Headley Court. 2 posts (1 x Flt Lt, 1 x Wg Cdr).
Defence Medical Services Training Centre - Keogh Barracks, Aldershot. 2 posts both Flt Lt.
Ministry of Defence Hospital Unit Peterborough - 3 x Flt Lt posts.
Ministry of Defence Hospital Unit Portsmouth - 1 post. Sqn Ldr.
RAF Centre for Aviation Medicine - RAF Henlow 5 posts (Fg Off - Sqn Ldr).
Department of Initial Officer Recruiting - RAF Cranwell. 2 posts (1 x Flt Lt, 1 x Sqn Ldr.
Medical & General Supplies Integrated Project Team - Andover. 4 posts (Flt Lt - Wg Cdr).
The branch maintains 1 Flt Lt/Sqn Ldr on External Training each year. There are a number of changes a foot which may see MSOs working alongside some Stn Medical Centres.
On Operations we deploy as Ops Officers, WatchKeepers, Medical Advisors and Adjutants of Medical Units. Medical Support Officers support the deploying medical force.
Please ask if you have any specific questions.
RAFMSO
I am a Senior RAF Medical Support Officer - a Direct Entrant from University - and can answer any queries you have on the Branch. A brief resume follows:
BRANCH STRUCTURE
RAF MSOs are a fairly rare breed. The Branch has had a fairly odd structure which is now evening out. We are led by 3 Gp Capts - at present this is the senior rank that an RAF MSO can attain. The Branch also encompasses all the Commissioned Medical Technical Branches (Environmental Health, Radiography etc), and personnel from these branches can move across to the main stream MSO branch. In total the MSO Branch (encompassing Med Tech) should be approaching 100 personnel. The RAF MSO is a multi-tooled specialist who has a range of skills in adminstration, logistics, operations and governance.
TRAINING
RAF MSOs complete IOT. At the present time the Initial Medical Support Officer Course is under significant review - I believe it is hoped that an iteration of the new course will run in the new year. Initial training for new entrant MSOs (in the form of a specific course) has not been good over the years and a concerted effort is now being made to get it right.
The other 'initial' courses all new entrant MSOs should complete are:
Aeromedical Evacuation Ground Phase
3 weeks long, run at HQ Tactical Medical Wing RAF Lyneham. At present this is an attendance course for MSOs. It provides an overview of Aeromedical Evacuation.
Operational Induction Course
2 weeks long, run at HQ Tactical Medical Wing RAF Lyneham. Is designed to enhance the skills of the individual in field living and provides specific to role training.
Other courses are job dependent.
POSTS
A number of areas where MSOs could be posted (incomplete):
AIR HQ - RAF High Wycombe. A multitude of posts covering such areas as operations, logistics, governance, training, administration and policy. The MSO rank range is from Fg Off to Wg Cdr. There are about 20 posts.
Defence Medical Services Department - London. 8 posts currently ranging from Sqn Ldr to Gp Capt. 1 Sqn Ldr is currently based in the USA.
Defence Medical Education & Training Agency - Fort Blockhouse, Gosport. 6 posts, Flt Lt - Gp Capt.
HQ Tactical Medical Wing - RAF Lyneham. The Wg is responsible for initial deployment of all RAF medical services personnel on operational or exercise deployment anywhere in the world. The Wg also provides strategic Aeromedical Evacuation, Critical Care in the Air Support Teams, Deployable Aeromedical Response Teams and training courses. The OC is a Wg Cdr, there is a Sqn Ldr post (OC Ops Spt (Trg) Sqn) and 5 Flt Lt posts (OC Logs Flt, OC Ops Flt, OC Ops Induction Trg, OC Training Stds and Coord and OC Management Plans).
No 4626 Sqn Royal Auxiliary Air Force - RAF Lyneham. 1 permanent post (Flt Lt) , 4 Reservists.
No 612 Sqn Royal Auxiliary Air Force - RAF Leuchars. 1 permanent post (Flt Lt), 1 full-time Reservist.
Defence Medical Rehabilitation Centre - Headley Court. 2 posts (1 x Flt Lt, 1 x Wg Cdr).
Defence Medical Services Training Centre - Keogh Barracks, Aldershot. 2 posts both Flt Lt.
Ministry of Defence Hospital Unit Peterborough - 3 x Flt Lt posts.
Ministry of Defence Hospital Unit Portsmouth - 1 post. Sqn Ldr.
RAF Centre for Aviation Medicine - RAF Henlow 5 posts (Fg Off - Sqn Ldr).
Department of Initial Officer Recruiting - RAF Cranwell. 2 posts (1 x Flt Lt, 1 x Sqn Ldr.
Medical & General Supplies Integrated Project Team - Andover. 4 posts (Flt Lt - Wg Cdr).
The branch maintains 1 Flt Lt/Sqn Ldr on External Training each year. There are a number of changes a foot which may see MSOs working alongside some Stn Medical Centres.
On Operations we deploy as Ops Officers, WatchKeepers, Medical Advisors and Adjutants of Medical Units. Medical Support Officers support the deploying medical force.
Please ask if you have any specific questions.
RAFMSO
Attached is the latest Careers Information PDF on MSO from the Department of Recruiting at RAF Cranwell.
RAFMSO
RAFMSO
Having recently applied for a commission as a Medical Support Officer would it be possible for you to update me on the latest with regards to the specialist training undertaken on successful completion of IOT.
Also can you tell me what 'MSO' training before this latest review consisted of?
I have been studying towards commissioned service for over 5 years, can you inform me as to when this branch first became available, as I don't recall seeing this option several years ago.
Your help is very much appreciated.
Rich
Also can you tell me what 'MSO' training before this latest review consisted of?
I have been studying towards commissioned service for over 5 years, can you inform me as to when this branch first became available, as I don't recall seeing this option several years ago.
Your help is very much appreciated.
Rich
The plan for initial MSO training is that all 'new' MSOs will complete the same IOT and then commence the IMSOC course (Initial MSO Course). I cannot recall the course length of the top of my head - I think it's 3 or 4 weeks. This is considerably shorter than specialist training for other branches. The course will look at providing the new MSO with the basics in a range of areas: Operations, Logistics, Training and Governance. The first course runs in early 2008 and the plan is to place currently commissioned MSOs on to it.
This latest 'review' of initial MSO training has been going on for more than 7 years. The reason is related to why you may not have heard of MSO before.... Up until 2000 the MSO Branch only recruited internally or required applicants to have a Health Care Management qualification. This meant that it was perceived that MSOs were coming to the branch with much of the grounding for the Branch already in place. Prior to this MSOs used to under take the Admin Sec training course - not ideal. The Branch was opened to Direct Entrants in 2000 but was not well advertised - and with the arrival of the DE it was recognised that a different approach to the training need was required.
The IMSOC has run once previously but was not well received. So it went back into the review pool. In the mean time MSOs have made do with completing the Aeromedical Evacuation Ground Phase course, an Operational Induction Course and job specific training. The new course is well over due and will be good for the Branch.
At the present time there is a great deal of work ongoing to look at the requirements of the Branch - it will make it a better place to be.
This latest 'review' of initial MSO training has been going on for more than 7 years. The reason is related to why you may not have heard of MSO before.... Up until 2000 the MSO Branch only recruited internally or required applicants to have a Health Care Management qualification. This meant that it was perceived that MSOs were coming to the branch with much of the grounding for the Branch already in place. Prior to this MSOs used to under take the Admin Sec training course - not ideal. The Branch was opened to Direct Entrants in 2000 but was not well advertised - and with the arrival of the DE it was recognised that a different approach to the training need was required.
The IMSOC has run once previously but was not well received. So it went back into the review pool. In the mean time MSOs have made do with completing the Aeromedical Evacuation Ground Phase course, an Operational Induction Course and job specific training. The new course is well over due and will be good for the Branch.
At the present time there is a great deal of work ongoing to look at the requirements of the Branch - it will make it a better place to be.
Hi, i have just put an application in again to become a Medical Support Officer, does anyone have details of this new MSo course after IOT ?? Also i wonder does anyone know what things are like in the RAF as a Radiographer ??? i am just about to qualify and i am going to put in application in with the RAF and the Army, has anyone any advise for the specialist branch interview???
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