Leaving Islam/ telling my family I&#x27;m athiest?

Original post by Rat_Bag

So you admit it isn't a choice at all! Great turnaround there

No, its a choice because I see nothing in girls.

Reply 302

In life everyone makes choices. For instance I do my hair a certain way, wear what I want, eat what I like.

All these things are choices.

Reply 303

Original post by Muhammad Shehzar

I meant to say a book in Arabic. Allah chose his last book to be arabic bcz it is one of the most difficult language.. If u just know something about it.. Its grammar is the most difficult one, so Allah chose it for the people so that they cannot say it is wrong.

This is another unanswered question.

If Allah is sending down his final revelation, meant as required reading for all people and all times, why did he write it in a language that is so difficult to understand and impossible to translate effectively? Why not use a more versatile language, and a culture with an established tradition of written records?

Also, surely the best way of proving that the Quran is of divine origin is to put something in it that is unexplainable except by the supernatural - yet there is nothing.

A subjective claim of comparability is meaningless.
Who decides whether the passage is like the Quran?
It cannot be any Muslim because they have a vested interest in rejecting any claim. Simply by accepting any challenger means that they have disproved their own religion. It would never happen.
Likewise, it cannot be a non-Muslim because Muslims would simply disagree and claim that the judge was biased against Islam.
The "test" is impossible to judge and therefore is worthless as a test of divine origin.

Moreover, why is inimitability a sign of divine origin? There is much literature that cannot be matched in its various qualities. Does that mean that all those books were authored by god?

Like u cant believe that Quraan is correct.. how can we believe u that u have read a book better than Quraan.. We were also not present at the time when u read the books that u say were better than Quraan.. as u cant believe Quraan cz u were not present 1400 years ago..

Essentially, you are agreeing with my points above. You accept that such claims rely simply on the opinion or word of an individual or group.
This approach is fundamentally flawed and suffers from the unsophicticated logic apparent in much of the Quran and Islamic apologetics. People, as you do, simply agree with it because it appears to support their position, but you don't analyse it to see if it is logically coherent.

Reply 304

Original post by Blackstarr

No, its a choice because I see nothing in girls.

You choose to see nothing, or it comes naturally that you see nothing?

Reply 305

Original post by Blackstarr

No, I will never have sex with another woman as I don't think is right and whilst I may find some pretty I am not sexually attracted to them.

So you didn't choose to be straight, it's just the way you are.

Why does this not apply to gay people as well? Why just you?

but we should not forget those who were actually straight but now they are gay, this is a possibility that we can't deny.

Give some examples of people who were 100% straight and then chose to become gay.

You seem to be getting confused with your definitions.
I agree that people can choose to act upon their sexuality, but that sexuality is part of who they are, or as you would say, how god made them.

In order to invest in a sexual and emotional relationship with someone, there needs to be some sexual and emotional attraction. If that attraction is not there, you cannot choose to invent it.
It is a ridiculous and illogical idea.

Reply 306

Original post by Blackstarr

well, when I see people(friends and secondary groups) of the same sex as me and see nothing sexual in them.

So, if you had felt a sexual attraction to people of the same sex, you could have "decided" to be gay.

This is just question-begging circulsr logic.
Your are saying that you need to be attracted to the same sex, to be able to choose to be gay.
In other words, you need to be gay to be able to choose to be gay!

Reply 307

Cobalt_

21

Original post by Blackstarr

And what is this pic supposed to be.

I am entitled to have my own opinions.

Its not an opinion.
Its ignorance.

Reply 308

Original post by QE2

So, if you had felt a sexual attraction to people of the same sex, you could have "decided" to be gay.

This is just question-begging circulsr logic.
Your are saying that you need to be attracted to the same sex, to be able to choose to be gay.
In other words, you need to be gay to be able to choose to be gay!

Actually no, do you not see that most things that happen in life are because of the choices we make, whether good or bad.

The one only things in life that no one can make choice about is your ethnicity and whether your female or male.

People choose to be gay because they don't see themselves attracted to the opposite sex, its s choice, you are not born automatically gay, like there is no "gene" in any new born baby labelled as the "gay gene".

Edit: Excuse my spag(lol) was typing fast.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 309

Original post by Rat_Bag

You choose to see nothing, or it comes naturally that you see nothing?

It both tbh .

Reply 310

Original post by QE2

So you didn't choose to be straight, it's just the way you are.

Why does this not apply to gay people as well? Why just you?

Give some examples of people who were 100% straight and then chose to become gay.

You seem to be getting confused with your definitions.
I agree that people can choose to act upon their sexuality, but that sexuality is part of who they are, or as you would say, how god made them.

In order to invest in a sexual and emotional relationship with someone, there needs to be some sexual and emotional attraction. If that attraction is not there, you cannot choose to invent it.
It is a ridiculous and illogical idea.

You can chose to be attracted to anyone so, its a choice.

And I don't think I know someone who was 100% straight, we all question our sexuality sometimes however, those who are decisive are making choices.

All life is about choices, what is so hard to understand.

Reply 311

Original post by Cobalt_

Its not an opinion.
Its ignorance.

No, its not.

There is no gay gene assigned to anyone before their birth.

Reply 312

Betelgeuse-

19

Original post by Blackstarr

well, when I see people(friends and secondary groups) of the same sex as me and see nothing sexual in them.

Thats not you choosing to not be sexually attracted to them though is..just like you dont and didnt choose to be sexually attracted to the opposite sex. Puberty came along and nature takes its path

Reply 313

Original post by Betelgeuse-

Thats not you choosing to not be sexually attracted to them though is..just like you dont and didnt choose to be sexually attracted to the opposite sex. Puberty came along and nature takes its path

It is me choosing because I am a female and have the same sexual features as other females so, why should I be attracted to what I have? see, it makes no sense.

Reply 314

Original post by Blackstarr

It both tbh .

Really?

So when you see an attractive woman you are forcing yourself by choice not to feel attracted to her? Really?

Reply 315

Original post by Blackstarr

In life everyone makes choices. For instance I do my hair a certain way, wear what I want, eat what I like.

All these things are choices.

And some things are not choices, such as the natural colour of your hair and who you feel attracted to.

Reply 316

Betelgeuse-

19

Original post by Blackstarr

It is me choosing because I am a female and have the same sexual features as other females so, why should I be attracted to what I have? see, it makes no sense.

You choose your sexuality like you choose to be hungry. There never came a day when you decided "hmmm i think i might find that man sexually attractive".

Reply 317

Original post by Rat_Bag

Really?

So when you see an attractive woman you are forcing yourself by choice not to feel attracted to her? Really?

Attractive? I find no woman attractive, so, unless you mean pretty?

Reply 318

Original post by Blackstarr

Actually no, do you not see that most things that happen in life are because of the choices we make, whether good or bad.

The one only things in life that no one can make choice about is your ethnicity and whether your female or male.

So we choose whether to be left or right handed?
Tall or short?
Artistic or practical?
Violent or gentle?
Christian or atheist?
Healthy or sickly?

People choose to be gay because they don't see themselves attracted to the opposite sex, its s choice,

What makes them attracted to the opposite sex or not? Is that a choice?

you are not born automatically gay, like there is no "gene" in any new born baby labelled as the "gay gene".

The problem that you have here is that you are arguing from a position of belief. Homosexuality must be a sinful, lifestyle choice because god condemns it in the Bible. It is not a position based on evidence, just assertion.

Unfortunately (for your position), research has found that there are biological and genetic factors that affect our sexuality, as well as environmental. And the research has not stopped. You have basically staked all your theological chips on science never proving a link between biology and sexuality.
Good luck with that!
http://www.theguardian.com/science/blog/2015/jul/24/gay-genes-science-is-on-the-right-track-were-born-this-way-lets-deal-with-it

Reply 319