Incels. Watch

londonmyst
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#41
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#41
(Original post by Wired_1800)
I still believe that there are female incels. Just because certain groups of men have hijacked a subculture does not mean that female incels don't exist.
Yes, there are plenty of lonely single people who have never had romantic relationships and crave them- women and men.
But most sane people would sooner wear a clown costume for the rest of their lives than start publicly identifying as incels.
All the lonely singles I know just say that they are single, single & looking for a relationship or virgins (if religiously inclined).
One very religious female friend is almost at her wits end, she believes in abstinence until marriage and is desperate to find a husband but insists upon restricting herself to equally religious guys that only read the same bible version and are less than six months older than her.
She is desperate but not desperate enough to label herself an incel.

The incel community now has a terrible reputation amongst most of mainstream society, does not welcome women and as a consequence the incel term is now inextricably tarnished by the prevalent popular culture association with toxic incels.
I think the original 'involuntary celibate' rhetoric was an accidental example of textbook identity politics based on lack of a sex life, hinting at an oppression narrative and a group identity revolving around victimhood and conspiracy theories to support claims of victimhood was predictable.
Though not the large scale of active self-professed incels.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by londonmyst)
Yes, there are plenty of lonely single people who have never had romantic relationships and crave them- women and men.
But most sane people would sooner wear a clown costume for the rest of their lives than start publicly identifying as incels.
All the lonely singles I know just say that they are single, single & looking for a relationship or virgins (if religiously inclined).
One very religious female friend is almost at her wits end, she believes in abstinence until marriage and is desperate to find a husband but insists upon restricting herself to equally religious guys that only read the same bible version and are less than six months older than her.
She is desperate but not desperate enough to label herself an incel.

The incel community now has a terrible reputation amongst most of mainstream society, does not welcome women and as a consequence the incel term is now inextricably tarnished by the prevalent popular culture association with toxic incels.
I think the original 'involuntary celibate' rhetoric was an accidental example of textbook identity politics based on lack of a sex life, hinting at an oppression narrative and a group identity revolving around victimhood and conspiracy theories to support claims of victimhood was predictable.
Though not the large scale of active self-professed incels.
Whether they label themselves incels or not, does not mean they are not incels. It is like a sexist person does not label themselves as sexist, even though they have sexist views. Your friend is also an incel because her celibacy is not by her choice but by the situation she has found herself with very limited options.

To your second point, i encourage you to step away from generalising large groups of people. Just because the emptiest drums have made the loudest noise, does not mean they are all the same. Frustrated men will do whatever they can to show their frustration.

Also, I want to point out again that sex is different for men and women. Many women abstain based on choice (like your friend) but many men abstain based on chance (like incels out there).
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londonmyst
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
Whether they label themselves incels or not, does not mean they are not incels. It is like a sexist person does not label themselves as sexist, even though they have sexist views. Your friend is also an incel because her celibacy is not by her choice but by the situation she has found herself with very limited options.

To your second point, i encourage you to step away from generalising large groups of people. Just because the emptiest drums have made the loudest noise, does not mean they are all the same. Frustrated men will do whatever they can to show their frustration.

Also, I want to point out again that sex is different for men and women. Many women abstain based on choice (like your friend) but many men abstain based on chance (like incels out there).

For several years I have researched both the incel movement and online manosphere communities in-depth, with a lot of analysis of their rhetoric and content.
I have seen the broad spectrum of behaviours present within online incel communities, I know that not all incels are the same.
For this reason I clearly differentiate between toxic incels and other incels, including in earlier posts on this thread.
I've met two incels face to face and have communicated with dozens online over the years.
I am not including the thousands of online incels that I did not directly communicate with.
Nor the hundreds of toxic incels that crossed the line into criminal conduct as they they waged an intimidation and online harassment campaign against my best friend for over two weeks.

According to incel standards and many self confessed male incels, my friend is a volcel (voluntary celibate).
This is because she has chosen not to be open to ons, fwb or any unofficial casual relationships and turns down all guys that don't fit her long list of requirements.
She had and continues to have plenty of options- she just won't facilitate any progress by changing her attitude or compromising on her deal-breakers.
Other female friends made different choices: choosing to have fun on tinder, hookup in clubs or have arranged marriages as teenagers- much to the dismay of all their parents except one.
The volcel term would also apply to a male in the same circumstances.
Many males have been expelled from incel groups for admitting that they are volcels or making forum postings about turning a willing woman down.

Many of the most horrid and loudmouthed sexist jerks (male & female) do label themselves as sexist, then start bragging about why being sexist is a positive thing.
On the manosphere quite a few sexists openly favour the 'sexist, proud and very loud' approach and embrace the sexist label.
I have also met a few women's liberation activists who are brazen enough to admit to other women that they are sexist.
Some radfems who state that they view misandry as a positive character attribute amongst women.
I doubt that they are lying to play a part, more like they really are habitually vicious conspiracy theorists and high on their own bigoted hate.

Identity politics and community membership is very much a personal preference to opt in, rather than opt out.
For example- I support northern ireland staying part of the uk but I will never label myself an ulster loyalist or unionist and have never joined/donated to any political parties that contain the word "unionist".
In the same way that being a member of the london feminist network, bnp or hurlingham club is a matter of chosen personal affiliation.
I am not suggesting that any incels are members or associated at all with the three examples above.
I have yet to interact with one incel that writes about being a feminist and have never encountered an incel whose comments could be construed as racially hostile or indicative of bigoted attitudes in relation to race.

TSR is filled with frustrated people in their teens and twenties.
Many of them making a regular supply of snarly posts about their lack of success on tinder, dating websites or in nightclubs.
Women whining that guys are not interested in them due to their weight or lack of bronzer/fake tan in their makeup routine.
Men abusing the caps lock feature to bemoan that they are being ignored by women due to their height, lack of biceps or in one case open political support for Mark Collett (the scumbag made notorious by his incessant yelling of race hate slogans such as "show the ethnics the door in 2004).
Even whilst accounting for individual sexual preferences related to attraction, the reality is usually more about an obnoxious personality or unrealistic attitudes.

I don't believe that sex is entirely different for men and women.
Unless it involves specific issues like sexual orientation preferences, contraceptive failure resulting in unplanned pregnancy or an appetite for violent bdsm.
The latter tends to fall under sexual incompatibility but in practice usually takes the form of the guy taking pleasure in doing consensual acts of violence to the woman.
I don't agree with the "MGTOW" attitude that seems to revolve around the notion that women all seek to dictate social relationships- as mothers, girlfriends or spouses.
Tyrannical authoritarians have lousy personalities and issue constant bullying demands- so most people are keen to keep their distance from them.
Men and women.
When horrible people improve their personalities or get more cunning about masking a bad personality, the situation changes and so does the outcome.
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Wired_1800
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#44
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(Original post by londonmyst)
For several years I have researched both the incel movement and online manosphere communities in-depth, with a lot of analysis of their rhetoric and content.
I have seen the broad spectrum of behaviours present within online incel communities, I know that not all incels are the same.
For this reason I clearly differentiate between toxic incels and other incels, including in earlier posts on this thread.
I've met two incels face to face and have communicated with dozens online over the years.
I am not including the thousands of online incels that I did not directly communicate with.
Nor the hundreds of toxic incels that crossed the line into criminal conduct as they they waged an intimidation and online harassment campaign against my best friend for over two weeks.

According to incel standards and many self confessed male incels, my friend is a volcel (voluntary celibate).
This is because she has chosen not to be open to ons, fwb or any unofficial casual relationships and turns down all guys that don't fit her long list of requirements.
She had and continues to have plenty of options- she just won't facilitate any progress by changing her attitude or compromising on her deal-breakers.
Other female friends made different choices: choosing to have fun on tinder, hookup in clubs or have arranged marriages as teenagers- much to the dismay of all their parents except one.
The volcel term would also apply to a male in the same circumstances.
Many males have been expelled from incel groups for admitting that they are volcels or making forum postings about turning a willing woman down.

Many of the most horrid and loudmouthed sexist jerks (male & female) do label themselves as sexist, then start bragging about why being sexist is a positive thing.
On the manosphere quite a few sexists openly favour the 'sexist, proud and very loud' approach and embrace the sexist label.
I have also met a few women's liberation activists who are brazen enough to admit to other women that they are sexist.
Some radfems who state that they view misandry as a positive character attribute amongst women.
I doubt that they are lying to play a part, more like they really are habitually vicious conspiracy theorists and high on their own bigoted hate.

Identity politics and community membership is very much a personal preference to opt in, rather than opt out.
For example- I support northern ireland staying part of the uk but I will never label myself an ulster loyalist or unionist and have never joined/donated to any political parties that contain the word "unionist".
In the same way that being a member of the london feminist network, bnp or hurlingham club is a matter of chosen personal affiliation.
I am not suggesting that any incels are members or associated at all with the three examples above.
I have yet to interact with one incel that writes about being a feminist and have never encountered an incel whose comments could be construed as racially hostile or indicative of bigoted attitudes in relation to race.

TSR is filled with frustrated people in their teens and twenties.
Many of them making a regular supply of snarly posts about their lack of success on tinder, dating websites or in nightclubs.
Women whining that guys are not interested in them due to their weight or lack of bronzer/fake tan in their makeup routine.
Men abusing the caps lock feature to bemoan that they are being ignored by women due to their height, lack of biceps or in one case open political support for Mark Collett (the scumbag made notorious by his incessant yelling of race hate slogans such as "show the ethnics the door in 2004).
Even whilst accounting for individual sexual preferences related to attraction, the reality is usually more about an obnoxious personality or unrealistic attitudes.

I don't believe that sex is entirely different for men and women.
Unless it involves specific issues like sexual orientation preferences, contraceptive failure resulting in unplanned pregnancy or an appetite for violent bdsm.
The latter tends to fall under sexual incompatibility but in practice usually takes the form of the guy taking pleasure in doing consensual acts of violence to the woman.
I don't agree with the "MGTOW" attitude that seems to revolve around the notion that women all seek to dictate social relationships- as mothers, girlfriends or spouses.
Tyrannical authoritarians have lousy personalities and issue constant bullying demands- so most people are keen to keep their distance from them.
Men and women.
When horrible people improve their personalities or get more cunning about masking a bad personality, the situation changes and so does the outcome.
I agree with your points.

I did not know there was something called voluntary celibacy. It is interesting to see there is a group with such strong will. Our generation are so OTT about sex that many people who don't engage in sex are generally labelled as unwanted. Hence why many young people appear to suffer from many mental health issues because those who they look to for social validation have rejected them.

I think the ‘volcels’ may be in the minority, as they probably do so because of strict religious or social needs, such as your friend. I do respect women who refuse to bend to pressure to engage in sexual relations, in order to meet the validation of their friends. I don't have issues with people who have sex as adults, as long as they are truly comfortable with that lifestyle and not using it to fill a gaping hole in their lives or trying to meet validations.

I think toxic incels are people who are sexually frustrated. This applies to men and women, but I understand men are more vocal about their “situation” than women. I still believe that obtaining sex is easier for an average woman than an average man.

I agree that TSR appears to be filled with many frustrated youth. I think it is the generational angst and the need to be validated. Apparently, I was told than many women regret their first time and would have waited until the “right” time. Young people are desperate to be accepted into social circles that they are vulnerable to the harsh demands dictated in today’s society.

Finally, i don't agree with your last paragraph. I think some women seek dominance in their relationships. Not in the same as men, but they do want to dictate social relationships. It is the reason why men are emasculated for having healthy relationships with their mothers, sisters or any other female that is not their girlfriends or wives.

Finally, I think involuntary celibacy is a very sad concept. The idea that someone wishes to have intimacy but unable to do so, is indeed an unfortunate tale.
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daizu
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#45
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Oh yeah my year has like three incels (legit white supremacists too) and even though it probably doesn’t help, everyone (including me) just makes fun of them and insults them to their face 🤷*♀️
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Obolinda
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AMAZING video!
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Wired_1800
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#47
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(Original post by Obolinda)
AMAZING video!
Sad how he insults groups of men and women struggling with their social lives.
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Obolinda
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Did you actually watch it?
it was sarcasm? To highlight the absurdity of some of the talking points said to incels.
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Sad how he insults groups of men and women struggling with their social lives.
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
Sad how he insults groups of men and women struggling with their social lives.
I have sympathy for people who can’t date. But if u choose to align yourself with incels, if u chose to call urself an incel, then I lose that sympathy. Because those groups are rife with hatred for women.
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FakeNewsEditor
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(Original post by Anonymous)
I have sympathy for people who can’t date. But if u choose to align yourself with incels, if u chose to call urself an incel, then I lose that sympathy. Because those groups are rife with hatred for women.
I also sympathise with undateables and I also kinda agree with this last part. I'm a guy so maybe I have more sympathy for them than girls would. But they need psychiatric help and if that doesn't change anything (their ideology is difficult to get rid of), they need to be sectioned 'cos some of them are dangerous.
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techguy010
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I moderate a community on a social media service and unfortunately there is a worrying amount of incels coming on it now, only seems to be getting worse. Obvs I try and help them, but most of them don't want to help themselves. Ban the ones who really start getting extreme.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by Anonymous)
I have sympathy for people who can’t date. But if u choose to align yourself with incels, if u chose to call urself an incel, then I lose that sympathy. Because those groups are rife with hatred for women.
Women can be incels as well. It is not a man-only group.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by Obolinda)
Did you actually watch it?
it was sarcasm? To highlight the absurdity of some of the talking points said to incels.
I actually did. He focused on male incels.
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Obolinda
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So, why do you think he's making fun of incels?
Yes, the incel "community" is commonly associated with being one consisting of mostly men.
(Original post by Wired_1800)
I actually did. He focused on male incels.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by Obolinda)
So, why do you think he's making fun of incels?
Yes, the incel "community" is commonly associated with being one consisting of mostly men.
Because the most vocal members are men does not mean that women don't suffer from being incels. You should watch the video again.
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Obolinda
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I agree about the gender bit. I've watched the video several time and have yet to see what is so insulting about it. It's a comedy video and is obviously over exaggerating.
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Because the most vocal members are men does not mean that women don't suffer from being incels. You should watch the video again.
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Allie4
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only online
youtube comment section seems to be full of them
i think they are mainly based in america (what a surprise - not!)
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Mark mein words
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Incels are best laughed at. You don't need to be very attractive to lose your virginity but some men just fail at it.
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Delusion6
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I'd feel sorry for them if they weren't complete and utter hypocrites. they hate women for rejecting them for the way they look despite the fact that - surprise suprise - they only want to date attractive women. even ugly guys don't want ugly girls. and they think that is ok. but not ok for girls to not want ugly guys.... irony.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by Obolinda)
I agree about the gender bit. I've watched the video several time and have yet to see what is so insulting about it. It's a comedy video and is obviously over exaggerating.
Ok
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